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If there is anything harder than air refueling I don't know what it is!


agathorn
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I'm sure its just like anything and needs lots and lots of practice but my oh my this is hard. I spent like 15 minutes today trying to get into formation and slowly work my way up. Near the end I could feel me getting better, but each time I get real close to the tanker, I found it very very hard to keep my movement subtle enough and I ended up way out of position and had to fall back for another try.

 

I'm sure it will feel real good once I finally nail this!

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I find it harder to fly in a tight formation with a really drunk wingman.

At least the KC-135 fly straight most of the time. ;)

 

Edit: to give you some sort of tip, try to adjust your curves to 30-40ish.

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Of course you need practice. A lot of it. The key thing is to keep your calm and not do any drastic/erratic stick moves even when your instinct tells you to (over-correcting). When you're hooked up and see you're getting too close or too far away from the boom, DON'T yank the stick just -gently- move throttle back and forth, doing slight speed correction..and at first it'll seem as if there's no difference, you're still moving away or getting too close..but just wait and keep your calm..there will be a slight delay when correcting speed..and you'll notice it. Just be concentrated and don't panic. Even if you crash into the tanker..not a big deal..keep the same attitude and practice..and you'll get the hang of it.

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I find it harder to fly in a tight formation with a really drunk wingman.

Ok you got me there :D

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Advanced apologies if my post contains typos or missing letters. Many of my posts are typed on a laptop with an old keyboard that has a personality all its own.

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Of course you need practice. A lot of it. The key thing is to keep your calm and not do any drastic/erratic stick moves even when your instinct tells you to (over-correcting). When you're hooked up and see you're getting too close or too far away from the boom, DON'T yank the stick just -gently- move throttle back and forth, doing slight speed correction..and at first it'll seem as if there's no difference, you're still moving away or getting too close..but just wait and keep your calm..there will be a slight delay when correcting speed..and you'll notice it. Just be concentrated and don't panic. Even if you crash into the tanker..not a big deal..keep the same attitude and practice..and you'll get the hang of it.

 

I try to treat every flight like its real. Knock on wood, but so far I have not damaged a tanker in my practice. I haven't gotten a hook up either but no ones been hurt lol.

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Advanced apologies if my post contains typos or missing letters. Many of my posts are typed on a laptop with an old keyboard that has a personality all its own.

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You spent 15 minutes trying and you thing that you know how much harder it is to air refueling? Go and train at least an hour per day and do that for a week. I'm sure that in the end its not so dificult. And I'm talking about a week training. Nothing compared to a proper combat flying in a CAS environment. You could spent several months on that and there's still alot remaining to master.

 

If you have default curves values in your axis settings inside game try to increase them to around 15/20. It becomes easier to do small adjustments. And don't forget to trim your plane before refuel. It's a must.

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One thing I'll say is: yes, this is hard. But do not worry. This is one of those things that "click", and I expect it's similar in RL. (My own experience IRL of maintaining formations, for example, had me flailing about for the first 15-20 flights, and then suddenly I had a stunned backseater that wondered "what the **** happened".)

 

The real thing is that you need two things:

1) A light hand: don't grip the stick, be very very gentle. Preferably, the forces involved should be like holding the stick between thumb and index finger, not a full "grip".

2) Something has to happen in your head - the point where intent and muscle movement becomes automatic. There's a very complex neurological explanation to how this works, but basically: this is something that can happen very suddenly so don't give up.

 

If you find yourself correcting and overcorrecting, just back off and restart. Way easier than trying to overcorrect constantly, and also lets you get back to practicing the thing that caused the problem, instead of spending a lot of time fighting the problem. Better to treat the cause, not the symptom.

 

And of course, if you get frustrated, kill the AWACS with your gun (simulated flight is nice: no courts to deal with after you handle your frustrations!), go do something else for 10 minutes, then do it again. (Another advantage of simulators. :) )

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And that's a good thing? ;)

 

Sometimes it is. :D

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For me its not the approach to the tanker thats indeed easier than a close formation, but for me its so hard to stay connected or even refuel without disconnections :joystick:

 

The smallest movements leads to a disco. thats very frustrating and the time effort is much bigger than a refueling at an airfield.

 

In videos from RL it looks easier to stay connected

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNpds9qQiwM&feature=endscreen&NR=1 :megalol:

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And of course, if you get frustrated, kill the AWACS with your gun (simulated flight is nice: no courts to deal with after you handle your frustrations!), go do something else for 10 minutes, then do it again. (Another advantage of simulators. :) )

EterealN No matter how neatly in formation you are, you will NEVER get fuel from an awacs.:D

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EterealN No matter how neatly in formation you are, you will NEVER get fuel from an awacs.:D

 

Speak for yourself. You probably don't have the same relationship to the AWACS guys as EtherealN seems to have.

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For me its not the approach to the tanker thats indeed easier than a close formation, but for me its so hard to stay connected or even refuel without disconnections :joystick:

 

The smallest movements leads to a disco. thats very frustrating and the time effort is much bigger than a refueling at an airfield.

 

In videos from RL it looks easier to stay connected

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNpds9qQiwM&feature=endscreen&NR=1 :megalol:

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1538423&postcount=26

 

not easy :joystick:

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EterealN No matter how neatly in formation you are, you will NEVER get fuel from an awacs.:D

 

Refueling IS flying formation, and it works beautifully.

 

If you mean IRL: of course not. :P But the formation-flying technique is the same.

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When you're hooked up and see you're getting too close or too far away from the boom, DON'T yank the stick just -gently- move throttle back and forth, doing slight speed correction..and at first it'll seem as if there's no difference, you're still moving away or getting too close..but just wait and keep your calm..there will be a slight delay when correcting speed..and you'll notice it.

 

If you actually see you're getting too close or too far away, you are already too late with your corrections, because of the delay. You have to anticipate. It's like a sense/instinct that you're getting for example a bit too slow soon, and you have to correct that in advance. Kinda hard to explain, but I think you know what I mean.

 

You spent 15 minutes trying and you thing that you know how much harder it is to air refueling? Go and train at least an hour per day and do that for a week.

 

I would say for a month. :)

 

And yes, I have tweaked the curvature too, both throttle and stick.

 

And yes, train formation flying. It helps you to learn adjust your speed with other aircraft, subconsciously and automatically.

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:D

 

Indeed! :thumbup:

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agathorn

indeed air refuelling is a challenge I yet to master. work your way from the ground up.

 

1- print the air refuel flow pages from the manual, read them so you get familiar.

2- watch youtube vids. there are multiple techniques that can be learnt, such as barn doors and without, cockpit position in relation to boom.

3- *** Important ***

From the mission editor, jot down tanker speed and altitude. The common finding, is that if precontact set at 16,000 feet, 20 feet higher should be your hard deck (16,020 feet)

 

4- use autopilot with the tanker without actual refuel. It will help you become familiar with formation and once you're satisfied, back off, trim and 5- practice trimmed flight

6- go clean at first (no loadouts)

7- use trim and stick against eachother for fine control to grasp.

 

meaning: trim nose down a bit (like your TVV is -5°) and pull back on stick to zeroize on the 0° horizon line) cancel by simultaneously pulling trim and pushing stick forward. this is a great way to practice minor (sub -/+ 5° corrections.)

 

8- try and join a multiplayer clan for refuelling. a man on deck is even more help aid in estimating boom proximity and contact.

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I found freefalcon disgustingly hard to afuel.

 

Actually, I found all flavors of Falcon easier to AA refuel in - you simply don't have a long pole sitting in front of you to occasionally/accidentally fixate on.

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