VR is so real that...

[KLR Rico]

Everyone says that VR is immersive, and it makes you feel like you're in the game, but how far does it go?

 

I had a moment last night where I tried to brace my hand against the cockpit wall while twisting around in my seat during a dogfight. It was a little jarring when I reached out and hit nothing but air. :lol:

 

Have you forgotten yourself and done something funny?

[cichlidfan]

TIR has already caused me to try and change the view on YouTube videos by turning/tilting my head.

 

I expect far worse from VR. :)

[Aginor]

Haven't tried it in DCSW yet, but I get sick in every game in which the character moves. I fear that will happen in DCSW as well.

 

BUT: Some of them make you really feel "there", at least for a short time. I ducked more than once to avoid hitting my head on something. :D

[Kal-El]

Haven't tried it in DCSW yet, but I get sick in every game in which the character moves. I fear that will happen in DCSW as well.

 

BUT: Some of them make you really feel "there", at least for a short time. I ducked more than once to avoid hitting my head on something. :D

 

"at least for a short time...." ??? Does the 3d/presence immersion goes away the more you play the game ???

cuz I heard something like that before and I was not able to ask what he meant by that.

Edited April 10, 2016 by Thunderchiff

[Yurgon]

TIR has already caused me to try and change the view on YouTube videos by turning/tilting my head.

 

I expect far worse from VR. :)

 

Not to worry, probably happened to almost every single member on this forum (your's truly being guilty as charged just a couple hours ago on Wags' Gazelle live stream). :D

 

And yeah, I'm sure VR is only going to make it worse.

 

The thing is, I couldn't really use the Cougar MFDs or the keyboard with a VR headset, and reaching for the mouse might also feel a little weird. For the time being, I'll let others be the testers, but some rather overwhelming responses regarding AAR and generally a much better sense of immersion mean I'll probably go for it in the foreseeable future.

 

In the meantime, it'll be mighty interesting to see what other types of reactions people will come up with in this thread. :D

[KLR Rico]

Haven't tried it in DCSW yet, but I get sick in every game in which the character moves. I fear that will happen in DCSW as well

 

I get sick really quickly with FPS type controls, dreadhalls for example. In DCSW I've had not even a little bit of discomfort, except for when I've ejected from the plane and start walking around. Standing is OK though.

[Aginor]

"at least for a short time...." ??? Does the 3d/presence immersion goes away the more you play the game ???

cuz I heard something like that before and I was not able to ask what he meant by that.

 

I meant that in some scenes it is more grabbing than in others.

If not much is happenbing in the simulated world you become more aware that you are in fact sitting or standing around in your home.

 

But yes, I think the same mechanism that makes you adjust your brain in order to not get sick anymore somewhat lessens the VR experience over time.

I haven't used VR long enough to really tell myself though.

[WinterH]

I've only experienced Oculus Rift with a roller coster demo. I was feeling the nonexistant G force :P. It really was some experience... but also it made clear to me that these devices are not suitable for flight simming as I understand it. Can't see controls we interface with the sim, resolution is so bad feels like back to 90s, and to get decent performance with even that, a prohibitively expensive PC might be needed.

 

So, I am sure in a few years time will come, but for now VR devices for flight sims feels more like a novelty than a practical reality to me. However, I admit a very awesome novelty to experience.

[lanmancz]

Hehe, trying to move youtube videos with my head is something everyone here probably experienced :-) I haven't get a chance to try any VR yet but I am itching to get one (+ a new PC suitable for running it) in the future. But I don't really see the problems with controls (not being able to use keyboard). Even in A10C, the aircraft that probably demands most controls so far, I have things setup in a way that I do not need to take my hands of stick and throttle at all, except for radio comms (which can be solved by voice attack or similar). The mouse on the other hand might be a bit tricky but didn't Wags say some time ago that they are working on implementing some sort of laser pointer solution ? Is the headset precise enough that you can use your head to point at controls and use some button that you map on your stick as a mouse click ? If that's the case then it seems that the controls might be fine in VR. We could just use 1s hold to activate/deactivate the laser and short click to ... click :-) How does this currently work in DCS ? This is something that should be possible to do even with TrackIR, right?

Edited April 11, 2016 by lanmancz

[Revelation]

Hehe, trying to move youtube videos with my head is something everyone here probably experienced :-) I haven't get a chance to try any VR yet but I am itching to get one (+ a new PC suitable for running it) in the future. But I don't really see the problems with controls (not being able to use keyboard). Even in A10C, the aircraft that probably demands most controls so far, I have things setup in a way that I do not need to take my hands of stick and throttle at all, except for radio comms (which can be solved by voice attack or similar). The mouse on the other hand might be a bit tricky but didn't Wags say some time ago that they are working on implementing some sort of laser pointer solution ? Is the headset precise enough that you can use your head to point at controls and use some button that you map on your stick as a mouse click ? If that's the case then it seems that the controls might be fine in VR. We could just use 1s hold to activate/deactivate the laser and short click to ... click :-) How does this currently work in DCS ? This is something that should be possible to do even with TrackIR, right?

 

The mouse works just fine with OR DK2. I see no reason it won't continue to work with CV1.

[Aginor]

Really? Isn't the mouse kind of... hovering over everything?

(I haven't tried DCSW myself yet, but I watched a 3D vid on Youtube)

[kontiuka]

TIR has already caused me to try and change the view on YouTube videos by turning/tilting my head.

 

I expect far worse from VR. :)

Yup. I've done that about 1000 times.:music_whistling:

[Aginor]

Yeah, it gets pretty annoying.

 

Fun fact: Recently I was standing behind a family member who also plays DCSW just watching and backseat-driving the Huey. I kept turning my head to look to the sides, it was was hilarious in a way. :D

[Yurgon]

Even in A10C, the aircraft that probably demands most controls so far, I have things setup in a way that I do not need to take my hands of stick and throttle at all, except for radio comms (which can be solved by voice attack or similar).

 

Even with TM Warthog and the Cougar MFDs, I really need to use the keyboard and the mouse a lot during most missions, especially the immersive and realistic ones. Oh, and a piece of paper as well to note down freqs, coordinates and other info. Then read said info, tune radios, create waypoints and input coords via the CDU. With a properly set up keyboard, this goes pretty well, maybe even better than in the real aircraft. I can't imagine how VR would not slow this process down considerably.

 

How do you deal with all that right now?

 

Fun fact: Recently I was standing behind a family member who also plays DCSW just watching and backseat-driving the Huey. I kept turning my head to look to the sides, it was was hilarious in a way. :D

 

Haha, yeah, same here when a buddy tried his hand on the MiG-21 and I wanted to point him to the gear handles and so on. :)

 

Besides, right after that he ordered his own TrackIR - too bad they don't have a loyalty program for people who recommend their stuff. ;)

[pittlebelge]

I tried to TIR whilst driving... Came to my senses quikly enouth though.

 

On the mouse in VR: while I'm not a big fan of the current implementation, I dont find it immersion breaking. My biggest gripe is that ithe cursor wants to click someting slightly to tits side. But even with that inconcenience, ever since I received the DK2, I Loved the DCS VR experience and I have never looked back.

 

The resolution is a major issue and I cant play combat mission in the A10 because I cant make anything on the TGP. But I never have had so mutch fun just flying around. On a more active note, I recently got the M2000 and I'm having a blast dogfighting the AI over the Georgian mountain in the sunset.

 

On the control side of things: HOTAS HOTAS HOTAS. Sure the VR technology is not yet compatible with cockpit building. And loosing the functionnality of those MFCD must be a pain. But to be fair TIR is out of the picture too. Perhaps one day we will have a cool glove that allow us to seemlessly interact with the in-game cockpit.

 

I'm sure that many accomodation are necessary to get the VR technology to meet with the entierty of the DCS experience. But going back to just TIR on my 24' monitor is just not an option.

[empeck]

Have you forgotten yourself and done something funny?

 

Yes, but not (yet) in DCS. I've been playing The Lab, and throwing mugs around. The small robodog brought them back, and I wanted to kick the mug. Then I realized it's not real and I don't have legs in VR...

 

Haven't tried it in DCSW yet, but I get sick in every game in which the character moves. I fear that will happen in DCSW as well.

 

I instantly got sick in games with 'traditional' locomotion - I mean WASD + mouse or game controllers and I have to recover for a while. DCS, FSX are fine, but sometimes I feel dizzy during heavy maneuvers. I don't have any problems in roomscale games.

Edited April 15, 2016 by empeck

[Winger]

Everyone says that VR is immersive, and it makes you feel like you're in the game, but how far does it go?

 

I had a moment last night where I tried to brace my hand against the cockpit wall while twisting around in my seat during a dogfight. It was a little jarring when I reached out and hit nothing but air. :lol:

 

Have you forgotten yourself and done something funny?

 

 

Haha, at the beginning when i didnt have everythign mapped to hotas and needed to lean forward to grab they keyboard i found myself wathcing out so i dont bump my head on the canopy. Wich IS NOT THERE:)

And i did that numerous times and always thought to myself. Dude, do you learn it?:)

[lanmancz]

How do you deal with all that right now?

 

I don't really. I guess I don't play such intense missions but I usually interact with the plane only via HOTAS+Mouse. I setup my radios in advance while on the ground and when I get coordinates from JTAC I write them directly into the CDU, using the UFC. I prepare for this when I expect new coordinates, create new blank waypoint and so on, before I reply that I'm ready to copy. I never really needed a pen and paper when I do it this way.

 

PS: I don't play multiplayer (only very occasionally with friends) so that might be the difference since you mention that you read back the info which I don't do in single player.

[Yurgon]

PS: I don't play multiplayer (only very occasionally with friends) so that might be the difference since you mention that you read back the info which I don't do in single player.

 

I see, okay.

 

Haha, I didn't mean "read back", I literally meant "read the info I just wrote down in order to punch it into the CDU". ;)

 

But yeah, in MP when a JTAC or another plane has coords I also like to write them down for future reference, because in the CDU I like to overwrite target waypoint coords in order not to end up with TGT1, TGT2, TGT3 and so on, but sometimes the question comes up "what were the coordinates of those trucks again? I'd like to check something there."

 

Also, I sometimes forget to set the correct grid, and then when I update the grid, the coordinates get reset, and if I haven't written them down, I'd have to re-request them, which is especially painful in SP, when you've ingressed for 20 minutes and there's just no way to get the coords again because they came via a triggered radio message or so.

 

Long story short, it's my SOP to note down coordinates and other important info on a sheet of paper. ;)

[SkateZilla]

I did reach for the grab bar in the cockpit during a bank the other night. ended up grabbing my desk light and pulling it off the top shelf behind my desk.

 

 

Im thinking a Full Pit w/ buttons/panels isnt needed, but a Pit to sit in, w/ canopy rail and grab bar's might be a good thing to have.

 

Especially because Im what other gamers would call "A Leaner"

[KLR Rico]

a Pit to sit in, w/ canopy rail and grab bar's might be a good thing to have.

 

That's the way I'm thinking, I at least need something to grab onto so I can pull myself around to look behind me easier.

[JustVisiting]

Well, I can't speak for VR since I haven't used it although I have Oculus Rift preordered.

 

I did get a backseat ride in a T-38 at Laughlin AFB about 10 years ago though (45 minute flight with about 15 minutes of personal stick and throttle control). For months afterwards I swear I could sort of feel the Gs while flying in my sims (Falcon 4 in particular). I found myself particularly cautious pulling on the stick and putting on the Gs. I even found myself doing G straining maneuvers without realizing it. I grew out of it in time.

Edited April 27, 2016 by JustVisiting

[JustVisiting]

I've only experienced Oculus Rift with a roller coster demo. I was feeling the nonexistant G force :P. It really was some experience... but also it made clear to me that these devices are not suitable for flight simming as I understand it. Can't see controls we interface with the sim, resolution is so bad feels like back to 90s, and to get decent performance with even that, a prohibitively expensive PC might be needed.

 

So, I am sure in a few years time will come, but for now VR devices for flight sims feels more like a novelty than a practical reality to me. However, I admit a very awesome novelty to experience.

 

That's my concern. Even though I have OR preordered I suspect that for the first several years I'll likely use OR only for software programed specifically for it. I'm infinitely patient at this stage of my life and can wait a few years for the tech to continue to mature.

[jcbak]

I'm holding off for now. No doubt the experience is awesome. However, like golfers buying a $500.00 driver (only to find his scores haven't improved), new purchasers spending hundreds of dollars are going to rave about VR at first...I would too. I'm going to let the dust settle some and see what the reviews are in August, September.

[Lucifah]

I'm holding off for now. No doubt the experience is awesome. However, like golfers buying a $500.00 driver (only to find his scores haven't improved), new purchasers spending hundreds of dollars are going to rave about VR at first...I would too. I'm going to let the dust settle some and see what the reviews are in August, September.

 

That's what I'm thinking too. Also, performance and resolution aren't quite up to scratch apparently. When Oculus Rift 2 comes out (or a viable competitor), I might reconsider. For now, TIR is good (and weird) enough for me, although Youtube videos don't support it, no matter how often I try to turn my damn hat holder. :lol: