reported New pilot model issues / helmet view issue

[average_pilot]

I actually didn't have time to test until now, and it turns out that the problem isn't that bad, at least for me, and in VR. Maybe it is because I use a custom cockpit view that match as much as possible the correct position of the head in the cockpit (based on the external 3D model and the shoulders of the previous body model), so when I contort to check my six my head isn't too far from the model's head position. Something to take into account while the fix is coming.

[TheFreshPrince]

vor 5 Stunden schrieb BIGNEWY:

The pilot helmet getting in the way when you look behind will be fixed in a future patch. 

Please remember for now you can disable the pilot body if required.

Thank you

threads merged

Thank you! 

[Atazar SPN]

I love the view of the new 3D pilot, good job, but I normally fly with the pilot enabled and now the helmet prevents me from seeing what I have at my six, or checking the status, position and operation of the ailerons. A first-person view of the pilot is not supposed to show the pilot's own head.

[razo+r]

 

[ChaosRifle]

On 10/26/2023 at 12:40 PM, BIGNEWY said:

I am not a fan of it myself but I have been told by the team it is intended. 

wouldn't the fact the head leaves 'normal body position' just be because the user is leaning forward to get clearance for their shoulder to turn ?? that what I always thought it was, and just lacking a body animation.

+1 for removing the helmet, this looks awful: I don't use the new body because I can't see with it, but I exclusively flew with the old body enabled when there was no helmet.

[BIGNEWY]

The team are already working on a tweak for the next update. 

Thank you

[ChaosRifle]

2 minutes ago, BIGNEWY said:

The team are already working on a tweak for the next update. 

Thank you

no, thank YOU This is great news!

[Fisherman82]

4 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

The team are already working on a tweak for the next update. 

Thank you

Good!

There cant be any logical reasons to why someone would want to see their own head in a FIRST person view.

Really like the new kneeboard, looking forward to getting the pages working on it, I only use the one on the leg of the pilot so its great that the new one is a little bigger.

 

[Megalax]

 

JHMCS frame clipping through the visor. Seen in model viewer.

 

Can even be seen in the Bogey Dope's video here

 

Edited October 29, 2023 by Megalax

[Megalax]

2 hours ago, Omega1-1 said:

I don't understand your point at all. I looked on the image and this video clip, where I should focus to see what you mean?
Or can you simply explain the thing?

The white bits in the visor. Its the JHMCS frame poking through the visor glass.

[TORC]

For the OP's comments on not having VR - yes, the problem is still there and it's almost as bad. You can check six, but you are almost always seeing the helmet or parts of it in your peripheral vision (such as it is in VR) when twisting around to see back.

I kinda like not having the head on the first-person pilot model at all better ...

This would be less of a problem with the Apache, in my experience in VR, because you're not checking six anywhere near as much as you are in the Hornet.

[Ala12Rv-Muscat]

@BIGNEWY any news of 509 lost argument? to get the HGU-58 without JHMCS…

and will we have night vision goggles visible on the model?

 

Thanks 

Edited November 27, 2023 by Ala12Rv-Muscat

[Ala12Rv-Muscat]

@BIGNEWY @Eagle Dynamics @NineLineplease could you clarify if this option will be available to be able to have the JHCMS removed? and the night vision goggles on the helmet model in external view? these are things that have been promised to be done, another thing aside the helmet model deforms any texture that is added to it so painting the helmets is a headache.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 9, 2024 by Ala12Rv-Muscat

[Ala12Rv-Muscat]

@BIGNEWY 

First of all thank ED for his effort to improve the 3D model of the F/A-18C Hornet pilot in the last patch, it is a fantastic model, much better than the previous one, but still needs work, I will detail some things I have seen as skin maker in case it helps to continue improving it:

• The 3D mesh of the helmet deforms any texture added on the sides of the helmet.
• The velcro patch on the top of the helmet has too much height and is not realistic.
• The visor is not supported on the mbu-20 oxygen mask as it really is (see attached images) giving an unrealistic appearance.
• These pieces so characteristic of these helmets that protect the visor from scratches against the helmet are missing.

 

I hope it serves as help to continue improving the helmet model.

greetings

Edited February 27, 2024 by Ala12Rv-Muscat

[BIGNEWY]

23 minutes ago, Ala12Rv-Muscat said:

@BIGNEWY 

First of all thank ED for his effort to improve the 3D model of the F/A-18C Hornet pilot in the last patch, it is a fantastic model, much better than the previous one, but still needs work, I will detail some things I have seen as skin maker in case it helps to continue improving it:

• The 3D mesh of the helmet deforms any texture added on the sides of the helmet.
• The velcro patch on the top of the helmet has too much height and is not realistic.
• The visor is not supported on the mbu-20 oxygen mask as it really is (see attached images) giving an unrealistic appearance.
• These pieces so characteristic of these helmets that protect the visor from scratches against the helmet are missing.

 

I hope it serves as help to continue improving the helmet model.

greetings

Hi and thank you for the feedback, I have created a task for the team to review the feedback in this thread. 

 

[Ala12Rv-Muscat]

thank you very much,

I have also found another problem related to the new helmet model in the simulator, in flight, although the animation of raising and lowering the visor if it works the visor does not move and stays fixed in the same position.

Also the 3D mesh of the helmet is not smoothed at all and produces strange effects in certain lighting conditions (see attached image).

Greetings

[Ala12Rv-Muscat]

More information about some problems with the current ED F/A-18C Hornet helmet (after the last update):

I attach some images showing the deformation in the textures due to the current 3d model mesh of the helmet, this makes it impossible to add complex textures in the helmet with quality and makes very difficult the work to the skin makers.

I hope it helps and serves the ED team to solve these problems,

greetings

[Ala12Rv-Muscat]

and finally regarding the visor and the oxygen mask, contrasting dozens of photos on the hgu-68P and the mbu-20 oxygen mask:

- The mask should be closer to the pilot's face so the nose piece touches the forehead.
- The visor should be lowered all the way, so it would touch the mask as it really is.

 

Thanks @BIGNEWY for the support.

Greetings

 

Edited February 28, 2024 by Ala12Rv-Muscat

[Tholozor]

To my knowledge, HGU-68/P helmets in USN service did have the elephant ears, but not the visor rest protrusions on top (these are more in-line with HGU-55/P helmets). The helmet had a fixed track for the visor, however many helmets ended up unofficially modified to retain the NVG clips while swapping to the single-bungee visor strap. Additional information and examples on helmets used in U.S. Navy service can be found here: https://www.salimbeti.com/aviation/helmets4.htm

Here's some examples of the modified -68/P:

Actual -68/P helmets would look more like this:

Edited February 28, 2024 by Tholozor

[Ala12Rv-Muscat]

hace 1 hora, Tholozor dijo:

To my knowledge, HGU-68/P helmets in USN service did have the elephant ears, but not the visor rest protrusions on top (these are more in-line with HGU-55/P helmets). The helmet had a fixed track for the visor, however many helmets ended up unofficially modified to retain the NVG clips while swapping to the single-bungee visor strap. Additional information and examples on helmets used in U.S. Navy service can be found here: https://www.salimbeti.com/aviation/helmets4.htm

Here's some examples of the modified -68/P:

Actual -68/P helmets would look more like this:

 

The elephant ears are not currently modeled, even though they were included in the first renders of the helmet that were published,

The visor rest protrusions should be included since not only the United States flies the Hornet and in this way to make a more generic helmet including these parts would be more fair to simulate other hornet operators like Spain, Finland, Switzerland, Australia, Canada etc.

Edited February 29, 2024 by Ala12Rv-Muscat

[Tholozor]

11 minutes ago, Ala12Rv-Muscat said:

The visor rest protrusions should be included since not only the United States flies the Hornet and in this way to make a more generic helmet including these parts would be more fair to simulate other hornet operators like Spain, Finland, Switzerland, Australia, Canada etc.

 

 

Except it's been explicitly stated that the non-JHMCS helmet is supposed to be a U.S. Navy HGU-68/P, which did not have the protrusions. But yes, the elephant ears are definitely missing.
https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/news/2023-09-08/

Edited February 29, 2024 by Tholozor

[Ala12Rv-Muscat]

more issues found:

 

• The visor up/down animation is broken, the visor doesn't move but the pilot's arm and hand do movement.
• The position of the hand and arm in the animation is separated from the visor in the HGU-68P version of the helmet without the JHCMS, with the JHCMS it is correct.
• In the DCS menu you can request by radio to the ground crew to change the device between the helmet with the night vision goggles (HGU-68P with banana adapter) and the version with the JHCMS visor but, you can NOT request to remove both (to keep the HGU-68P version simple).

I hope it helps

Greetings

[Ala12Rv-Muscat]

Here is a comparison between the 3D model of the ED F-18 pilot and the razbaam model of the F-15E pilot, I don't mean to offend any of the ED team, I just wish that the best-selling module that is the ED F-18C Hornet has the expected level of detail.

 

Razbaam 3D model HGU-68P+MBU-20P Oxigen mask

LEFT: Razbaam 3D model HGU-68P+MBU-20P Oxigen mask

RIGHT: Eagle Dynamics 3D model HGU-68P+MBU-20P Oxigen mask

Eagle Dynamics 3D model HGU-68P+MBU-20P Oxigen mask

Razbaam 3D model HGU-68P+MBU-20P Oxigen mask

Edited March 9, 2024 by Ala12Rv-Muscat

[ggerman2862]

Just for even more specifics...

The standard issue Air Force HGU-55/P Combat Edge helmet has gray elephant ears, gray leather stop blocks and a grey strip in the center that goes from the front edge to where the stop blocks are located (this is to prevent scratches on the inside center of the bungee visor.) It also has the NVG mounting brackets. Usually, when we have our HGU-55/P refurbished and the leather edge roll replaced, we omit the center strip (however some pilots choose to keep that because they have aftermarket mirror coated visors and don't want to risk scratches.) but when issued in UPT or B-Course, they usually have the center strip. Most all Air Force HGU-55/P helmets nowadays are Combat Edge versions - which have an air tube that runs from the MBU-20/P mask to a connection on the bottom left side of the helmet. This tube inflates/deflates a bladder inside the top and back of the helmet during high-G maneuvers to squeeze the pilots head to keep blood in the brain. (think of it as a g-suit for the head!)

(Technically, the Razbam pilots should have the CE version of the HGU-55/P helmet, but they don't...)

The standard Air Force HGU-55/P with a JHMCS visor has the gray leather edge roll but does NOT have the elephant ears, stop blocks, or center strip. But it does have the NVG mount brackets. In recent years, the Air Force decided to allow pilots to customize their helmets (both standard and JHMCS versions) so you will see many USAF HGU-55/p helmets with printed vinyl graphic wraps. These wraps are easier (and cheaper) to apply than custom painting - since pilots must pay the cost of customizing out-of-pocket. The JHMCS visor housing is light gray and CANNOT have graphics or paint applied to it.

The current issue Navy HGU-68/P now comes standard from Gentex with the bungee visor, black leather edge roll and stop blocks and has black leather elephant ears, as well as the NVG mounting brackets. The track-mounted visor is now optional, since most pilots prefer the bungee style visor (and many prefer to have aftermarket mirror coated visors - which are less expensive than mirror-coated track-style visors). There is also a standard 3" square of black velcro loop on top of the helmet for mounting an emergency strobe locator beacon in case of ejection on land or water.

The current issue Navy HGU-68/P with the JHMCS visor has black leather edge roll but does NOT have the elephant ears. It also has the black velcro loop on top for the strobe beacon. The JHMCS visor housing is light gray.

U.S. Marine Corps HGU-68/P helmets run the gamut - some retain the track visors while other use the bungee visor. Many times, US Marine pilots wear camo helmets covers in the AOR, and they are easier to put over the bungee version than the track version.

And ... contrary to what "Top Gun: Maverick" depicts, fleet Navy pilots don't have those colorful custom painted helmets. Both U.S. Navy and U.S. Marine HGU-68/P helmets (and the new $400K F-35 helmets) are required to have at least 90% of their surface covered in white reflective tape for easier identification in case of SAR at sea... the remaining 10% can be used for squadron markings - which are usually vinyl decals. The JHMCS visor housing CANNOT have graphics or paint applied to it.

F-35 helmets have only the reflective tape and the carbon fiber pattern of the helmet. (no custom graphics)

Edited April 19, 2024 by ggerman2862

[Jackjack171]

3 hours ago, ggerman2862 said:

Just for even more specifics...

The standard issue Air Force HGU-55/P Combat Edge helmet has gray elephant ears, gray leather stop blocks and a grey strip in the center that goes from the front edge to where the stop blocks are located (this is to prevent scratches on the inside center of the bungee visor.) It also has the NVG mounting brackets. Usually, when we have our HGU-55/P refurbished and the leather edge roll replaced, we omit the center strip (however some pilots choose to keep that because they have aftermarket mirror coated visors and don't want to risk scratches.) but when issued in UPT or B-Course, they usually have the center strip.

The standard Air Force HGU-55/P with a JHMCS visor has the gray leather edge roll but does NOT have the elephant ears, stop blocks, or center strip. But it does have the NVG mount brackets. In recent years, the Air Force decided to allow pilots to customize their helmets (both standard and JHMCS versions) so you will see many USAF HGU-55/p helmets with printed vinyl graphic wraps. These wraps are easier (and cheaper) to apply than custom painting - since pilots must pay the cost of customizing out-of-pocket.

The current issue Navy HGU-68/P now comes standard from Gentex with the bungee visor, black leather edge roll and stop blocks and has black leather elephant ears, as well as the NVG mounting brackets. The track-mounted visor is now optional, since most pilots prefer the bungee style visor (and many prefer to have aftermarket mirror coated visors - which are less expensive than mirror-coated track-style visors). There is also a standard 2" square of black velcro loop on top of the helmet for mounting the emergency strobe locator beacon in case of ejection on land or water.

The current issue Navy HGU-68/P with the JHMCS visor has black leather edge roll but does NOT have the elephant ears. It also has the black velcro loop on top for the strobe beacon.

U.S. Marine Corps HGU-68/P helmets run the gamut - some retain the track visors while other use the bungee visor. Many times, US Marine pilots wear camo helmets covers in the AOR, and they are easier to put over the bungee version than the track version.

And ... contrary to what "Top Gun: Maverick" depicts, fleet Navy pilots don't have those colorful custom painted helmets. Both U.S. Navy and U.S. Marine HGU-68/P helmets (and the new $400K F-35 helmets) are required to have at least 90% of their surface covered in white reflective tape for easier identification in case of CSAR at sea... the remaining 10% can be used for squadron markings - which are usually vinyl decals.

F-35 helmets have only the reflective tape and the carbon fiber pattern of the helmet. (no custom graphics)

 

Spot on!