Foveated Rendering Support for DCS

[Digitalvole]

28 minutes ago, dburne said:

I will tell you for me it is completely seemless, I do not notice it at all. In my Varjo Aero, it made a big difference in performance. I now run it's middle area at highest settings for the Aero, it is gorgeous and very smooth. Can not really compare frame timing but certainly a nice improvement. 

This is the biggest performance gain for DCS in VR I have seen to date. I would certainly recommend anyone using DCS a lot and looking at a VR Headset to go for one with eye tracking just for this feature. I think currently that is Aero, Quest Pro, Pimax Crystal ( still in beta).

 

Thanks dburne, it sounds great but would I be correct in thinking the Aero’s camera is a bit more capable than the one in the QP? Do you see any down sides/compromises?

26 minutes ago, recoilfx said:

You have a 5900x and 4090 where you are less GPU bound and more CPU bound. In complex scenarios (missions with lot of objects in view, ie, f-16 cold start @ Nevada instant action), you might not actually get any performance boost, in fact, you probably will get worse performance with DFR. You can however, crank up the visuals to insane amount in less complex missions and you won't see any blurs.

Yeah, I like to play Liberation so it had me wondering if I’d be swapping one problem for another. Mostly I’m gpu bound (trying to keep it at 90fps) still and have a few cpu ms to play with. As long as I can maintain refresh rate once airborne I’m happy. 
Thanks recoilfx.

[mbucchia]

1 hour ago, Digitalvole said:

I was about to order a QP yesterday, but I thought I’d read through this thread first as DFR is one of the main draws for me (can’t see the Q3 being able to do this). To be honest I still can’t believe we have DFR now, it was the mythical holy grail when I had my CV1.

May I ask how noticeable the DFR is? By which I mean, is it completely seamless or does one have to train one’s eyes not to notice the blurry bits? Also how good is the QP’s camera at keeping up with the speed at which our eyes move?

Also, I read it increases cpu frame times. Is there a ballpark number for how much (ie 2ms etc) I have a 5900X 4090 and 64gb ram.

Id really like to order it tonight but I want to just make sure of a couple of things, not least because in order to get this cleared hot by my wife I’ve billed it as possibly the last VR headset I’ll ever need! (I know, I know. But by forever I actually meant the next few years  )

 

Just try the tool in FFR mode with your current headset. It will give you an idea of the CPU increase. There shouldn't be much (if any difference) on the CPU hit whether you use it in FFR or DFR mode.

[Digitalvole]

28 minutes ago, mbucchia said:

Just try the tool in FFR mode with your current headset. It will give you an idea of the CPU increase. There shouldn't be much (if any difference) on the CPU hit whether you use it in FFR or DFR mode.

Oh fantastic, I will do so this evening. Thank you mbucchia, I’ve been out the loop for a bit, but from what I can gather we all owe you many many beers. Thank you.

[dburne]

4 hours ago, Digitalvole said:

Thanks dburne, it sounds great but would I be correct in thinking the Aero’s camera is a bit more capable than the one in the QP? Do you see any down sides/compromises?

 

 

I really could not comment on how QP camera compares with Aero. Probably best to have comments from QP users using eye tracked DFR with DCS.

I can say I have not seen much negativity on it.

[Dentedend10]

I’ve been having a fantastic time with QPro and DFR. For the first time it feels like VR isn’t a compromise compared to 2D. 
the low res area hasn’t bothered me ever. If I look really hard, in some scenes I can notice where the rectangle with the high res end. It hasn’t bothered me enough to play around with the settings changing the size of the rectangle as some other ole have. 
most importantly, the immersion has never been broken for me by slow eye tracking or lower res rectangle

[slughead]

26 minutes ago, Dentedend10 said:

I’ve been having a fantastic time with QPro and DFR. For the first time it feels like VR isn’t a compromise compared to 2D. 
the low res area hasn’t bothered me ever. If I look really hard, in some scenes I can notice where the rectangle with the high res end. It hasn’t bothered me enough to play around with the settings changing the size of the rectangle as some other ole have. 
most importantly, the immersion has never been broken for me by slow eye tracking or lower res rectangle

Same here!

[mbucchia]

[skywalker22]

QP ALL THE WAY!!!

I love them.

[Sile]

Quad-Views-Foveated updated to 1.1.1 (Linked to instructions page as requested by author - goto "Download & installation").:

https://github.com/mbucchia/Quad-Views-Foveated/wiki

Changelog:

• Add support for HP Reverb G2 Omnicept, Pimax Crystal (via SteamVR OpenXR) and Varjo (via SteamVR OpenXR) through OpenXR-Eye-Trackers. Please install the OpenXR-Eye-Trackers separately.
• Add a configuration file option to un-advertise quad views support with certain apps (does not work with DCS).
• Update the installer to order XRNeckSafer and OpenXR-MotionCompensation properly.

Edited September 10, 2023 by Sile

[_schepper_]

null

[Peedee]

7 minutes ago, _schepper_ said:

null

So - are you youtube influencer  or is eyetracking really released for the rest of us ??  

[freehand]

What is it with the Null used comment in posts ? lol if it represents no comment then it's kind of obvious.  

Edited September 11, 2023 by freehand

[slughead]

1 minute ago, freehand said:

What is it with the Null used comment in posts ? lol if it represents no comment then it's kind of obvious.  

 

It's a "feature" of the forum. When a picture is placed... a "NULL" is also inserted.

[freehand]

2 minutes ago, slughead said:

It's a "feature" of the forum. When a picture is placed... a "NULL" is also inserted.

okey dokey.

Edited September 11, 2023 by freehand

[_schepper_]

I am really sorry
I am no influencer,

I tracking for pimax crystal is for everybody drop today.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn CPH2399 met Tapatalk

[dburne]

38 minutes ago, _schepper_ said:

I am really sorry
I am no influencer,

  I   Eye tracking for pimax crystal is for everybody drop today.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn CPH2399 met Tapatalk
 

Fixed that for ya...

Edited September 11, 2023 by dburne

[Nedum]

I've got my new Pimax Crystal, and I am still trying to figure out, how DFR is working.

I see it works, but I have a problem with the OpenXR Toolkit. It shows me with DFR my system is now CPU bound, and the GPU has zero impact. Is that a known issue with the toolkit?

I've done all the good and well known stuff such as slow repair, delete the shader files, deinstall and reinstall the tools.

The Crystal is a performance hungry beast. On the other hand, the picture quality is outstanding, and it's another league in comparison with my old G2. Even the sweet spot clarity of the G2 is a way behind.

A question:

Do I need to enable both sections in the PimaxXR tool (see picture below), eye tracking and DFR?

My understanding says yes, and it seems the only way I can see DFR working. I am right?

 

[TAIPAN_]

57 minutes ago, Nedum said:

I've got my new Pimax Crystal, and I am still trying to figure out, how DFR is working.

I see it works, but I have a problem with the OpenXR Toolkit. It shows me with DFR my system is now CPU bound, and the GPU has zero impact. Is that a known issue with the toolkit?

I've done all the good and well known stuff such as slow repair, delete the shader files, deinstall and reinstall the tools.

The Crystal is a performance hungry beast. On the other hand, the picture quality is outstanding, and it's another league in comparison with my old G2. Even the sweet spot clarity of the G2 is a way behind.

A question:

Do I need to enable both sections in the PimaxXR tool (see picture below), eye tracking and DFR?

My understanding says yes, and it seems the only way I can see DFR working. I am right?

Yeah the wiki says a side effect of not seeing performance metrics correctly if using turbo mode (I think the QuadViews install has it on by default). https://mbucchia.github.io/OpenXR-Toolkit/other-features#turbo-mode

The FPS should be correct though. 

If you get the QuadViews companion app you can test with turbo mode off vs on pretty quickly. 

As for turning on eye tracking and DFR, I turn it on everywhere. 

Other settings should only be set once though, like turbo mode. Also some settings should be turned off when using quadviews like DCS bloom and lense effects, as well as not using some of the openxr toolkit features that can interfere like FOV changes. Wiki of quadviews explains. 

[skywalker22]

On 9/10/2023 at 10:04 AM, Sile said:

Quad-Views-Foveated updated to 1.1.1 (Linked to instructions page as requested by author - goto "Download & installation").:

https://github.com/mbucchia/Quad-Views-Foveated/wiki

Changelog:

• Add support for HP Reverb G2 Omnicept, Pimax Crystal (via SteamVR OpenXR) and Varjo (via SteamVR OpenXR) through OpenXR-Eye-Trackers. Please install the OpenXR-Eye-Trackers separately.
• Add a configuration file option to un-advertise quad views support with certain apps (does not work with DCS).
• Update the installer to order XRNeckSafer and OpenXR-MotionCompensation properly.

 

Nothing new actually, at least not for the Quest Pro, I will stay on 1.10.

[Nedum]

23 minutes ago, TAIPAN_ said:

Yeah the wiki says a side effect of not seeing performance metrics correctly if using turbo mode (I think the QuadViews install has it on by default). https://mbucchia.github.io/OpenXR-Toolkit/other-features#turbo-mode

The FPS should be correct though. 

If you get the QuadViews companion app you can test with turbo mode off vs on pretty quickly. 

As for turning on eye tracking and DFR, I turn it on everywhere. 

Other settings should only be set once though, like turbo mode. Also some settings should be turned off when using quadviews like DCS bloom and lense effects, as well as not using some of the openxr toolkit features that can interfere like FOV changes. Wiki of quadviews explains. 

Thank you. As you wrote, it was the turbo mode. 

DFR works pretty good. It's hard to see where i'ts not sharp. Easiest way, is to start the Cold and Dark Mission in Syria. One can see the fences shimmer outside the focus view.

30 to 40 % higher FPS if I am using MSAA, without MSAA the gain isn't that high.

Stuttering at low level flight even with steady 90 FPS and 10 ms frame time. Not always, but it's there. I have to test some more settings.

I am still blown away from the clarity of my Crystal. Even at 80% resolution, it's so "crystal clear". I don't need MSAA anymore. Less shimmer as with 4 x MSAA and my old G2. What a fine piece of tech.

What I am missing is MR or a 5090.

Edited September 11, 2023 by Nedum

[MAXsenna]

What is it with the Null used comment in posts ? lol if it represents no comment then it's kind of obvious.  

They did an update a few years ago that changed a lot in the forums. When you paste (LCtrl+V) click "paste as plain text", and then click on the picture you've addwd under the post. Helps with not loosing text in long posts, you can place the the pictures wherever you want in the text etc.

Cheers!

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk

[TAIPAN_]

On 9/12/2023 at 12:40 AM, Nedum said:

Thank you. As you wrote, it was the turbo mode. 

DFR works pretty good. It's hard to see where i'ts not sharp. Easiest way, is to start the Cold and Dark Mission in Syria. One can see the fences shimmer outside the focus view.

30 to 40 % higher FPS if I am using MSAA, without MSAA the gain isn't that high.

Stuttering at low level flight even with steady 90 FPS and 10 ms frame time. Not always, but it's there. I have to test some more settings.

I am still blown away from the clarity of my Crystal. Even at 80% resolution, it's so "crystal clear". I don't need MSAA anymore. Less shimmer as with 4 x MSAA and my old G2. What a fine piece of tech.

What I am missing is MR or a 5090.

 

Did you have the stutter before eyetracking?

I've noticed a stutter creep in sometimes after my PC has been running for a while without a reboot (like 1-2 days), then on a clean reboot it's usually ok.

Can see the stutter in the FPS having little drops, still haven't narrowed it down. Kind of annoying to get this on a fresh new build with clean windows install, but I guess we run so many other apps/services we just always gotta keep on top of tuning it up.

Let me know if any setting helps, I want to get it as smooth as possible even if have to disable some candy.

[Nedum]

1 hour ago, TAIPAN_ said:

Did you have the stutter before eyetracking?

I've noticed a stutter creep in sometimes after my PC has been running for a while without a reboot (like 1-2 days), then on a clean reboot it's usually ok.

Can see the stutter in the FPS having little drops, still haven't narrowed it down. Kind of annoying to get this on a fresh new build with clean windows install, but I guess we run so many other apps/services we just always gotta keep on top of tuning it up.

Let me know if any setting helps, I want to get it as smooth as possible even if have to disable some candy.

I really can't say the stutter was there before I was able to use eye tracking.

It's a kind of feeling that there is now more stutter, even with more FPS. It's hard to tell because all the tools I can use are unable to show this kind of issue. The little drops (1 FPS) I can see too, but it also occurs with "stable" 90 FPS.

I have to test different settings to measure it out.

I reboot my system every day at least one time, so that's not the problem.

If I find a solution, I will leave a note.

[FupDuck]

First of all, thanks to @mbucchia for making this great piece of software. It was when I saw that dynamic foveated rendering was possible in DCS, and the associated performance benefits, that I decided to buy a Quest Pro instead of the Quest 3. Unfortunately, I am among the camp of people where enabling the QVFR causes worse performance than with it disabled. My specs are below in the sig.
 

I've followed the installation instructions to the letter, and I can definitely see it working in DCS, with the sharp area right in front of my pupil, and on a plain background, I can just make out the focus area rectangle if I look for it (it moves with my eye). I've confirmed before enabling QVFR that my system is GPU limited by using both the in game framerate graph and the Oculus application rendering frametime overlay, which consistently showed my GPU frametime to be about 2x the CPU value. So I figured I was a perfect candidate for QVFR. But when its enabled, it stutters significantly, whereas without it enabled, I get very smooth performance and steady frametimes. Prior to installing QVFR I ran FFR in OpenXR with the inner ring at 1x to 78%, and 2nd ring at 1/4x to 91% (so the sharp area is larger than the QVFR default). I have the Oculus software resolution set at 1.0 & 72 Hz, with 1.6x super sampling in OTT, and PD at 1.0 in DCS. With these settings I get steady 72 fps using the Pro in DCS except in very graphically intense situations. I always leave ASW disabled because the artifacts ruin the immersion for me.
 

Here's what I've tried so far, all independently and with no effect:

1. Turned turbo mode off/on

2. Left all OpenXR settings at default while using QVFR

3. Set OpenXR settings to same I used before installing QVFR (except leaving FFR and turbo mode disabled)

3. Used Oculus app to set max resolution and don't use OTT at all, with ODT options all to default

4. Slow repair of DCS and removal of all mods

5. Turned down the rendering resolution factors for both the focus and peripheral regions in QVFR

6. Made the focus region smaller in QVFR

 

As I said, none of the above resulted in a less stuttery performance. Here is my log file:

2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: XR_APILAYER_MBUCCHIA_quad_views_foveated layer (v1.1.1) is active
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Using layer: XR_APILAYER_MBUCCHIA_quad_views_foveated
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Using layer: XR_APILAYER_MBUCCHIA_toolkit
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Using layer: XR_APILAYER_FREDEMMOTT_OpenKneeboard
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Cannot satisfy implicit extension request: XR_EXT_eye_gaze_interaction
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Requested extension: XR_KHR_D3D11_enable
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Requested extension: XR_KHR_visibility_mask
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Requested extension: XR_OCULUS_audio_device_guid
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Blocking extension: XR_VARJO_quad_views
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Requesting extension: XR_FB_eye_tracking_social
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Application: DCS World (DCS.exe)
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Using OpenXR runtime: Oculus 1.89.0
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Using OpenXR system: Meta Quest Pro
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Trying to locate configuration file at 'C:\Program Files\OpenXR-Quad-Views-Foveated\settings.cfg'...
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400:   Found option 'smoothen_focus_view_edges=0.2'
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400:   Found option 'sharpen_focus_view=0.7'
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400:   Found option 'turbo_mode=1'
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400:   Found option 'horizontal_fixed_section=0.5'
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400:   Found option 'vertical_fixed_section=0.45'
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400:   Found option 'peripheral_multiplier=0.4'
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400:   Found option 'focus_multiplier=1.1'
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400:   Found option 'horizontal_focus_section=0.5'
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400:   Found option 'vertical_focus_section=0.5'
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Trying to locate configuration file at 'C:\Users\sandm\AppData\Local\Quad-Views-Foveated\settings.cfg'...
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Not found
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Eye tracking is supported
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Recommended peripheral resolution: 960x1100 (0.400x density)
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400: Recommended focus resolution: 1320x1514 (1.100x density)
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400:   Stereo pixel count was: 13209600 (2400x2752)
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400:   Quad views pixel count is: 6108960
2023-10-18 17:13:14 -0400:   Savings: -53.8%
2023-10-18 17:13:21 -0400: Session is using quad views
2023-10-18 17:13:21 -0400: Edge smoothing: 0.20
2023-10-18 17:13:21 -0400: Sharpening: 0.70
2023-10-18 17:13:21 -0400: Turbo: Enabled

It says I'm saving 53%, so I would expect a significant uplift, but it isn't happening. It performs about the same as it does when I have no FFR enabled in OpenXR (again, with lots of stutters).

Attached are the Performance settings in OpenXR that I use when I don't have QVFR enabled, in case thats helpful.

Does anyone happen to have any other hints that I could try? I have read the many accounts on here of people with significant gains and with systems similar to mine, and I would really love to be able to take advantage of this great software! 

Thank you!

[Fisu_MAD]

I don't know what GPU you have or CPU, but the best results have been with Airlink (100mbs), and connecting the device to 18w charger to play infinitely.
My specifications:
nvidia rtx 3080 ti
CPU: intel i9 13900k
RAM: 64 6200Mhz
In the OTT app I have created a profile for DCS.
Default SS = 0
Default ASW = auto
Adaptive GPU scaling = on
Fov: 0.7 & 0.77
CPU Priority: High
Detection: WMI
Screen Mirror: 0
....
OVR Server priority: realtime
...
Note: (...) default values.

In the profile window, change the desktop resolution to something like 1980 x 1080 or less (this for me changes a lot of FPS improvement)

The AirLink part:
Distortion Curvature: low
Enc. resolution: 3600 ( changed with ODT - oculus debug tool)
Encode bitrate:0
Encode dynamic bitrate: Default
Dynamic Bitrate max: 0
Sharp: enable

I load the OTT application manually, nothing about activating it on Windows loading. This in Windows 11 did not activate the trigger to change the resolution.

In the Oculus app on your desktop.

Multiplier to 1.3 (5408x2736)
DCS.

PD 1.0

OpenXR.
NIS : 100% size : 20% sharp
Fixed Foveated Rendering: OFF
Turbo: Off

Also i have installed:
https://github.com/mbucchia/OpenXR-Eye-Trackers/wiki
https://github.com/mbucchia/Quad-Views-Foveated/releases (important if you previously install OpenXR see the steps for a clean config)

Reading this thread, using different SS (0.9~1.1 in the oculus app, 1.0~1.6 in OTT, 1.0~1.3 in DCS, the only thing it causes is a greater workload on the processor and GPU, because the increases and reductions have to be made) causes the performance hit. Better to let the desktop Oculus App and the device do their job.

This is what has worked for me, now with the 12 RAM of the GPU I can handle things at high speed. In missions with a large number of units I have had to lower the terrain to low.

Let me know if the test helped you.