FC-still the most popular Sim?

[Cali]

Side Note:

Question to those who fly the DCS series: Do you find these types of sims a little over the top? Could it be toned down a tad and still be a good high level sim.. Just wondering. I like study sims and will be investing in the DCS series when the fast movers come along but was wondering if you feel a bit too over the top, especially in Combat. My only reference to such a sim. was F4AF which I found enjoyable but then I began to skip over some of it's features such as the ramp start. I was more into the front panel Combat area and was wondering for those who fly the A10 if this is what you are also finding. Would appreciate some feedback on this. Perhaps in a fresh thread as this is not regarding FC2. :thumbup:

 

I don't thinkk it's over the top. I think a lot of people skip over the start up after a while, yes it's fun to do for a bit, then it's not (at least that's my thought). I only started up the Ka-50 1-3 times and did the auto start from then out.

 

Bring on FC3!!!

[Frostie]

I hate autostart I don't trust him to get it right, all the checks are made by me.

Then when it breaks and I try and eject, but can't, there's no one to blame but me.:doh:

[RIPTIDE]

The poll at SimHQ of course will be skewed a little: To English speakers only.

[Frostie]

The poll at SimHQ of course will be skewed a little: To English speakers only.

Don't feel left out though, we still love ya.

[RIPTIDE]

Don't feel left out though, we still love ya.

Haven't you got a heard of goats or something you should be tending to? :lol:

[winz]

Side Note:

Question to those who fly the DCS series: Do you find these types of sims a little over the top?

No. I actually enjoy Ka50 and A10C a lot more then FC 2.0, and sacrificing one-of a kind series, because some people prefer survey sims would be a sad thing for me.

 

I've never done, and propably never will do a auto-startup... I don't believe an aicraft, the is not set-up by me.

[Eddie]

Do you find these types of sims a little over the top?

 

Hell no!

 

Could it be toned down a tad and still be a good high level sim..

 

Absolutely not. There is still plenty of functionality left to be added.

[EtherealN]

Question to those who fly the DCS series: Do you find these types of sims a little over the top?

 

Absolutely not.

 

Could it be toned down a tad and still be a good high level sim..

 

Yes, but they'd become a less good sim than they were before the "toning down". IMO, your suggestion essentially is "please make the product less good". That's a subjective thing, but that is my opinion.

 

Just wondering. I like study sims and will be investing in the DCS series when the fast movers come along but was wondering if you feel a bit too over the top, especially in Combat. My only reference to such a sim. was F4AF which I found enjoyable but then I began to skip over some of it's features such as the ramp start. I was more into the front panel Combat area and was wondering for those who fly the A10 if this is what you are also finding.

 

I find that DCS A-10C is a wonderful thing, and after more than a year with it I still find it interesting to fly and fight. The thing you are lamenting is the entire reason why I remain interested at all. ;)

 

Comparing to FC2, it's a heck of a lot more interesting. Sure FC2 has things that DCS does not (yet) have - like those fastmovers - but there's so much more to combat planes than scrambling, launching a couple weapons and then landing again, and the simplified nature of the planes in FC2 does to a great extent come at the expense of capabilities. It gets easier to hop into, sure, but you can do a lot less than you would be able to in a DCS simulation of the same plane.

 

If it was a comparison of a DCS-level WW2 plane and, say, IL-2, I might not care as much about the difference, because it's not like IL-2 robs you of the ability to utilize your sensors (Mk1 Eyeball) or limits the use of your machineguns. But when it comes to modern planes, it is almost inevitable that any simplification will come at the expense of simply losing capabilities.

[rattler]

I can't comment on the DCS A10, as I don't fly it, but a question arises from a post I read, not sure if here or elsewhere, where the individual found in Combat that toggling all the switches etc. took away from his SA. Has anyone found this to be true or just need to practice. I ask because when the fast mover comes out, I would assume it will be similar to the A10 in terms of avionics etc. and toggle switches for the different MFD's. Cheers.

[EtherealN]

That sounds like a bad HOTAS setup, tbh.

 

There's a flipside to that coin however - if you compare the FC2 F-15C with what we would have in DCS:F-15C, you lose a LOT of SA support in FC2 - no datalinks, no radar automation, etcetera etcetera.

 

Essentially though - if you're tinkering with the MFCD mid-combat, you either have things set up wrong or you didn't plan your engagement properly. (Also, note that you can do a lot of controls on the MFCD through the HOTAS - that's the whole idea of a HOTAS after all; to have hands on throttle and stick.)

[GGTharos]

This individual needs to have a better HOTAS setup, needs to be set up for his attack before the run-in, and needs to KNOW what the HOTAS does.

 

This comes with

 

1) Planning, preparation and dedication to doing things right

2) Proper HOTAS setup!

3) Practice

 

I lose zero SA even while switching weapons. I can aviate, look around for threats etc all while changing weapon types and reassigning my targets. Not that hard. If you can't do it, the plane isn't at fault ... you're just not a good combat pilot ;)

 

The A-10C isn't over the top - it fairly precisely shows you the workload of a pilot when things are running smoothly.

 

I can't comment on the DCS A10, as I don't fly it, but a question arises from a post I read, not sure if here or elsewhere, where the individual found in Combat that toggling all the switches etc. took away from his SA.

[Succellus]

Althought i don t fly as much as i would, althoguht i am far from really dominating the KA and A10, i fond the A10A from FC2 boring now.

I really don t want them to backpedal.

If they can come with a floating soapox launching flies i ll be happier than if they come with some landlubber fixed wing.

Carrier is so much fun.

 

Anyway if you don t like max fidelity there s a plenty of options for you to tune down the features that get in your way....up to more basic than FC2 lvl.

[Cali]

Real pilots train for a very long time. F-15 pilots trained so much they memorized what the buttons felt like and knew what it did, without losing SA. Remember, that's their job and life, this is just a game for us. Most of us don't put in the hours in training for that. I'm not saying that we don't know what button on your HOTAS does this or that. I do know that if I don't fly for 2 weeks, I'm a little rusting on knowing what everything does at first. Like Etherea said, the FC2 F-15 has a lot of things missing.

[WynnTTr]

I can't comment on the DCS A10, as I don't fly it, but a question arises from a post I read, not sure if here or elsewhere, where the individual found in Combat that toggling all the switches etc. took away from his SA. Has anyone found this to be true or just need to practice. I ask because when the fast mover comes out, I would assume it will be similar to the A10 in terms of avionics etc. and toggle switches for the different MFD's. Cheers.

That's what the HOTAS is designed for. You'll only be flustered with buttons/switches if you went in unprepared and need to edit weapon profiles for a specific target. Other than that it's mainly all HOTAS work with only a few button presses.

[104th_Crunch]

Also, you can do most of combat without learning all the intricacies in the DCS series. For example, the nav systems. So there is still lots of room for those that don't want to, or can't spend the time to learn everything.

 

There are game modes in the DCS series as well. Though I never play them except out of curiosity. They get a bad wrap from the hardcore people. Not because they consider it to be lame to not want to know all the details, but as with a lot of things in life, things that take more time to learn can give you greater rewards.

 

ED do a great job with the game modes in FC/DCS for those that want it. I think their should be a dedicated ED server for the DCS series using game mode. I bet you it would be very popular. That would only help the hardcore part of it.

[empeck]

Question to those who fly the DCS series: Do you find these types of sims a little over the top?

 

No. But I prefer Black Shark over Warthog though (runs for cover).

 

I don't think FC3 is necessary unless it will bring new flyables (on a par with FC2 ones, maybe except Su-25T, I don't like the idea of complex simulation without clickable cockpit) or theatres.

[asparagin]

No. But I prefer Black Shark over Warthog though (runs for cover).

 

No! You are wrong!! :P

[rattler]

Great feed back guy's, appreciated.

 

When I suggested maybe a tone down on DCS I did not mean like FC2, sorry if I lead all in that direction. what I meant was maybe like ramp start, and some lesser important things and really concentrate on the Mfd's etc. etc. but I think you have given me a feel for that by using the HOTAS more than what FC2 really does. Yes , I see where the HOTAS has become much more important with the DCS aircraft. Thanks again for all the feedback, you all did a great job in explaining pros and cons. Looking forward to the fast mover. Hell you may even convert me to a MudMover.lol. cheers.:thumbup:

[GGTharos]

When I suggested maybe a tone down on DCS I did not mean like FC2, sorry if I lead all in that direction. what I meant was maybe like ramp start, and some lesser important things and really concentrate on the Mfd's etc. etc.

 

You really shouldn't have suggested anything without having played it. Just saying - you made suggestions without knowing what you were talking about. The ramp start isn't anything difficult. It's just a bunch of switches that you have to flip in order at the simplest, and if you want to do the full thing you also make sure to check the gauges and other instruments as everything powers up, watching for problems (and having learned what symptoms of problems may look like). There are emergency checklists that you should memorize, etc. Most people don't do this anyway, but those who do will have a few fun stories to tell when they are able to bring an aircraft back with severe damage.

 

And you're spared the IFFCC checks anyway ;)

Edited August 19, 2011 by GGTharos

[EtherealN]

But for the ramp start there's already the auto-start "cheats" where the sim does it all for you. ;)

 

Also, having the knowledge of how to start the plane properly is extremely vital when it comes to handling emergencies. The first time I had an engine failure in A-10C I knew almost "automatically" what I had to do to re-start it properly or at least verify whether it can be restarted. Someone that hasn't learned what the components are wouldn't stand a chance of expediting a restart. I had similar experience in DCS:BS where I once took a couple 23mm rounds too many into the right engine, but thanks to knowing my way around the cockpit through all the rampstart practice I was able to make a safe shut-down of that engine and proceed to put the other engine into proper operating mode to allow safe handling until such a point where I can calmly investigate the state of the engine.

 

Also, most of the "less important things" are usually such that you can pretty much ignore them completely anyhow. You don't need to know every single CDU function in the A-10C to be effective, so you won't be losing anything there. However, those that do avail themselves of the opportunity to learn those details can find ways to use them effectively, same way someone that knows his way around weapon profiles in the DSMS might find ways to make his weapon employment fit a given target better than someone who just drops them in default - but the guy who just uses default still has the weapon and can still be effective; just not as effective. You don't have to fiddle with HOF and fuse settings to have your cluster bombs be effective, but if you know how to do it you can do your job better - thus reducing the risk of having to do a dangerous re-attack.

 

But the point is that while I'm performing an attack with the A-10C, my hands stay 100% on the HOTAS. There's nothing I need that isn't on the HOTAS, including MFCD controls, mode selection for weapons, so on and so forth.

[rattler]

G and E ;

Thanks for that info, very useful info. I guess my HOTAS is going to get a workout. Hope to see some info on the fastmovers maybe by the New Year. I think the A-10 Looks like it could be fun so my HOTAS may be pressed into action sooner. Thanks guy's.:thumbup:

[GGTharos]

Yes it will, you'll have fingers like a bodybuilder! Hehe.

 

Incidentally, a lot of people have contributes HOTAS profiles, so you may want to have a look at an available one insteaf of or before choosing to roll your own. Some of them are very well thought out.

 

On the other hand, if you have a HOTAS Warthog, for DCS A-10C it's just plug and play ...

 

G and E ;

Thanks for that info, very useful info. I guess my HOTAS is going to get a workout. Hope to see some info on the fastmovers maybe by the New Year. I think the A-10 Looks like it could be fun so my HOTAS may be pressed into action sooner. Thanks guy's.:thumbup:

[rattler]

You really shouldn't have suggested anything without having played it. Just saying - you made suggestions without knowing what you were talking about. The ramp start isn't anything difficult. It's just a bunch of switches that you have to flip in order at the simplest, and if you want to do the full thing you also make sure to check the gauges and other instruments as everything powers up, watching for problems (and having learned what symptoms of problems may look like). There are emergency checklists that you should memorize, etc. Most people don't do think anyway, but those who do will have a few fun stories to tell when they are able to bring an aircraft back with severe damage.

 

And you're spared the IFFCC checks anyway ;)

 

Hi:

 

yes, I don't know DCS but after 30 years of being an ATC Supervisor, in charge of programming flight simulation for ATC Regional Schools and having to produce 100% accuracy in flight models for a single engine Piper Cub to todays newest aircraft, I think I am comfortable with making and educated guess on avionics etc. We also have to program military aircraft. So yes I do not know the particular in's and out's of DCS but I do know what the real aircraft do, not so much in Combat though as in just the Civil part. So not completely out of the picture. You guy's know the DCS series and thanks for all the info. I do really appreciate your time to inform me of how the DCS series works, in combat mode. It will take me to programming my HOTAS more than it is now. So thanks for the heads up. Cheers.

[Total]

Or download one of the many profiles...

 

I just got a CH Fighterstick and Pro Throttle. Didn't take but maybe 3-4 (all total) hours to program everything up.

[rattler]

Or download one of the many profiles...

 

I just got a CH Fighterstick and Pro Throttle. Didn't take but maybe 3-4 (all total) hours to program everything up.

 

 

Good idea,thanks I will check that out. cheers.