MiG 21 DCS 2.5

[bkthunder]

Jonne summed up some good points. There are more, but trust me, everybody asks the same thing and to write a list of bugs all the time is pointless. That's why you were pointed to bug sections etc.

The truth is most bug reports are old but they have not been addressed. The FM itself has seen so many radical and opposing changes through the years, it basically became impossible to tell what is realistic and what not, other than the obvious flaws such as the hardcoded stall behaviors, the AoA etc. which are obvious to anyone with a basic grasp of aerodynamics.

The engine behavior is also scripted.

The external sonds are the stock Su-25 sounds and are just terrible.

You can steer on the ground at walking speed just by using the rudder, and this aircraft has a castoring nosewheel (i.e. you steer by differential braking only, at least until the speed is such that your rudder has enough aerodynamic authority)

ETC.

[corn322]

The SAU stabilization mode doesn't work either.

[KilledAlive]

The SAU stabilization mode doesn't work either.

 

For me, it works just once, and cancelling it causes something strange to occur that makes doing it again unreliable, otherwise, I Don't use it all that often, just for long range movement where there's no one else around to bother me, and I want to save fuel.

[Shibbyland]

Jeez yea that does sound incomplete. Maybe back to what I said before then, possibly good for a sale but not worth full price. That’s pretty cheap using su25 sounds. Strange decision to give it NWS if it didn’t actually have it. Castoring nose wheel wouldn’t be that much of a pain to use in the sim, in fact it would add more to the game since if you get slow with it pointing the wrong way it can be a real pain to get it going in the right direction again. Not too difficult but it would’ve added something to the sim. Gutted because the MiG really appeals more so than any of he others but not paying full price for something still in that state after 4 years. I’d buy the MiG 15 but I don’t think it has a lot to offer.

[Crash *]

I can´t accept a few "facts" in some postings!

 

The MIG 21 do NOT have a NWS. Taxiing only with Rudder is not possible. When the plane gained more then taxi speed you can give full rudder and the plane will of course change a BIT direction. But you can not make sharp turns without brakes.

 

The Mig 21 sound much differently to the SU25. Possible that some sound files the same, but in game there is a huge difference.

 

The SAU Recovery is doing what it should do. I don´t have any problems with it. You have to be more specific why the SAU is broken in your opinion.

 

I am NOT a fanboy, but it should be near the truth.

[Jonne]

It is not about the recovery mode, but the stabilization which does not work. Although the recovery is not correct either, as it loses significant altitude.

[Shibbyland]

I wouldn't expect the rudder to have any effect at all at taxi speeds, given it's a jet there's no airflow over the tail such that you might have from a propeller. It's also a relatively small surface so if I had to guess, I'd say you'd need to be well beyond taxi speed before you could maintain directional control with rudder.

 

 

What's the actual issue with the stalling? I see what you're saying in terms of significant altitude loss but in what way is it's behaviour wrong?

 

 

Could you comment about how it stalls at low speed (say on approach) and at high speeds? Again, if it were truly well modelled you'd expect some differences so if it's hardcoded and you're getting the same behaviour, that's not so flash.

 

 

Do you know what though, the thing that puts me off the most is that they've given the MiG a CCIP mode. It's simple, if it doesn't have it, don't put it in the sim. The whole fun of DCS is learning the aircraft because truth be told I'm rubbish at using the mission editor and the campaigns are often bugged or there just aren't any so all the content is in learning the module. I mean jeez why not just give it BVR weapons too?

Edited October 7, 2018 by Shibbyland

[Jonne]

What I wrote before was about autopilot modes, not stall behaviour.

 

Stall behaviour is questionable as you have a fix 2G turn rate if you are in a stall condition.

 

Some more info on the CCIP: The MiG-21bis does have a CCIP mode for rockets, which can also be assisted by the radar. However this mode does not exist for bombs, but is included in the module. You can switch the ASP to manual mode and turn of the CCIP. Manual mode is what the real life manual tells you to use. However we are missing the needed charts for angular correction.

 

I would expect the bomb CCIP mode to be at least an option only, which the server can forbid to keep it realistic, just like the arcade IR pipper.

[Muddy17]

well for starters, don't listen to anybody that starts out by saying "I would never buy it" or "I Heard that,, "

It has a few bug to be sure but my personal opinion after owning it for a few years is ,, Absolutely wonderful, Fun to learn and most rewarding A/C in the collection (and I have most)

I always seem to take her up at least once during a sit down in front of the Comp-pit.

To be sure i dont see it being supported anymore to the degree that you would hope, but it works just fine to go up against era appropriate enemy's.

[Jonne]

Sorry, but it is not just a few bugs. And and countless other threads have already proven that. If your ambition is to have an aircraft you can use like the real deal, this one might just not be it. Not meaning it is no fun to fly, as it is, but if you want to improve your flying, at some point you will face more and more things which just do not work how described or do not work at all. Unfortunately there just is no other module near the class of aircraft the MiG-21 is, at least up until the MiG-23 comes. And the fact that a MiG-21 has already been made, gives me little hope that there will ever be another 3rd party developer or even ED coming up with another MiG-21 which is kept in a reasonable status.

[Tesarus]

Sorry, but it is not just a few bugs. And and countless other threads have already proven that. If your ambition is to have an aircraft you can use like the real deal, this one might just not be it.

Or you can just enjoy this module and tolerate some flaws it has. Simulation is always an approximation. Everyone decides for himself what approximation is acceptable (and how much few is few).

[Shibbyland]

I personally don’t mind bugs and flaws as long as I see

Improvements and support for the module. I didn’t know anything about magnitude when I started looking into getting the MiG but now I’ve done some reading it just seems that for whatever reason they aren’t doing much with the MiG and the stuff they are working on isn’t for me. I want to know a module will be completed and 4 years in early access suggests this one won’t be. It would be great so see more Russian aircraft in game. Personally I always found the WW2 setting an odd choice for DCS. It’s really well done but once you’ve done aircraft startup the warbirds don’t offer a whole lot more beyond what you can get in other sims. I reckon more aircraft from the 1960s to late 80s would be great. Vietnam is a time period in which Air combat really evolved to what it is today and it goes underrepresented in the sim market. DCS has a platform which could really make it work...anyway I’ve kind of digressed from the original discussion. No MiG 21 for me, at least not at full price.

[GumidekCZ]

I love the MiG-21 and I hope that Magnitude will give it love and care it deserve. Nowadays it is theCHRISTEN EAGLE 2, which has almost 100% of Mag workload capacity. So may be after the release of CHE2, the number of people taking care of MiG will raise again. Important question is: WHEN???

[-Rudel-]

Be patient for our update, we'll explain a few things more in detail.

[GumidekCZ]

Be patient for our update, we'll explain a few things more in detail.

I like quick responds very much, thanks Rudel. With "few things" you ment things about CHE2 or MiG-21 or Magnitude itself??

[-Rudel-]

Everything

[Jonne]

Now thats nice to hear!

[Kang]

Actually I'm not sure if that's nice to hear or deeply unsettling. Fingers crossed, though.

[GumidekCZ]

Everything

That kind of response makes me little bit nervous . At least according to my feelings, it could be something not very pleasant, in terms of Magnitude future.

But as Kang wrote, Fingers crossed, hopefully only bright future is awaiting to us.

EDITED:

Found this:

Yorktown is planned...

[ATTACH]194300[/ATTACH]

So now Im only worried about MiG21, not about the Magnitude. Certainly will patiently wait for next news.

Edited October 10, 2018 by GumidekCZ

[Shibbyland]

I sincerely hope any developer finding a footing in DCS succeeds, the more modules the better. My preference is that DCS remains a combat simulator but I know not everybody feels that way. Please finish the MiG 21, to my mind it is your most promising and appealing module.

[gulredrel]

I'm positive because I see my bugtracker defect tickets get some love.

Thanks to Rudel here. So the PRMG and blind flying capabilities will be fixed.

 

SW-Development is a hard business and I hope, not only new customers to new models but also the long term customers get there best.

[amalahama]

There is nothing I would wish more than the level of quality that the Mig-21 deserves. Go Magnitude!

[Shibbyland]

I look forward to hearing what magnitude have to say. I don’t know the full story behind the breakaway that happened a year ago. It doesn’t really matter now. If it were me I’d consolidate, finish the projects you’ve got, the MiG is your flagship right now, it’s enormously promising and could be one of the defining modules in DCS. Build up a base of customer support and use it to launch new modules. Try not to bounce from one thing to another, pick what you’re good at and make it your signature. Just my opinion but yea hope to see you guys stay in the game...ps, throw a sale or two our way if you can, they’re deluxe for reinvigorating interest in old modules.

[Sajarov]

Some info here:

https://www.facebook.com/leathernecksim

[GumidekCZ]

What I’m also hoping for with MiG-21 is proper Campaign over Vietnam map against F-4 Phantoms and F-105 Thundershiefs, B-52. It can be bag full of potential money/new-old customers. However, there need to be DCS quality 3D models of all these planes at first.