Sa2

[D4n]

It made it into the game! Awesome!! Now the only thing that would be fun to add (for multiplayer) is the booster actually falling down balistically (and able to damage units) instead of instantly vanishing when booster burns out! :pilotfly:

[FlankerMan]

A couple of questions regarding the in-game SA-2 "Guideline" (S-75):

 

1-Why are there two static engagement range circles? What do they describe/mean?

 

2-Does the P-19 search radar (formerly only with SA-3 "Goa"/S-125 Neva) actually communicate with the SA-2 Fan Song tracking radar, or is the only way to get the SA-2 to engage to have the TR pointed towards the incoming fighters at mission start?

[D4n]

They communicate it seems, but it takes the Fan Song ages to start turning and tracking...

[Nealius]

If the range circles are similar to the SA-3: the outer circle should be detection range, the inner circle should be the WEZ.

[FlankerMan]

But both circles are related to the launcher, and both have the darker red when in the game and having pressed F10.

[Nealius]

I just set up a test mission to see how the SA-2 worked, skill level set to high. On the map you have 4 circles at radii of:

 

3.7nm

23nm

54nm

83-84nm

 

During testing, the P19 handed off contact to the Fan-Song at 53nm. The SA2 launchers were commanded onto the target at 22nm. Launch occurred at 12nm.

 

So I'm guessing:

 

83-84nm is the detection range of the P19.

54nm is the detection range of the Fan-Song.

23nm is the max firing distance.

3.7nm is the minimum firing distance.

[FlankerMan]

Okay, thanks, that helps. But, why a minimum firing distance circle when the other SAMs don't have one?

[twistking]

Okay, thanks, that helps. But, why a minimum firing distance circle when the other SAMs don't have one?

 

the minimum firing distance of the sa-2 is obviously very big, so it makes sense having that visualized.

most other sams have a min range a fraction of that...

[Nealius]

I'm not sure how it's modeled in DCS, but in other sims the SA-2 has a min engagement of about 3nm, and above 2000ft AGL. I'm assuming it's like that in real life. The SA-3 on the other hand can still shoot at you pretty close and low. Different technology I guess.

 

That's why I love the SA-2 so much. It can be a threat, but it has a big enough of a flaw to make pop-up strikes exciting yet safe.

[FlankerMan]

Okay, makes sense, twistking.

[Kev2go]

well its nice to see this added finally in the recent beta patch.

[upyr1]

a 1960s era SAM missile, that saw use into the 80s with export users. This SAM type is notorious known from its use in the Vietnam war as well as the Arab Isreali wars.

 

I think its approaching time to have this added. We have had older legacy era added such as the F5E, Mig21, and others in the works, such as the Viggen ( coming out in a few days), as well as M-III, and a Mig19, A-7 Corsair in the roadmaps. And era appropriate missile for era appropriate aircraft.

 

 

 

We need that- and a Vietnam map

[Nealius]

Some kind of template with berms that you can set the P19/Fan Song/launchers in would indeed be nice. It's hard to set up a realistic SAM site.

[D4n]

Or just a hill for the Fan Song :)

[Stratos]

So what exactly we need to make the Sa2 to launch?

[Gierasimov]

SAM-SA-2 units needed to fire

 

So what exactly we need to make the Sa2 to launch?

 

Tracking radar - P19

Target radar - FanSong

Firing element - SA2 launcher

[D4n]

All in 1 group, but don't expect anything, even on expert it will miss a B-52 at ~10 miles in 2 out of 3 shots.... (embarrassing)

[Cik]

see: linebacker

[D4n]

What do you mean "linebacker" ?

[Cik]

there was this large air operation called operation linebacker, where they flew buffs directly over the largest SA-2 nest active in the world (well... the soviet one might have been bigger) casualties were relatively minimal, actually.

 

 

tl;dr chaff and jamming are pretty effective against the SA-2, even if you have the RCS of a skyscraper and are flying in a straight line at very close range.

[D4n]

aaaah alright! I thought because SOO many B-52 were downed there, that the SA-2 tracking radar and command guidance logic was pretty accurate xD

Can't wait till we get another version of SA-2 missile/FanSong!

[QuiGon]

aaaah alright! I thought because SOO many B-52 were downed there, that the SA-2 tracking radar and command guidance logic was pretty accurate xD

Can't wait till we get another version of SA-2 missile/FanSong!

Relatively speaking only a small percentage of B-52 have been shot down there, but because of the crazy high numbers of B-52s (or aircraft in general) that had been deployed to Vietnam the absolute number of losses is still pretty big.

[Stratos]

aaaah alright! I thought because SOO many B-52 were downed there, that the SA-2 tracking radar and command guidance logic was pretty accurate xD

Can't wait till we get another version of SA-2 missile/FanSong!

 

Hope to see the Sa2 working soon, is a bit annoying that it doesn't properly fire/track at the moment.

[mkellytx]

Relatively speaking only a small percentage of B-52 have been shot down there, but because of the crazy high numbers of B-52s (or aircraft in general) that had been deployed to Vietnam the absolute number of losses is still pretty big.

 

Linebacker II, 15 loses on 741 sorties attempted. The aircrew nearly mutinied over the loses and SAC policy. The 11 Days of Christmas by Marshal Michel is a very compelling read of the B-52 campaign over North Vietnam in 1972. Personally I read the book in the gunners seat of 60-0050 on a mission from Edwards to Eglin to shoot a MALD.

[D4n]

what u mean "personally"... you were flying IN a B-52 yourself from Edwards to Eglin, fo real? o_O (I think you mean this "MALD" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ADM-160_MALD ) And what's a "60-0050" ? Specific modification of B-52? What was the worst crosswind landing that you found yourself in? :D And did you ever have to abort a takeoff or do go-arounds? :) Any interesting short-story to share with us? :)

Edited October 5, 2018 by DanielNL