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Dassault Rafale

GDLlong

By GDLlong
in DCS Core Wish List

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GDLlong

GDLlong

Posted
Posted

I would very much like a production team to make Rafale fighter jets, especially the different models used by the French navy and air Force

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  • 1 month later...
jojyrocks

jojyrocks

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, Ashayar said:

A full fidelity Super Etendard could be great too...

We can all dream ❤️

 

 

Yes, Super Etendard would be much more doable than the Rafale which is quite new...

  • Like 1
Furiz

Furiz

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, jojyrocks said:

 

 

Yes, Super Etendard would be much more doable than the Rafale which is quite new...

If december 2000 is new to you... we are not talking about F4 version here ;D

upyr1

upyr1

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Furiz said:

If december 2000 is new to you... we are not talking about F4 version here ;D

The issue is what Dassault and the French Government say they can provide us. The Rafale would be a cool addition to DCS even if it is just AI. 

Furiz

Furiz

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, upyr1 said:

The issue is what Dassault and the French Government say they can provide us. The Rafale would be a cool addition to DCS even if it is just AI. 

Yes, even AI would be great start ;D

We could maybe get Marine F2 variant, but it is hard to find unclassified documentation or how the systems work. F1 variant is basically barebone and only AA, with no AG capabilities. To be on pair with f-16 or f-18 we would need F3 which is impossible I think. Or they would have to make franken Rafale then;P

Edited by Furiz
F-2

F-2

Posted
Posted
38 minutes ago, Furiz said:

Yes, even AI would be great start ;D

We could maybe get Marine F2 variant, but it is hard to find unclassified documentation or how the systems work. F1 variant is basically barebone and only AA, with no AG capabilities. To be on pair with f-16 or f-18 we would need F3 which is impossible I think. Or they would have to make franken Rafale then;P

 

If we can’t do a Rafale F2/F3 though it might not be a bad idea to do a Rafale F1 AND Super Etendard. One for ground and one for air cover.

Ashayar

Ashayar

Posted
Posted
16 hours ago, F-2 said:

If we can’t do a Rafale F2/F3 though it might not be a bad idea to do a Rafale F1 AND Super Etendard. One for ground and one for air cover.

That would be cool!

bies

bies

Posted
Posted (edited)

According to RAZBAM which has connections with French Air Force it is impossible to obtain information to make reasonably realistic Mirage 2000-5, which still half generation behind the oldest Rafale in terms of capabilities and data classification.

In short - even if someone would push to try to make the oldest Rafale it would be a fantasy module, having nothing in common with real aircraft, all flight performace, avionics logic, sensors, weapon systems - all would be made up fiction. Just like year 2006 F-22 Raptor. What is more, real life Rafale effectiveness depends in significant part on advanced Thales SPECTRA electronic warfare system, which is even more classified than the aircraft itself.

We may wait for ex-French pilot creating a DCS 3rd party (like Gero Finke did with EF) to try to make Rafale - but still, French military is more serious about their secrets than most of others. Especially now when the Europe ceased to be a peaceful place.

Edited by bies
F-2

F-2

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, bies said:

According to RAZBAM which has connections with French Air Force it is impossible to obtain information to make reasonably realistic Mirage 2000-5, which still half generation behind the oldest Rafale in terms of capabilities and data classification.

In short - even if someone would push to try to make the oldest Rafale it would be a fantasy module, having nothing in common with real aircraft, all flight performace, avionics logic, sensors, weapon systems - all would be made up fiction. Just like year 2006 F-22 Raptor. What is more real life Rafale effectiveness depends in significant part on advanced Thales SPECTRA electronic warfare system which is even more classified than the aircraft itself.

We may wait for ex-French pilot creating a DCS 3rd party (like Gero Finke did with EF) to try to make Rafale - but still, French military is more serious about their secrets than most of others. Especially now when the Europe ceased to a peaceful place.

 

I have a little data. Some of this isn’t an issue for the F1. Very bare bones A2A only. The ECM suite was simplified till the F2. I have some patents related to RBE2 and I have some specifications we can go by. We would need to do a full CFD and engine simulation for the flight model.

From F2 on the Rafale uses a new mission computer I have a white paper on

 

Quote

The MPDU was more than a 'simple mission computer', but was rather a full set of IMA-compliant avionics that replaces all the usual navigation, communicaton, display handling, and mission computer modules. Thus with the F2 upgrade all the Rafale avionics were replaced by software modules running on the MDPU.

The F1 does not use this

 

https://adsabs.harvard.edu/full/1996ESASP.375..111N

 

Note the F2 standard changed a lot and early version is much simpler then late

https://www.key.aero/forum/modern-military-aviation/97029-rafale-production-order-status?page=3

Quote

Rafale F2

The original plan envisaged that 33 air force and 15 naval F2 versions (total 48) would be ordered in the period 1997-2002). These were to have followed the 13 F1s that had been ordered up to 1996. These 48 F2s were to have been followed by orders for 15 F3 standard B/Cs per year from 2003. 

In 1997, the DGA (the French defence procurement agency), agreed a multiyear procurement of the 48 aircraft with Dassault, in return for a ten per cent cost reduction, but this was later suspended. 

In the event authorisation to order the first 13 Rafales (the 13 F1s) was eventually granted in May 1997. 

Plans for the first 10 air force Rafales to be rushed into service to equip an operational trials unit (which was also to be tasked with promoting exports)were soon abandoned. 

Funding for F2 development was granted on 31 December 1998; 

Eventually, the go-ahead for 48 F2 aircraft (including 20 options) was given on 14 January 1999, and this was confirmed on 21 December 2001. Some sources date order at 9 June 2001.

Initially, the 28 firm aircraft were to include ?? Rafale Bs, ?? Rafale Cs and 7 Rafale Ms, with an option for 20 more, including ?? Rafale Bs, ?? Rafale Cs and 8 Rafale Ms, giving a total of 33 Rafales for the AdlA and 15 for the Marine Nationale.

21st December 2001 The 20 options were switched to firm orders?

This was later changed to 32 AdlA aircraft and 16 Aeronavale aircraft, consisting of 25 Rafale B (B302-327), 7 Rafale C (C102-C108), and 16 Rafale M (M11-M26).

The first three Rafale F2s for French Air Force (indeed the first Rafales for the AdlA) were delivered to EC 5/330 Côte d'Argent at Mont-de-Marsan. This functioned as a conversion squadron though it was embedded within the CEAM trials establishment. 

No. 304 was delivered on 22 December 2004; No 305 on 28 December; and No. 303 on 29 December. The first AdlA single-seater (C102) was delivered on 3 June 2005.

The unit later formed the basis of EC 1/7 'Provence', which was declared operational at St Dizier on 27 June 2006 initially equipped with eight Rafale Bs and four Rafale Cs. 

The first four (Nos. 308 to 311) were transferred from Mont-de-Marsan on 20 April 2006. By 2007, EC 1/7 was fully equipped with five single-seat and 16 two-seat Rafales.

The first F2 standard Rafale M for the Aeronavale, M11, was delivered to the CEAM at Mont-de-Marsan on 19 May 2006.

The F2 standard was the first MULTI-ROLE standard for Rafale, and added ground attack capabilities to the air-to-air capabilities of the F1 standard. 

The F2 standard introduced the MICA IR air-to-air missile, and the OSF frontal sector optronics package (air to air and air to ground). It also introduced a new mission computer (the new MDPU - modular data processing unit), and Link 16 MIDS (according to Paringaux). The F2 could carry 2000 l tanks, and up to five 1250 l tanks (opposed to three on LF1/F1).

The MPDU was more than a 'simple mission computer', but was rather a full set of IMA-compliant avionics that replaces all the usual navigation, communicaton, display handling, and mission computer modules. Thus with the F2 upgrade all the Rafale avionics were replaced by software modules running on the MDPU.

There were two iterations of the F2 Standard. Early aircraft (how many? JAWA said: "first 20 in interim configuration...") were delivered to the F2.1 standard (qualified in December 2005), which lacked AASM capability and “Spectra self-defence capability” (according to Jane’s, though Scorpion says: "Full SPECTRA (hardware)". Presumably this means a limited or austere SPECTRA capability. 

Scorpion suggests that the F2.1 had M88-2E4 engines, and TRN.
That the RBE2 had DBS mapping, FTT, and AGR modes:
The F2.1 standard had an analogue integration of MICA IR.
Scalp-EG (carriage and simulated employment only!?)

The F2.2 Standard (qualified June 2006) introduced expanded capabilities – notably compatability with the AASM guided bomb and presumably some SPECTRA enhancements. 14 were expected to have been received by end of 2006.

Initially the F2.2 Standard Rafales had only air to air weapons. A six missile AAM fit with four EM MICA and two IR MICA was available from the end of 2007.

The F2 Rafale Ms were able to carry a buddy tanker pod, as previous Rafale Ms had done. 

The first drop of an AASM was made from Rafale C No. 101 at Cazaux on 26 July 2006. A service clearance followed on ????

Rafale B No. 302 had earlier been equipped with supplementary software to enable a demonstration of LGB capability (for the RoKAF) carrying out test separations of GBU-12 bombs in April 2000, followed by live drops in October 2000, but this had not been incorporated in the F2. 

Initial French Air Force Rafale weapon configurations incorporating the Scalp cruise missile, the Armament Air-Sol Modulair (AASM), and the GBU-12/B and GBU-22/B Laser-guided bombs were approved on 6 October 2006 for incorporation from January 2009. 

Jane’s described the “Primary attack fit of six 250 kg GBU-12 bombs beneath wings, plus Damocles designator pod (yet to be funded, as of 2006); one 1,000 kg GBU-24 on ventral hardpoint; or two SCALP ASMs, one under each wing.” F2 standard had the ability to carry two SCALP and four MICA missiles in conjunction with three 2,200-litre external tanks.

In the event, LGBs, MICA (?), AASM (?) and SCALP were integrated early (from February 2007) as urgent operational modifications, under programme Echo. This resulted in the F2+ standard?. Some Rafale Bs featured the Scarabee datalink.

On 7 March 2007, France dispatched three AdlA Rafales to Dushanbe, Tajikistan, for support of international operations over Afghanistan. They were joined by three Naval aircraft deployed to the theatre on Charles de Gaulle from 15 March to 16 April. Following their arrival on 12 March, the first Air Force operation was undertaken two days later.

The Rafale made its first live weapons drop on 28 March 2007, when an Aeronavale Rafale dropped two GBU-12 LGBs in support of Dutch troops. The first AdlA offensive Rafale mission followed on 1 April. By 25 May, the Navy flew 110 Rafale sorties and the Air Force had flown 92 sorties.

The F2 never had AM39 Exocet/ASMPA/Reco NG/Damocles capability.

47 surviving Rafale F2s were modified to F3 standard. (Rafale B B316 (113-HL) EC 01/007 ‘Provence’ had been lost in a fatal accident on 6 December 2007). The first two F2s to be converted to F3 standard were M11 and B307, which were completed in ****. The conversion process took 6-8 weeks per aircraft.

By July 2008 35 aircraft remained to be converted.

By July 2009 17 F2s remained to be converted.

I have this manual from a Rafale F2 flight simulator that was developed by a SME. This project was ended for copyright reasons, this will have to be resolved either by no using the name Rafale (like the M2000 and Razbam) or paying a license fee, as some FSX Rafale mods have chosen to do.

Manuel Rafale F2.pdf

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Furiz

Furiz

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, F-2 said:

 

Rafale F1 hud footage and brief cockpit shot

Nice video, didn't see that one yet.

 

There is also one with explanation:

 

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