waiting for resolution RAZBAM Situation Post Archive (will be deleted)

[Notso]

6 hours ago, NineLine said:

If this is now a legal matter and if you are indeed sharing confidential information given to you directly from Ron, I am not sure I would go about publicly bragging about that. Most lawyers do not enjoy clients' public sharing of information (even via proxy) during legal proceedings. I know the full story of course from the perspective of my team. I am pretty confident I am not being lied to, call me naive but I have had a long and loyal relationship with Nick and the team and I have no concern at all that any of them, including if Nick is leading me down a false path. So maybe you do not have confidence in your information, but I have confidence in my management team. So unless Ron is giving you official information to be shared as official comments on his behalf, please let's drop the guessing and theories, because if you do not have high confidence in that, then this is all that is. Thanks.

I'm not sure what you mean by "bragging".  I've only discussed information that has already been publicly shared here and on other sites.  And like you, I have a lot of confidence in the information that's been shared with me, and it fits neatly in with the rest of the puzzle pieces that are out there.  But I DO know a lot more than has been discussed in public that I have pretty high confidence in, so please don't insult me by saying otherwise.

Tbh, though - I really don't care who is right or wrong in the end.  Whatever the dispute is and whoever is at fault really is irrelevant to the bigger picture - which is to get back to work and keep the modules healthy and strong on both sides.  Unfortunately, I feel like both parties are entrenched in "I'm 100% in the right and I'm not budging from my position".  I'm betting whatever the issue was that caused the dispute likely had very little true monetary impact on the other party and was more the "principle" that it occurred at all.  Certainly not to the level of the money that ED has withheld from RB so far (and counting).  Furthermore, I'm also betting the reality is that neither side's hands are totally clean in all this and both share some responsibility for getting us here.  Which is further ammunition for Nick and Ron to just say to each other - "look, you made your point - let's just move on".

Just saying.

 

Edited June 26, 2024 by Notso

[corvey]

Seems like this thread is being made to be out of context now with the deleted comments. Ugggg.  Guess I'll sign up to discord. UGGGG

 

Edited June 26, 2024 by corvey

[NineLine]

1 minute ago, Notso said:

I'm not sure what you mean by "bragging".  I've only discussed information that has already been publicly shared here and on other sites.  And like you, I have a lot of confidence in the information that's been shared with me, and it fits neatly in with the rest of the puzzle pieces that are out there.  But I DO know a lot more than has been discussed in public that I have pretty high confidence in, so please don't insult me by saying otherwise.

Tbh, though - I really don't care who is right or wrong in the end.  Whatever the dispute is and whoever is at fault really is irrelevant to the bigger picture - which is to get back to work and keep the modules healthy and strong on both sides.  Unfortunately, I feel like both parties are entrenched in "I'm 100% in the right and I'm not budging from my position".  I'm betting whatever the issue was that caused the dispute likely had very little true monetary impact on the other party and was more the "principle" that it occurred at all.  Certainly not to the level of the money that ED has withheld from RB so far (and counting).  Furthermore, I'm also betting the reality is that neither side's hands are totally clean in all this and both share some responsibility for getting us here.  Which is further ammunition for Nick and Ron to just say to each other - "look, you made your point - let's just move on".

Just saying.

The point is you are claiming to be repeating information directly from Ron, and I don't think that is a good look when none of it has been made as a public statement and only further tries to lay blame or label one side as the bad guy. You may not agree that is your intent, but it's how it reads in my opinion. As well suggestion that RB's DIscord is a friendly inviting place for both sides of the conversation is a little bit of s stretch as well. Like it or not you are seen as a representative of RB based on your title and your activity on their Discord, your words carry more weight, I am asking you to be more careful with your words, someone saying something wrong on these forums in your mind is no worse than all the times I have seen the wrong things said by users on the RB Discord, you do not need to feel the need to correct them or set them right. Everyone is allowed their opinion. Let them have it. 

[MustangSally]

1 hour ago, jojo said:

Works for me, I only tried in solo.
But other people confirmed that it works on MP servers, even with pilot + WSO and integrity check.

Works for me as well. Restarted all the training missions on the F-15E last night.....yes I'm optimistic!

[Notso]

18 minutes ago, corvey said:

I agree again, Notso. I personally never liked Jester in my F14, it kind of ruined it for me, that and I couldn't switch back into the the back seat multiplayer really turned me off the module, though they fixed the seating position since then.  Number one reason I don't want the Phantom.  The F15-E gave me peace of mind knowing I could control my Cadillac in sky the way I wanted to fly. The AI CO-pilot can be omitted entirely for all I care and at the very least optionally DISABLED.  The Sniper Pod is the highest priority on the list for me anyway.

And hey, Notso, I Never got around to saying thanks for the Youtube tutorial videos.  Thanks man, they've been helpful and I appreciate it.

 

All good.  Hopefully I can get back to making some more videos on a regular basis with lots of new features that will be added.  The one I was most looking forward to making was the AGM-130.  Hopefully, everyone has a good 6-9 hours to spend learning it.  

[Pipe]

21 minutes ago, freehand said:

I come here for updates not the in's and outs of she said he said.

no updates will be made in follow up posts, you just need to read the first post for updates...

[NineLine]

I am moving older parts of this thread into the previous thread to clean it up. Its become lots of nothing once again. 

[Hammer1-1]

1 hour ago, Notso said:

Why in the world do you need a Jester or George to fly the F-15E in SP?  Or even MP.  Its a perfectly capable jet to fly solo.  Is it BETTER with a human WSO - 10,000%,  But I honestly think a jester style GUI would make it more cumbersome to fly, not less.  

Because I cant multitask that well anymore. What can I not do in the front seat that the GIB can do? Maybe he specializes in A2G more than I do, maybe he knows the radar better than I do. I hate setting up the weapons on the fly. Granted Im probably one of the few that can fly the door gunner AND the helicopter in the huey, but after flying the Apache, I need someone working the controls while I work the gunners position and vice versa. George works very nicely nowadays, same as Petrovich.

Edited June 26, 2024 by Hammer1-1

[NineLine]

38 minutes ago, Hammer1-1 said:

Because I cant multitask that well anymore. What can I not do in the front seat that the GIB can do? Maybe he specializes in A2G more than I do, maybe he knows the radar better than I do. I hate setting up the weapons on the fly. Granted Im probably one of the few that can fly the door gunner AND the helicopter in the huey, but after flying the Apache, I need someone working the controls while I work the gunners position and vice versa. George works very nicely nowadays, same as Petrovich.

 

I am a fan of AI co-pilots\WSO\Whatever as well to be totally honest. 

[Wizard_03]

6 hours ago, Tom Kazansky said:

My hopes are different.

I hope both parties find a solution and don't tell us not a single word about the details.

I hoped the VEAO hawk situation would never happen again, they in fact said it couldn't happen again, yet here we are. 

[Hammer1-1]

10 minutes ago, NineLine said:

I am a fan of AI co-pilots\WSO\Whatever as well to be totally honest. 

getting old and worn out has its drawbacks. Right now I am eagerly awaiting the F/A-18D mod thats coming soon from IDF and I plan on having all sorts of fun with that plane. Even better that I know I can work the front seat just as well as the back seat, that luxury doesnt really exist for me in the F-15E because the training missions are...yeah, anyways...I cant read a manual as well as I used to either, and good squads that fit my personality are hard to come by.

10 minutes ago, Wizard_03 said:

I hoped the VEAO hawk situation would never happen again, they in fact said it couldn't happen again, yet here we are. 

they just up and left, and took their toys with them with nary a goodbye. Razbam is still here, just not performing work. We're not there yet...

[MustangSally]

35 minutes ago, Wizard_03 said:

I hoped the VEAO hawk situation would never happen again, they in fact said it couldn't happen again, yet here we are. 

Totally different situation

[NineLine]

35 minutes ago, Wizard_03 said:

I hoped the VEAO hawk situation would never happen again, they in fact said it couldn't happen again, yet here we are. 

This is different than the VEAO situation, and I hope for a better outcome all around.

[Flapjacks]

2 hours ago, Notso said:

  Hopefully, everyone has a good 6-9 minutes to spend learning it.  

Fixed that for ya 

[KungFu]

2 hours ago, Notso said:

Which is further ammunition for Nick and Ron to just say to each other - "look, you made your point - let's just move on".

 

 

 

When my ex wife brought home a new cat, it and the current cat would fight like demons.

Solution:  I put them both in the guest bathroom and closed the door.  Went to work 

Came back, they became best friends.

So, we lock Nick and Ron in a small room until we have a solution.

Edited June 27, 2024 by KungFu

[Slippa]

A small server where they dogfight it out in equal airframes.

F-15 v F-15

Spitfire v Spitfire

Christen Eagle v Christen Eagle. 

Winner gets to choose which new module they both build. 

 

[corvey]

3 hours ago, KungFu said:

So, we lock Nick and Ron in a small room until we have a solution.

 

 

Just get it over with already!  The best place IS Las Vegas, Nevada. 

What happens in Las Vegas stays in Las Vegas. 

Hmmmmm didn't a bunch of those guys go there recently?

Uhhhh NEVERMIND!  I'm not gonna ask...Don't even want to know.

[maxTRX]

1 hour ago, corvey said:

 

 

Just get it over with already!  The best place IS Las Vegas, Nevada. 

What happens in Las Vegas stays in Las Vegas. 

Hmmmmm didn't a bunch of those guys go there recently?

Uhhhh NEVERMIND!  I'm not gonna ask...Don't even want to know.

ok, last blurp before the thread goes:   poker table -  Nick's warbird v. Ron's F15E code+support... oh, and a promise to convert the Mudhen into an Advanced Eagle sometime later, at least power-plant wise

[Horns]

53 minutes ago, oldcrusty said:

ok, last blurp before the thread goes:   poker table -  Nick's warbird v. Ron's F15E code+support... oh, and a promise to convert the Mudhen into an Advanced Eagle sometime later, at least power-plant wise

Oh no way Nick wagers that baby 

[Notso]

5 hours ago, Hammer1-1 said:

Because I cant multitask that well anymore. What can I not do in the front seat that the GIB can do? Maybe he specializes in A2G more than I do, maybe he knows the radar better than I do. I hate setting up the weapons on the fly. Granted Im probably one of the few that can fly the door gunner AND the helicopter in the huey, but after flying the Apache, I need someone working the controls while I work the gunners position and vice versa. George works very nicely nowadays, same as Petrovich.

 

In the SE, once all the switches are set and ON - there is literally nothing the pilot can't do in the front by himself.  There are a few minor things that he can't HOTAS, but the function is there on the MPD with a button push.  But you can still do the action, task, event, whatever.  Conversely, there are a few things the WSO cannot do in the back that is a pilot only feature.  ACM/Auto acq radar modes, Shoot the gun and shoot A/A missiles being the big ones.  

I have nothing whatsoever against the jester type GUI (they are NOT AI btw).  For the modules like the Tomcat, F-4, etc where the duties front to back have a hard dividing wall and tasks cannot be done in the other cockpit - Jester type interfaces are essential.  But in the SE, it would literally take MORE effort, more button presses, and more brain cells to get Jester or whatever to do something for you than if you just did it yourself.  That's why a WSO GUI was never a priority for the SE - because it simply is not needed.  IMHO, for something to be useful in the SE to role play the WSO job in the back - it would need a level of sophistication and automation about 5x or more than that of the most current jester type GUI.  

Having said all that - having a human WSO in the SE that knows the jet and the crew works well together is peak DCS meta.  Nothing comes close to that for the WOW and giggle factor.

[Notso]

4 hours ago, Flapjacks said:

Fixed that for ya 

Yeah, LOL that's not going to happen.  I wasn't completely joking when I was talking about "hours" of video to properly describe and attempt to teach how to use the weapon - assuming its modeled correctly and behaves correctly.  Its probably one of the more complex and difficult weapons the SE has ever carried - past or present.  I don't doubt though that there are youtubers out there that will try to Mansplain it in 5 min or less and get it all wrong.  

[Flapjacks]

11 minutes ago, Notso said:

Yeah, LOL that's not going to happen.  I wasn't completely joking when I was talking about "hours" of video to properly describe and attempt to teach how to use the weapon - assuming its modeled correctly and behaves correctly.  Its probably one of the more complex and difficult weapons the SE has ever carried - past or present.  I don't doubt though that there are youtubers out there that will try to Mansplain it in 5 min or less and get it all wrong.  

Can't wait...I think lol

[Jayhawk1971]

vor 8 Stunden schrieb Notso:

In the SE, once all the switches are set and ON - there is literally nothing the pilot can't do in the front by himself.  There are a few minor things that he can't HOTAS, but the function is there on the MPD with a button push.  But you can still do the action, task, event, whatever.  Conversely, there are a few things the WSO cannot do in the back that is a pilot only feature.  ACM/Auto acq radar modes, Shoot the gun and shoot A/A missiles being the big ones.  

I have nothing whatsoever against the jester type GUI (they are NOT AI btw).  For the modules like the Tomcat, F-4, etc where the duties front to back have a hard dividing wall and tasks cannot be done in the other cockpit - Jester type interfaces are essential.  But in the SE, it would literally take MORE effort, more button presses, and more brain cells to get Jester or whatever to do something for you than if you just did it yourself.  That's why a WSO GUI was never a priority for the SE - because it simply is not needed.  IMHO, for something to be useful in the SE to role play the WSO job in the back - it would need a level of sophistication and automation about 5x or more than that of the most current jester type GUI.  

Having said all that - having a human WSO in the SE that knows the jet and the crew works well together is peak DCS meta.  Nothing comes close to that for the WOW and giggle factor.

So, Mover does have a point when he says he'd rather take the extra gas than a WSO...  

But seriously, I really would like to have some form of "Jester", for any "multicrew" aircraft at some point, for immersion's sake. Even now, with VAICOM Pro's AIRIO plugin, interacting with Jester 1.0 in the Tomcat is pretty straightforward, as long as the task isn't too exotic. And it can only get better from here. With the rapid development of Chatbot "AI" (which, I agree, it is not), player-to-module interaction has the potential to become much more organic. Which would be nice WRT an upcoming dynamic campaign (something that - at the current DCS development pace - my yet unborn grandchildren might have a blast enjoying, if future generations have the benefit of vastly extended lifespans )

Also, as I'm strictly SP, I'm ok with a more scripted environment, if it helps to suspend disbelief. For example, Reflected's campaigns for the Tomcat - especially "Speed & Angels" - make the RIO much more helpful and fluid (as it's a controlled, highly scripted environment) where the player can get a glimpse how beneficial good crew coordination can be. Hardly any micromanaging at all on the player's part. Not very flexible, but that's moot in a story-driven SP campaign.

 

[Notso]

16 minutes ago, Jayhawk1971 said:

But seriously, I really would like to have some form of "Jester", for any "multicrew" aircraft at some point, for immersion's sake. Even now, with VAICOM Pro's AIRIO plugin, interacting with Jester 1.0 in the Tomcat is pretty straightforward, as long as the task isn't too exotic. And it can only get better from here. With the rapid development of Chatbot "AI" (which, I agree, it is not), player-to-module interaction has the potential to become much more organic. Which would be nice WRT an upcoming dynamic campaign (something that - at the current DCS development pace - my yet unborn grandchildren might have a blast enjoying, if future generations have the benefit of vastly extended lifespans )

Also, as I'm strictly SP, I'm ok with a more scripted environment, if it helps to suspend disbelief. For example, Reflected's campaigns for the Tomcat - especially "Speed & Angels" - make the RIO much more helpful and fluid (as it's a controlled, highly scripted environment) where the player can get a glimpse how beneficial good crew coordination can be. Hardly any micromanaging at all on the player's part. Not very flexible, but that's moot in a story-driven SP campaign.

 

To be clear - I never said that the F-15E module wouldn't benefit from some sort of "virtual WSO" to help you out.  I was just saying that the current iterations of "jester" and whoever would bring very little benefit atm.  Even Jester 2.0 in the F-4, while great and he works pretty darn well, would be of little benefit to the Strike Eagle module, imo.  Which is why I said it was deemed to be a super low priority in the F-15E module's dev process. 

But yes, eventually a more advanced chatbot sort of thing where you could say stuff like "hey Notso, target the North and North middle groups in the leading edge" or "get me a designation on that Vehicle on the west side of the road" sort of thing would be amazing.  Maybe that's what "TALON" was envisioned to be.  But I think we're years away from the tech to be able to do that.

[Jayhawk1971]

vor 5 Minuten schrieb Notso:

LOL.  When you have so little gas to start with, that probably makes sense. 

Its interesting, I was having a discussion with a guy yesterday that was the lead test director on the F-15EX and he was describing the genesis of why the EX has a WSO cockpit when the USAF wanted it primarily to be an A/A platform as a replacement for the -15C.  They wanted the EX to be single seat.  But since cost was the biggest driver, Boeing was like " we don't have any single seat production lines left.  It would be cheaper to buy it as is and we'll just move the 5 switches to turn on stuff in the back to the FCP".  Boeing also said it would be more expensive to rip all that stuff out than to just leave it there.  So they did.  But all the C model mafia was "we're still only going to fly it single seat" because that's all they're used to.  But now that they're starting to get deliveries - the units are saying that "maybe it wouldn't be a bad idea to have a WSO after all.  We can do SOOOOO much more with the jet and even pure A/A is so much more effective with a WSO to help manage all the new systems and sensors".  Having flown the newest suite Strike Eagle in the sim lately - its quite overwhelming for a single pilot.  It CAN be done, don't get me wrong.  But its not as efficient or effective by yourself.  So no, most pilots if they're being honest, would NOT rather have 200lbs of extra gas.  That's what..... like 1 min of extra fuel?

Don't get me wrong, I'm generally in the "teamplayer", err, team myself. 

I suppose that, with anything that requires cooperation, if a team does gel well and get's coordination right, having additional eyes, ears, and brains (!) with you can and will be a huge force-multiplier. And if crews do not cooperate well, you'd end up ineffective, or worse.

It always baffles me when humanity develops technology that is supposed to lighten the workload and save resources but always seem to end up piling on. From task saturation in the Viper to trippling the amount of printed out pages in the "paperless office".  

From an outsider's perspective, the amount of red tape and ways of decision making in procurement are equally baffling.