user error Rockets won;t fire

[DmitriKozlowsky]

Have I forgotten something. My rockets won;t fire. As a pilot.

CP/G has TADS on target

Rockets are WASed (highlighted in WPN page)

8 rocket salvo set by George 

ARM ON

Trigger Guard OPEN

Neither first detente or second detente fires rockets.

I am also not seeing 'gate' symbology on eyesight.

At which point I am a bit stumped, why rockets are not fireable.

Edited September 1, 2023 by DmitriKozlowsky

[Floyd1212]

1 hour ago, DmitriKozlowsky said:

Rockets are WASed (highlighted in WPN page)

Not sure exactly what you mean here, but selecting RKT across the bottom of the WPN page is not the same as WAS'ing rockets for deployment.

You can select any of the weapons systems from the WPN page to change settings, like missile code or rocket quantity, but if you want to action the weapon you need to use the WAS hat on the cyclic.

When WASed you will see the dotted box around the SAFE/ARM Status indicator, and only then you will get the rocket steering cursor symbology.

[Grennymaster]

do you have a mixed loadout in the pods mabye? then you also have to select wich type you would like to fire.

[DmitriKozlowsky]

Hey thats not working.  You people are pulling my leg. Weapons selected, master ARM ON. ACQ is FXD. But no FIRE. When I do try to fire, I get CRKT FX WEAPON?. So why is weapon selected generates weapon confusion in fire control. I hare confusing instruction. 

DO A, while B is happening. Common p[roblem in DCS across modules. Instructions and procedurea that are out of date. Hate it!  They need to work on it. Whoever they are.

[giullep]

Why do you have ground overraid selected? Turn off

[DmitriKozlowsky]

Even Trianing/Rockets procedures are not allowing rockets to fire. What has changed?

[DmitriKozlowsky]

I am permanenrly stuck on PYLON LIMIT. I have no clue how to clear it.

[probad]

you have rockets selected for both the cpg and yourself at the same time? i think the cpg in this case actually has control of the rockets and that might explain why nothing is happening?

[DmitriKozlowsky]

49 minutes ago, probad said:

you have rockets selected for both the cpg and yourself at the same time? i think the cpg in this case actually has control of the rockets and that might explain why nothing is happening?

That is absolutely not ekling confusing at all? Tottally and completely clear!

I still have no clue what is happening or not happening, or why?

[DmitriKozlowsky]

"you have rockets selected for both the cpg and yourself at the same time"

WHERE THE BLANK IS THAT INDICATED?

This is a constant training issue with DCS forums. Blanking answers without blanking context. Such a poor environment for learning, or relearning something.

[NeedzWD40]

1 hour ago, DmitriKozlowsky said:

Hey thats not working.  You people are pulling my leg. Weapons selected, master ARM ON. ACQ is FXD. But no FIRE. When I do try to fire, I get CRKT FX WEAPON?. So why is weapon selected generates weapon confusion in fire control. I hare confusing instruction. 

You need to use the Weapon Action Switch to select rockets. Any time you see "WEAPON?" in the HMD it means you do not have a weapon WAS'd. You cannot select weapons via the weapon page.

Rocket attack methods:

With George:

1. Set ACQ source to TADS.

2. Use George interface to have him select rockets.

3. Pilot - WAS RKT.

4. George interface: Search for targets > Select target > Track target.

5. Align and fire.

Without George, manual range:

*Ensure George is not currently set to use rockets.

1. Set ACQ source to FXD.

2. WAS RKT.

3. Set desired MAN RNG value on weapon page with keyboard unit.

4. Look at desired target with HMD crosshairs.

5. Align rocket steering cursor with HMD crosshairs.

6. Fire with solid steering cursor.

Without George, target point/terrain point:

*Ensure George is not currently set to use rockets.

1. WAS RKT.

2. Set ACQ to target point (COORD menu) OR set terrain position with CAQ function.

3. Align HMD crosshair with dashed ACQ crosshairs.

4. Align rocket steering cursor with HMD crosshairs.

5. Fire when rocket steering cursor is solid.

Edited September 3, 2023 by NeedzWD40

[DmitriKozlowsky]

". Align HMD crosshair with dashed ACQ crosshairs."

I am having a problem with this task.

Ain't happening.

[admiki]

1 hour ago, DmitriKozlowsky said:

"you have rockets selected for both the cpg and yourself at the same time"

WHERE THE BLANK IS THAT INDICATED?

This is a constant training issue with DCS forums. Blanking answers without blanking context. Such a poor environment for learning, or relearning something.

You might want to check attitude.

You constantly come here to ask questions that are, to be polite, on basic level of understanding Apache.

You have already been told to WAS rockets (USE WEAPON ACTION SWITCH), not select them on weapons page.

[admiki]

1 means that your CPG has control over rockets.

2 means that when you WAS weapons, those options in the circle will be gone.

If you need it any easier that this, maybe Apache is not for you.

[corbu1]

As NeedzWD40 and admiki have already replied very detailed on your problems with the rockets, I just add a sitenote …….. It seems you didn‘t boresight your IHADDS, did you?

[shagrat]

vor 13 Stunden schrieb DmitriKozlowsky:

Hey thats not working.  You people are pulling my leg. Weapons selected, master ARM ON. ACQ is FXD. But no FIRE. When I do try to fire, I get CRKT FX WEAPON?. So why is weapon selected generates weapon confusion in fire control. I hare confusing instruction. 

DO A, while B is happening. Common p[roblem in DCS across modules. Instructions and procedurea that are out of date. Hate it!  They need to work on it. Whoever they are.

Hi, Dimitry.

First an important question: did you uncheck the "Weapon Trigger Guard active" in the AH-64D special options, or bind a key to the trigger guard in the controls, so it isn't a simple issue of the safeguard preventing you from firing?

The "WEAPON?" message in the IHADSS shows, you have not selected (WASed) a weapon, but it doesn't hurt to double check the trigger guard.

Also, the procedures for rocket employment were not changed, since the EA release of the Apache and all three employment modes (direct, indirect and coop) work as described in the manual and explained/demonstrated in the training. 

With that out of the way, did you do the Training Mission No. 5 "Unguided Rockets"?

I highly recommend to first read the section "Aerial Rocket Sub-System (ARS)" page 343 ff of the chapter "Weapons Employment" in the "Early Access guide" (Program files/Eagle Dynamics/DCS World/Mods/aircraft/AH-64D/Doc/DCS AH-64D Quick Start Manual EN.pdf) and if you have the time, the chapter "Tactical Employment", as well.

This will familiarize you with the operation of the rockets, especially as with George AI, you need to understand both the PILOT tasks and the tasks normally done by the CP/G, that you need to command(!) George AI in addition.

Flying an aircraft that requires two a person crew IRL alone in DCS means an even higher workload and complexity.

IRL Apache crews are trained for quite some time, full time, every day, so each pilot and CP/G can operate both seats, it isn't a simple "hop in, point at enemy and press fire" kind of thing.

Take it slow. Do the training step-by-step, listen to the instructions(!) do not rush through. Then train one method (direct fire PLT with MAN RANGE), until you are comfortable and can remember the steps. A checklist does help, as well. From what I've read, crews will go through a checklist, before a weapon engagement whenever possible.

-PLT - rockets WASed

-C/PG - rockets deWASed

-Verify HAD - RKT NORM

-Verify WPN Page - QTY and TYPE selected

-Verify A/S (Master Arm) - set to ARM

-Range Source - select MAN (enter distance) or AUTO 

Then you need to look at the intended impact area (hold the LOS reticle over the target) and maneuver the helicopter so the nose points in that direction and the "I" (Rocket Steering Cursor) aligns with the LOS reticle. If you have manual distance set fire when in range, if you have Auto-ranging set, when the Rocket Steering Cursor is solid and you are closer than 3.500m to get a minimum of precision. The theoretical range should be about 7.5 km, but the dispersion of the rockets is insane at that distance. So if you don't plan on an rocket artillery strike with all 38 rockets as a barrage, get close and align carefully.

For direct fire in Coop mode, have George WAS rockets as well.

Verify HAD shows COOP and George will put the dashed target marker (ACQ source TADS) on the target you made him track from his list.

Now simply align the "I" (Rocket Steering Cursor) with your(!!!) LOS reticle (not the dashed ACQ source) and if the Rocket Steering Cursor is solid and no "Inhibit messages" on the HAD, pull the trigger.

It takes some practice to understand and get good with the rockets, but they are quite fun.

 

Edited September 3, 2023 by shagrat

[DmitriKozlowsky]

3 hours ago, corbu1 said:

As NeedzWD40 and admiki have already replied very detailed on your problems with the rockets, I just add a sitenote …….. It seems you didn‘t boresight your IHADDS, did you?

Its not boresighting at all. Process is not working, as I am unable to center the crosshaor with boresight circles. The movement of view controls, does not allow me. Best I get is at 100 meters a HUMVEE is off by 1 to 1 1/2 HUMVEEs, and at 200 meters a C-17 is off by 1/2 fuselage. Useless for rocket strafe or gun TADS control. 

[razo+r]

7 minutes ago, DmitriKozlowsky said:

Its not boresighting at all. Process is not working, as I am unable to center the crosshaor with boresight circles. The movement of view controls, does not allow me. Best I get is at 100 meters a HUMVEE is off by 1 to 1 1/2 HUMVEEs, and at 200 meters a C-17 is off by 1/2 fuselage. Useless for rocket strafe or gun TADS control. 

The process is very much working, even with keyboard only. You just need to finally figure out which of the keys, like RShift+Rctrl+Num2 and Num8, moves your view down so you can correctly boresight it......

Edited September 3, 2023 by razo+r

[DmitriKozlowsky]

54 minutes ago, razo+r said:

The process is very much working, even with keyboard only. You just need to finally figure out which of the keys, like RShift+Rctrl+Num2 and Num8, moves your view down so you can correctly boresight it......

 

No it does not! Not much else to say.

[razo+r]

1 minute ago, DmitriKozlowsky said:

No it does not! Not much else to say.

Then check your controls because those keys move the view down for me.

[Floyd1212]

As others have said (and like I said in the 2nd post of this thread), you WAS weapons for deployment with the controls on your cyclic, not by pushing buttons on the MPD.

Up = Gun

Right = Missiles

Left = Rockets

[shagrat]

vor 5 Stunden schrieb DmitriKozlowsky:

No it does not! Not much else to say.

Well, it does work for everyone else, but you, it seems.

I posted above with some pointers where to find details and training aid.

Did you have time to go through the training mission and learn how to operate the rockets, or are you just trying to wing it quick and dirty and wondering why things don't work out?

If it is the latter, nobody will be able to help you.

If you are trying to learn the procedures and actually struggle with the training, or bores sighting, someone may be able to help.

As posted by razo+r there are keybinds to move your virtual head in the cockpit, if you don't have a head tracker (default RSHFT+RCTRL+ Keypad 2, 4, 6, 8).

Edited September 3, 2023 by shagrat

[admiki]

41 minutes ago, shagrat said:

Well, it does work for everyone else, but you, it seems.

I posted above with some pointers where to find details and training aid.

Did you have time to go through the training mission and learn how to operate the rockets, or are you just trying to wing it quick and dirty and wondering why things don't work out?

If it is the latter, nobody will be able to help you.

If you are trying to learn the procedures and actually struggle with the training, or bores sighting, someone may be able to help.

As posted by razo+r there are keybinds to move your virtual head in the cockpit, if you don't have a head tracker (default RSHFT+RCTRL+ Keypad 2, 4, 6, 8).

 

You obviously missed his previous "bug" threads