Gman109

IMO your best bet is to just buy another TWCS. I've found them for $50 USD on sale and for 20 to 30$ USD used in as new condition. If the Virpil throttle is out of your price range or is overkill, I imagine the TM WH throttle is as well. The only other options really are the CH which you already mentioned, and the TWCS, so far as stand alone throttles go. I used to be able to luck out and pick off TM Cougar Hotas for $50 to 100 CAD in great condition here in Canada a couple times per year, but it's been 18 months since I've found one that wasn't overpriced. If you can find a Cougar hotas/throttle, grabbing that and picking up a USB adapter is about the only other option I can think of, and will certainly cost more, probably 2x, than what a TWCS will.

If you have the $, my answer is this - Open window. Pick up PC case. Drop towards foot. Kick hard towards window. Wave as it goes bye-bye out said window. Purchase 9900k and 2080ti like the rest of us pinheads who spend far too much $ on this hobby. The end. Seriously though - yes, GPU is probably your best bet, by some margin, but I don't think swapping to a faster CPU in that MB/platform will yield all that much of an improved performance either. IMO I agree with others that a 1080ti used is probably the best option bang for buck wise if you want to upgrade anything with that system.

If TM made a new and better gimbal for the stick, I would. I have 2 complete TM WH hotas and 2 more WH sticks/bases. Every base but one which is essentially new, I've had to tear apart and service. TM's support is a thumbs down from me, but the metal stick and throttle are decent IMO. Gimbal - not so much.

I've got a lot of hotas already, but just recently decided to give the Realsimulator FSSB R3 L a whirl anyhow, mainly due to the Falcon module coming so soon. Still figuring it out, but it's fantastic so far as an F16 type stick goes. The only similar stick I have is the X65F, and it's miles ahead of that so far as I can tell with about 3 hours total using it thus far. I was lucky and found my R3 used, very little time on it, probably just a handful of hours from a player who couldn't get used to it for a WW2 online MMO sim. You may want to PM Deano87, he gave me the initial advice and info regarding the R3 L/Realsim, and he and many he flies with have been using this stick for much, much longer than I have, and can give you a better run down on what to expect. IMO so far as getting the most realistic hotas setup for the upcoming Falcon module here with DCS, it's the best option for the stick. I'm going to use one of my modded Cougar F16 throttles with a usb adaptor for my throttle. the R3 L for the stick, and probably my Slaw pedals for my F16 hotas setup myself. Anyhow, PM Deano87 or search his user name and look at some of the threads where he's posted info here already, that's your best bet IMO.

I had a similar problem, same exact symptoms, neither Windows or Virpil software would see my buttons, by the axis worked (sort of, but it worked). Same exact scenario too, I went with a T50 CM 1 stick on a WH base, to a first gen when they first came out T50 base, and then put the original Virpil T50 CM1 Stick on the new Virpil base. What had happened was the pins in the connectors sort of "formed" or "got used to" the Warthog connector plug, which was slightly different with a bit different tolerances, so one of the pins in my new Virpil base/stick wouldn't connect right. I pulled out the stick cable about an inch or so, so I could physically see how it was connecting to the new Virpil base. Then I straightened the pins out a bit, re plugged it good and solid into the Virpil base, and then the buttons and axes (everything) started to work again properly. Not saying this is your problem, but I suggest taking your Virpil stick off your new Virpil base, have a good look at the pins/connector, even take a pic or vid of it and post it here if you can - and then try what I said or ask Virpil to walk you through that (they told me how to do this, but it's simple, just gently pull the plug on the stick out a short bit to give it some slack).

I really like this stick now - I much prefer to have my analogue mini stick on my dominant hand/stick side, as for me it's much more accurate than trying to move it with my left hand/thumb on a throttle. I have the other available Virpil sticks including a couple of the Delta's, but I find the Delta's aren't set up that great for simming, more for space/Star Citizen, and the analogue stick is easy enough to reach, but the center/top hat isn't even with pretty large hands. So, this stick fits the bill for me, more of a sim setup than the Delta, and has the analogue hat in a perfect spot IMO. I'll be buying one at least, plus the F14 stick whenever it comes out too.

It's personal pref, but the Virpil cam WITH the detent is miles ahead of the TM WH cam. The Virpil without the detente is as well. You'll just have to try it and see which you prefer, the difference is subtle so far as the center detentes go IMO, but the movement as you get further out in the stick throw, the difference in cams becomes a bit more noticeable. I use the no detente Virpil cams for my space games, and with detente for sims. You'll like both a lot more than your TM stick/gimbal, I'll tell you that for nothing. So far as speed regarding the processing and delivery, patience will need to be a virtue. It's been highly variable for the 5 orders I've made in total, but none were super fast, that's for sure. It's the ONLY thing I've found that VKB did a bit better - I ordered one of my Gunfighters on a Thursday night at 11pm, and got it the next Tuesday at 9am. That's not going to happen with Virpil due to both their shipping method (blah) and their processing time - and how busy they are right now . That said, the wait is WELL worth it. Just be prepared for it, and don't fuss too much about it. Most likely within 7 business days you'll order will ship. After that, it's done to the gods and the universal mail/whatever they use truly effing sucks IMO, but it's what they and we are stuck with.

I lived and worked in Hong Kong for most of a year back in 1996. I did business on the mainland (when forced too) as well. There are many great Chinese people, like the OP and the other DCS Chinese players he mentions. Unfortunately there is a systemic abuse of copyright and other standard business practices we take for granted in Western/Russia/Etc countries. If I were in ED's shoes, this would be my position - since it'll be nearly impossible to stop this, or get any financial compensation, why not embrace it. Any publicity is good publicity, being the theory, and there is a massive, massive potential client base in China. As the OP stated, there is a HUGE upswell in interest in military things among Chinese, especially the upcoming generation. Many have a lot of expendable income now, compared to the past generation, and the more who get into DCS/sims, the better it is for the developers, and hence all the rest of us. Making a big stink about this will serve little purpose IMO, as again, nothing much will come of it based on past experience, and as others have said here, larger US companies who have gotten the "tough crap" card when they've tried legal sanctions. Best course of action IMO, I repeat, is to try and exploit the exploiters here, and somehow get some advertising of DCS/ED's own going in China. Not sure on how this will work what with the "Golden Shield" PRC government firewall and rules, but if DCS is "allowed", or even at worst "grey area"...again, ED could stand to make a lot of $ from future potential Chinese players. OP/Eagle Sur Pekin, and other Chinese players, I wish you all the best, and am very glad you're part of this community. The J11 and future Chinese DCS modules have the potential to be fantastic additions here. The more Chinese players, the better IMO. I realize news like this can be a piss off, and rightfully so, having lost a business and been forced to leave Hong Kong with the 1997 handover myself. ED/the rest of us, are well within rights to be outraged over this blatent type of theft. Again, it's not abnormal in China for companies to rip stuff and and pull this crap, and there is little real recourse within China to deal with it. It'd be a better option to have Chinese DCS players state on these stolen games forums/etc to post about DCS and ED, and recommend any fans of this "stolen" IP we're seeing in the OP videos, to check out DCS for real themselves. Out of the several million members mentioned by the OP, if even a fraction of a percent try out a DCS module, that's a massive kick in the $ pants for ED.

In Canada the Reverb is listed as "in stock" now on the HP Canada website. It says 1 to 2 weeks for delivery, so we'll see how long it takes, as I ordered mine yesterday. Hopefully it is the "new gen", if it isn't, and I have any trouble with the cord/etc, it's going right back for a refund.

OP/Jason, are you certain the base/gimbal is dead as well? I have an extra TM A10/WH stick or two kicking around, and would be willing to help you out. PM me, I'd prefer to have a phone/voice call with you to troubleshoot your base, I have quite a number of extra parts (I've had many TM WH units since they came out, 4 currently, and tons of parts from the repairs/gimbal improvements/etc I've made with various sticks and throttles). Don't give up. Worst case, I'm sure you can sell that F18 stick for what you have into it, I'll pay retail for it from you if nothing else to help you out, but I do think this is salvageable in terms of the gimbal/base. I also have a bid in this week on a used Cougar and Warthog set here in Canada, might end up getting the WH stick/base (no throttle, which you don't need unless you broke it too - sorry, mild attempt at humor), for $100 CAD or about 78$ USD. Plus I have a couple of mine sitting around doing nothing as I said. Anyhow, again, contact/PM me, and I'll see what I can do to help you out. I know it must suck getting a new stick like the F18 and having your trusty old reliable 10 year old WH bite the dust at last, pretty bad timing. Seeing that you're in Canada simplifies things greatly as well on my end....

Back when I was editor @combatsim.com, I had a writer/friend named Andy Bush, who was a retired USAF pilot, that flew the F4 in Vietnam, the F104, F15, and the A10 as well. He had a lot of A10 time in Europe during the Cold War. I'll look up some of his articles/posts I've saved, but he echoes much of what's being said here IIRC - the A10 was NOT optimal for killing T6x,T72, T80, etc Soviet tanks with the GAU 8 30mm. Lining up for the optimal shot, a low altitude/slant range shot from the rear of the tanks, also put the A10 right over the Soviet primary AAA defenses like the ZSU23/4 and other mobile SAMS and guns - bad news. 30mm was great vs AFV and trucks, in fact that was its primary purpose from what he wrote and said, not killing heavy MBTs. Lots of 30mm ammunition also meant a lot of logistical vehicles in the enemy rear could be zapped per mission, while the M1 tanks and AH1/AH64 used their missiles vs Soviet tanks. Again, I'll find some of his articles and post links later tonight.

Ah ok thanks. They don't make that very clear, in fact the opposite, that the R3 Lightning is the current model, what with the R3 Warthog having the description it has, plus being at the top of the column. I'll order the Lightning on Monday then, plus the Shapeways part.

Absolutely, they are $400 CAD here in Canada on sale, so that's a good deal right now IMO. It's still a good HMD option, for sure.

This is what I see on their order page, still today - It's not even been a full day since I emailed them, and once I get an email back, perhaps then stock/etc will be made clear. There isn't a "Buy" button or option that I can see. Maybe I'm in the wrong spot, but the R3/Warthog is top of the column under consumer, and by description they say it's their newest and most up to date model, which is obviously the one I want. ONLY AVAILABLE UNDER REQUEST FOR PROFESSIONAL USE Contact sales@realsimulator.com for ordering information Availability: UNDER DEMAND Again, I don't have any experience with higher end force sensing sticks as stated, I only have the x65f on which to base an opinion - that and the 4 pages of threads you get when you search "FSSB R3" here, 1/3 or more of which are posts with people selling theirs. I'll clarify(and repeat) - the problems I'm reading aren't with the hardware or compatibility (that's primarily a Brunner issue, to restate), but with users having issues with setting them up or understanding how to do so, at least that's what I've read here and on 2 other sim forums (IIRC it's against the rules to link to these). I do suspect/have concerns, that the FSSB/R3 will have much the same functionality of the X65 in terms of sensitivity and precision. I don't know any DCS PvP players that use one (RealSim FSSB). It may be precise for you when you don't have to move it under stress conditions, but have you put that to the test where it is truly under trial, versus human opponents especially in guns head to head fights? I'm asking, not telling. This is the criteria I use when determining a stick's accuracy/potential - I can fly around with my left foot if I want, and call it "precise", but if it isn't when the rubber meets the road in terms of in game combat conditions vs other skilled human players, for me, it's not so much. One issue I've seen players here in DCS mention is that, and I quote from Supmua here, "it is difficult to input small amount of force near the center.". This issue is one that originally plagued the first Warthog Cougars when they first came out, due to software and hw issues upon release, and it made it pretty much unusable for COMPETITIVE online play, as it makes shooting, in particular lining up and making corrections for gun shots, extremely difficult. This is one of my specific concerns, as well as problems to which I've been referring to. Still, I'm going to try one out, if nothing else just to have one to mess with and use with the F16C module here(even if only in offline or coop multiplayer/etc), as the FSSB/R3 wasn't high on my radar until this thread. Some of the Monster mount plates I have are already compatible with it too, an added surprise/bonus. Lastly, I'll be looking for some input/etc once I get mine from those of you with experience with them here (Deano+anyone else), as there are literally no Youtube vids out there in terms of in depth how-to guides, or even a single review, just a couple vids from the company showing basic things and a couple vids about issues/solutions users have had.

I realize the R3 is a force sensing stick, I thought I made that clear (read my post again). I said that force feed back is something I'm not all that into, but that I am interested in the FSSB as it's force sensing, not force feedback. From what I've read in the various threads here, there are still issues with it, maybe that's just user problems, but every thread here has someone with some issue with them. They seem to be backordered according to their website, but I have an email in and hopefully they are available soon, as I wouldn't mind trying the R3 out, or their new F16 stick either. I have the early CH force feedback unit (like a combat/fighterstick with a giant FFB base) and a couple others, and have 2 Saitek X65F which are force sensing. Again, neither are really my cup of tea, I find both to give up too much in terms of accuracy. Perhaps with a ton of time and practice one could get better, but I just find the non FS/FFB gimbals/sticks to be more precise for me. It took my a fair bit to not wallow all over the sky like a drunken cow with the X65F, I'm sure it'd be a repeat performance with the R3, but time will tell on that I guess. I was also referring to the Brunner force feedback stick as well so far as it not being DCS compatible, and it isn't, not by a long shot yet. You are correct though still, if someone in DCS wants the closest thing to an F16 stick, the FSSB/R3 and a Cougar or even WH stick due to the nature of the base (force sense) is probably as close as one can get. Throttle wise it's still the Cougar for now IMO, and since I don't really want to be playing PvP with force sense or FFB, probably a T50/Warbrd base and the Cougar stick is the next best option.

Possibly. I should probably add a caveat for $1000USD or under per single unit hotas, as both the Brunner and RealSim stick + base(Realsim's new F16 stick and the R3 base together) are well over that, and I've not collected any of that commercial/military grade-ish stuff. I've been following the Realsim stuff closely, I only have a few FFB/force sense sticks in my collection, never really liked force feed back, but the Realsim stuff may be something I pick up, ONCE they are completely compatible with DCS/etc. I've been following the threads for both Realsimulator and Bruner FFB here and on other sim boards, and despite FFB not ever having been "my thing" or something I collected, you may be right, and they may be "the" stick to have. Both seem to have big issues with compatibility/etc with DCS and other sims right now. Once that's all ironed out and there are good guides to follow for them, I'll pick both up I think and see how they run.

Most of us here who ran O+ have said the exact opposite. I can go into the Rift S thread that is pinned and find a 1/2 dozen members and dozens of posts about how we were all very surprised to find the Rift S gave better clarity/picture/details/etc than the O+ does. I was extremely surprised in fact, given the stats/specs of the Rift S, that it was better than the 3 O+ units on a bunch of different PCs and gaming laptops I used both with. The O+ is great, don't get me wrong, and if someone has limited $, getting a used O+ is a super option (I sold mine for 275$ CAD each, so about 225 USD ish or so I think). Believe me, I wouldn't have gone through the PITA of setting up a different VR HMD (again, I've owned all of them except the new Reverb which I'm still waiting for, and the $5000 xtal), if the Rift S wasn't an improvement over the O+.

Agreed, Logitech has a very, very solid rep when it comes to mice, and keyboards too, even though I personally hate their Romer G switch, quality wise, they have been great. I will say that the X65Fs I have (2 of them, and I have had 2 others) are a bit higher up the quality scale, I think due to their cost that perhaps they had their own separate build team, or at least tighter quality control. I have nothing to base this on other than no other explanation as to why they are better than the x36/45/52/55/56s I've tried and owned.

I've flown another sim since 1999 online (Aces High), and a long time player/friend there worked for CH for many years. The owner of CH sold the company in 2007, which was unfortunate for dedicated sim players for a few reasons I won't get into here. Still, CH is a great option to this day with a 20+ year old design. I hunt for bargains on HOTAS to add to my hotas collection daily, all the used forums/etc here in Canada plus worldwide. I found a CH Fighterstick and Throttle that were both brand new, totally unused, from a kijiji.ca add a couple months back - cost me $30 CAD, so about 22 USD for both, delivered. This isn't even the best deal I've found either, got a TM Cougar that was fantastic condition for $30 + 10$ shipping. ha. ha. ha. Hah! CH made their first rudder pedals differently than the current ones, the only moved in one axis, like the toe brake axis, and were VERY solid. A bit narrow though, but some of the best pedals out there until the new custom ones started showing up. https://www.amazon.com/CH-Products-PD55KAS-Rudder-Pedals/dp/B00004TOYT To answer the OP question - I'd take a good used Fighterstick (or new one) before I took any Saitek, including the X65f(I have 2 of these, as well as examples of every other Saitek hotas going back to the x36).

It's okay, I ran Odyssey+ HMDs for a while, and for a time IMO they were the best bang/$. No longer though, the Rift S IMO (and many other Ody+ users opinions too) is a better HMD. Cost is similar-ish (Rift S here for me is 70 USD more than the Ody+), but the picture/detail/performance is better with the Rift S. The only negative is sound is a bit of a step down with the Rift S, but that is easily fixed by using the Rift S sound plug and some ear buds, or just putting a headset on overtop of the Rift S. The sound isn't "that" bad stock either, it's just not as good as the Ody+.

This, plus: I have zero brand loyalty, if AMD's new CPUs provide more performance/fps in DCS, I'll happily sell my 9900k platforms and switch. I'm not seeing any evidence of this so far, nor in most other games - the 9900k/2080ti combo still looks so far to be overall a bit faster. That, and the fact that I've been using them for 9 months now, and the new Ryzen stuff just came out, so I'd rather wait another quarter or two and see what Intel answers with before making any major swaps of MB/CPU. I know many also care about ratio and bang/$, but I don't, not within reason at least, if a couple/few hundred more $ gets me a faster performing platform, that's what I want still. I have zero interest in Blender/whatever application performance, watching a little cup/icon spin around and faster rates doesn't hold much interest for me, all i care about with a gaming PC is the end result in terms of FPS/quality. If I was to hit my upgrade cycle right now, perhaps the fastest AMD Ryzen cpu would hold some interest, but even then, as others have posted the 8600k and 8700k are still right in the running, and switching from them to AMD is still a pretty open question if gaming is priority one.

Prior to the Rift S release we were using Pimax and Ody+ VR HMDs. I was very surprised at the Rift S perfomance based on its stats pre release, and sold the Ody+ units in favor of Rift S units, which all users here are very happy with. Pimax not so much, PITA, although the FOV is nice. The Reverb is something I was highly anticipating, but it still isn't available in Canada, and based on all the problems, I'm happy to wait for the Acer Ojo instead, or a Reverb 2.0 or at least 1.0 version that is more consistent in terms of QC.

What exactly is "dodgy" hardware? Is that hardware that somehow dodges you are something?

Remi, I'll take that Index off your hands if you're looking to sell/trade it. I want to compare it to the Rift S and Reverb side by side myself. If you're really that into 4k, I'd be willing to trade you a real 4k gaming lcd (not a crappy 4k tv being used for gaming), either a PG27UQ or X27, both are 1000 nit 144hz Gsync gaming LCDs, and still close to $2000 USD after tax/shipping new. I have one of each available and both are in open box/like new condition, with only a few hours of run time on them, and the 3 year factory full coverage warranty available for registry. I'd be willing to trade straight up for your Index, or pay cash$ instead if you prefer (and want to stick with crappy 4k 60hz tv gaming).

HP Canada rep just called me back today, and let me know that the Reverb will be available in 3 to 4 weeks, as they are correcting issues with every Reverb that was selected to be shipped to Canadian resellers. I asked her if she knew if it was replacing the cable/whatever, but she didn't know specifics, just that they had to pull the entire shipment for Canada and replace/fix problems with each unit. So, we'll see I guess. She's going to call and notify me as soon as she knows they are on the way to their HP store warehouse and the resellers like BestBuy and Amazon.