DCS survey (result)

[WolfCat]

On 4/13/2024 at 2:09 PM, tribbin said:

I can't imagine ever flying without VR.

Are there people who have flown VR and stopped? 

Yes, because of performance issues. But next year im gonna buy myself a better PC.

[Shimmergloom667]

On 4/13/2024 at 2:09 PM, tribbin said:

I can't imagine ever flying without VR.

Are there people who have flown VR and stopped? 

Yeah, me - the wow-effect was gone in a few sessions and I was constantly annoyed with the rather low visual fidelity, much lower than on a quality screen. I was constantly angry about how <profanity>ty it looked, and I don't like being constantly angry about something so expensive.

I'll give it another try in a bit of time - it certainly is the way of the future, but it's not yet there for me, personally.

[Tzigy]

On 4/13/2024 at 4:09 AM, tribbin said:

I can't imagine ever flying without VR.

Are there people who have flown VR and stopped? 

Yes. Might try again down the road. For now will keep w my 4k 48 LG OLED, surround speakers, 2 Buttkickers, TrackIR. The heat, lower res, nausea ( i know i know), and harder to drink my beer, just no go for me quite yet.

[YoYo]

10 hours ago, Tzigy said:

 drink my beer

Use a bottle, not a pint, no problem. 

[Qcumber]

14 minutes ago, YoYo said:

Use a bottle, not a pint, no problem. 

Skip the bottle. Set up an intravenous drip!!! 

[WipeUout]

On 4/13/2024 at 3:09 PM, tribbin said:

I can't imagine ever flying without VR.

Are there people who have flown VR and stopped? 

I noticed that majority of people going back to 2D is related to performance/quality and this is a main issue with VR.  Unless you can drive that HMD with lots of power, the experience can be disapointing on the long run with endless attempts to squeeze performance by changing this and that setting.  My setup is now pretty much the most powerfull I can wish for and yet, I could use even more power to fully exploit my 8KX with the best possible image this HMD can provide.  The day I can sim without FFR, supersample to 2.0, widest FOV, every setting maxed out and keep a constant 90 FPS is the day I will see the full potential of the 8KX realized.  Maybe with the 6090. 

As I always say to people, with VR you are in the simulation, not looking at the simulation.  For me there is no going back to 2D.

I just hope VR gets more accessible in the future, it is way too expensive now to get a decent experience.

[Qcumber]

7 minutes ago, WipeUout said:

I noticed that majority of people going back to 2D is related to performance/quality and this is a main issue with VR.

This will hopefully get better when/if we get an affordable VR headset with eye tracking. 

[nessuno0505]

4 ore fa, WipeUout ha scritto:

I just hope VR gets more accessible in the future, it is way too expensive now to get a decent experience.

It depends on expectations maybe. I started VR with a GTX 1070 and a Rift CV1, and that was already "enough" for me; now with a 3080ti and a quest 3 I'm flying in full-hd compared to Rift CV1, and the wow-effect never went away. When we'll have true full-hd clarity on VR headsets we'll also have 8k monitors as standard and VR will still be "low resolution" compared. But if I compare what I have now to Chuck Yeager's Air Combat I had when I was 14, I'm already in the future.

Edited April 25 by nessuno0505

[freehand]

44 minutes ago, nessuno0505 said:

It depends on expectations maybe. I started VR with a GTX 1070 and a Rift CV1, and that was already "enough" for me; now with a 3080ti and a quest 3 I'm flying in full-hd compared to Rift CV1, and the wow-effect never went away. When we'll have true full-hd clarity on VR headsets we'll also have 8k monitors as standard and VR will still be "low resolution" compared. But if I compare what I have now to Chuck Yeager's Air Combat I had when I was 14, I'm already in the future.

 

So true never thought I would be having the experience we have today compared to yester year. 

[Maverick87Shaka]

On 4/7/2024 at 4:16 PM, YoYo said:

We had a survey on the website http://dcsworld.pl/ (its not the official ED website for sure but focused on DCS in Poland too). The survey was conducted in a Facebook group, in Polish, but Im posting its results here. They are very interesting. Nearly 350 people took part in the survey. It may be useful to someone. 

I'm uploading the Google translate version into English: 

Survey of the Polish DCS World community - results - DCS World Flying School (dcsworld-pl.translate.goog)

Regards!

Thanks for sharing the results, really interesting statistics

[Bucic]

To me the biggest surprise was the popularity of sand maps in the "what map are you most eager to get your hands on" question.

[AhSoul]

I've got a 42" OLED, but since getting a Quest3 have moved full time to VR. Yes the visual quality isn't as good (but that'll be solved over time as better hardware like the 5090 comes out) but the immersion is simply worth the effort (for me). Formation flying in all aircraft is easier due to the depth perception (as is heli flight in general), and flying through buildings and trees is exhilarating. And then you get a missile streak past your window, or a mate buzzing you down a valley....

I don't think I'll be going back to 2D.

Edited May 7 by AhSoul

[Qcumber]

46 minutes ago, AhSoul said:

I've got a 42" OLED, but since getting a Quest3 have moved full time to VR. Yes the visual quality isn't as good (but that'll be solved over time as better hardware like the 5090 comes out) but the immersion is simply worth the effort (for me). Formation flying in all aircraft is easier due to the depth perception (as is heli flight in general), and flying through buildings and trees is exhilarating. And then you get a missile streak past your window, or a mate buzzing you down a valley....

I don't think I'll be going back to 2D.

 

I am hoping that a combination of the 5090 and crystal super will give a close approximation of 4k flat screen resolution. I just need to save £3500 before Christmas. 

[AhSoul]

16 hours ago, Qcumber said:

I am hoping that a combination of the 5090 and crystal super will give a close approximation of 4k flat screen resolution. I just need to save £3500 before Christmas. 

Yeah this stuff is not cheap!

[SparxOne]

On 5/7/2024 at 6:17 PM, Qcumber said:

I am hoping that a combination of the 5090 and crystal super will give a close approximation of 4k flat screen resolution. I just need to save £3500 before Christmas. 

 

15 hours ago, AhSoul said:

Yeah this stuff is not cheap!

Yep, that's been my major fear with VR ever since. Not being able to get a quality close enough to what i get on my 2D monitor, most of the VR user feedback i've read seems to be saying that it is first of all quite expensive to run (Performance wise), and second, you clearly loose in terms of quality.
So the idea of having to spend quite a large amount of cash in a computer able to run a VR experience at good FPS, while also having to spend a good amount on a good VR headset that allows the clarity and quality close to my 2D monitor felt a bit much. Therefore i've stayed on 2D ever since.

BUT, i gotta say, i finally got to try VR for the first time a few weeks back (Not with DCS unfortunately), and i must say i got hooked to the immersion factor ! My friend has a Quest 2 and so i tried it with a few small games, as basic as the games were and same with the quality of said games, like i said, the immersion you get from it felt really adictive ! I now am truly thinking of taking a step in VR, but at what cost.......

Wanting my VR to run at the highest FPS possible there is no doubt i'd have to buy the top of the line GPU, and if i want the best quality possible, same would go for the VR headset, and those combined would set me around 3000€ minimum, big ouch 

Edited May 9 by SparxOne

[freehand]

You do not need a ninja rig to have a very good experience in DCS just a handful of optimizations to help you along way.

 

[Qcumber]

5 hours ago, SparxOne said:

 

Yep, that's been my major fear with VR ever since. Not being able to get a quality close enough to what i get on my 2D monitor, most of the VR user feedback i've read seems to be saying that it is first of all quite expensive to run (Performance wise), and second, you clearly loose in terms of quality.
So the idea of having to spend quite a large amount of cash in a computer able to run a VR experience at good FPS, while also having to spend a good amount on a good VR headset that allows the clarity and quality close to my 2D monitor felt a bit much. Therefore i've stayed on 2D ever since.

BUT, i gotta say, i finally got to try VR for the first time a few weeks back (Not with DCS unfortunately), and i must say i got hooked to the immersion factor ! My friend has a Quest 2 and so i tried it with a few small games, as basic as the games were and same with the quality of said games, like i said, the immersion you get from it felt really adictive ! I now am truly thinking of taking a step in VR, but at what cost.......

Wanting my VR to run at the highest FPS possible there is no doubt i'd have to buy the top of the line GPU, and if i want the best quality possible, same would go for the VR headset, and those combined would set me around 3000€ minimum, big ouch 

 

I have a 4070 and get a steady 72fps with my quest pro. The QP is a good deal now. You can pick one up nearly new for about £450 or less. I managed to get mine for £300. With dynamic foveated rendering you can set the centre Res high for great clarity with a reduced peripheral res. This reduces the overall resolution by about 50% or more. Combined with careful use of DLSS and you can reduce this for a total of 70-80%. I think this is the sweet spot for VR at the moment. 

With time (probably only a couple of years) we will see DFR and decent panel resolution on an affordable headset. I am tempted by the 5090/crystal super combo but will wait and see what is around this time next year before I upgrade. 

[draconus]

5 hours ago, SparxOne said:

Not being able to get a quality close enough to what i get on my 2D monitor, most of the VR user feedback i've read seems to be saying that it is first of all quite expensive to run (Performance wise), and second, you clearly loose in terms of quality.

This will always be true, until the display tech surpasses our eye's ability to differentiate the image quality. Otoh the VR will always win in immersion with its tracking, fov and stereography. So it's a compromise - you have to decide for yourselft what you value more and best to check for yourselft, because not everyone can handle VR without some secodary feeling effects. Getting top notch headset will require even more expensive card because of the higher resolution thus performance demand.

[Hiob]

Next to the performance and visual fidelity (which are bound to improve over time anyway), the biggest problem VR has to solve to become my goto-solution is creature comfort.

I'm just not comfortable with current day HMDs, at least not for longer than 15-20 min. Weight, heat, air draft for cooling....

I think this will all improve eventually but right now it's a choose-two-triangle. Not to mention the price of course.

...oh, and I believe firmly that it takes a rather big toll on the eyes in the long run.

[draconus]

16 minutes ago, Hiob said:

the biggest problem VR has to solve to become my goto-solution is creature comfort

Like Dlodlo V1 or Bigscreen Beyond?

[Qcumber]

18 minutes ago, Hiob said:

Next to the performance and visual fidelity (which are bound to improve over time anyway), the biggest problem VR has to solve to become my goto-solution is creature comfort.

I'm just not comfortable with current day HMDs, at least not for longer than 15-20 min. Weight, heat, air draft for cooling....

I think this will all improve eventually but right now it's a choose-two-triangle. Not to mention the price of course.

...oh, and I believe firmly that it takes a rather big toll on the eyes in the long run.

I think some people adapt to vr better than others. Motion sickness etc. For me the things that support immersion are comfort and a wide horizontal FOV. The QP is the most comfortable headset I've tried, but it does take some tweaking to get it that way. I like the fact that it sits away from your face. Weirdly the open sides adds to the immersion; peripheral light Vs dark. I hope future headsets adopt a similar approach. 

[Hiob]

Of course I didn’t try every HMD that is out there currently. I‘m sure some are better in certain aspects than others. But from what I take in from tests and tech news (and user reports) there are still none, that excel in every aspect that is important to me.

I‘m not hating on VR, quite the opposite. If VR (and the applications) will reach maturity, it will be a sim-pilots dream. (And by then I will hopefully finished the DIY motion platform that only exists in my head right now…)

[freehand]

51 minutes ago, Hiob said:

Of course I didn’t try every HMD that is out there currently. I‘m sure some are better in certain aspects than others. But from what I take in from tests and tech news (and user reports) there are still none, that excel in every aspect that is important to me.

I‘m not hating on VR, quite the opposite. If VR (and the applications) will reach maturity, it will be a sim-pilots dream. (And by then I will hopefully finished the DIY motion platform that only exists in my head right now…)

So which headsets you tried yourself.

[AhSoul]

The Quest 3 has great lenses and doesn't break the bank. You don't *have* to have a ninja GPU but obviously the lower the spec the more compromises you have to make.

I hate DLSS (too fuzzy) and ASW/SSS looks terrible with rotor blades for example. So I run MSAA 2x and target 72FPS to run the Q3 at that. This is with a 14700KF, 4080 Super, and 64GB DDR4. I think it looks pretty decent in-game and is very smooth. You just have to decide how much of a tradeoff in visual quality you are prepared to take based on your budget for the immersion that VR brings.

[TheFreshPrince]

Very interesting survey. Only 8% of the interviewed people are looking forward to new maps and only 23% to new modules lol. Most people just expect better DCS experience. Seems like ED got their priorities a liiiittle bit wrong.

(if this is representative)

Edited May 10 by TheFreshPrince