DCS: F-14 Development Update - AIM-54 Phoenix Improvements & Overhaul - Guided Discussion

[WarthogOsl]

7 hours ago, Machalot said:

Goleta Air and Space Museum is just the name of that guy's website with photos from museums all over. You could try contacting him to see if there is a higher resolution version of that image. See the contact link at the bottom of his homepage:

https://www.air-and-space.com/home.htm

It looks like the source is (or was) a small naval weapons museum located just outside the gate at point mugu.  https://www.air-and-space.com/Pt_Mugu_Command_History_Storage_Facility.htm

I suspect it might have moved to China Lake, but can't really find anything about it currently.

Edited November 12, 2022 by WarthogOsl

[DSplayer]

I'm still waiting on my FOIA request to get actual data on the AIM-54 directly from the United States government. It will take at least 1 month to get the documents I requested.

Edited November 13, 2022 by DSplayer

[Sindar]

26.10.2022 в 10:01, IronMike сказал:

Today:
 

• Reverted AIM-54 loft to state before looping hotfix to revert exceptionally poor performance.

I am the God of predictions. Many pages of vague explanations of obvious errors. In the end, backtracking.

[IronMike]

1 hour ago, Sindar said:

I am the God of predictions. Many pages of vague explanations of obvious errors. In the end, backtracking.

If you say so, only that my post referred to one specific fix, in one specific patch, which broke one specific thing, and has absolutely nothing to do with "backtracking". bug fix introduced error -> bugfix adjusted to fix what it was supposed to fix minus the error.

Edited November 13, 2022 by IronMike

[Skarp]

10 hours ago, DSplayer said:

I'm still waiting on my FOIA request to get actual data on the AIM-54 directly from the United States government. It will take at least 1 month to get the documents I requested.

 

I hope they give it 🫣

[IronMike]

10 hours ago, DSplayer said:

I'm still waiting on my FOIA request to get actual data on the AIM-54 directly from the United States government. It will take at least 1 month to get the documents I requested.

 

Doubtful they'll give it, depending on what you requested, but with ITAR stuff - it is difficult to say the least.

[F-2]

4 hours ago, IronMike said:

Doubtful they'll give it, depending on what you requested, but with ITAR stuff - it is difficult to say the least.

Some agencies if you know what your looking for will let you know if the documents contain export controlled or property information. DTIC is really good with this. They can also search other agencies and can tell you provided you know the document.

[Skarp]

Been doing some multiplayer matches with the aim54. Been getting allot of kills. For ideal conditions I’ll climb and tank at 25k then climb to 43k feet. Push the nose down Speed up to M 1.4 leveling off at 37K. I then climb to 50k or higher. Maintaining around m1.2 a M1.3. If the drag of the aim54s under the belly was corrected I bet I could do M2 up there.

[Spurts]

Be careful with your climb angle and you can stay fast even an 50k, but yeah you are on the right track to maximize Phoenix performance.  You shooting TWS or STT?  What kind of range?

[Skarp]

7 hours ago, Spurts said:

Be careful with your climb angle and you can stay fast even an 50k, but yeah you are on the right track to maximize Phoenix performance.  You shooting TWS or STT?  What kind of range?

I do 50nm shots. Could do longer maybe but it’s got allot of energy on it from 50nm

[CarbonFox]

On 11/14/2022 at 9:44 AM, Skarp said:

Been doing some multiplayer matches with the aim54. Been getting allot of kills. For ideal conditions I’ll climb and tank at 25k then climb to 43k feet. Push the nose down Speed up to M 1.4 leveling off at 37K. I then climb to 50k or higher. Maintaining around m1.2 a M1.3. If the drag of the aim54s under the belly was corrected I bet I could do M2 up there.

Are you carrying bags too or going clean?

[Skarp]

1 hour ago, CarbonFox said:

Are you carrying bags too or going clean?

Once the bag is empty I get rid of them unless I’m planning to stay up a while. But yeah basically just get above 40K feet get to M1.2 and do a 50nm shot if he is high or a 30nm if he is low and you’ll probably get a kill. 

Edited November 15, 2022 by Skarp

[BubiHUN]

Can anybody give me some information wich variant of AIM54 would be the best choice in the current version?

[RustBelt]

On 11/13/2022 at 1:20 AM, DSplayer said:

I'm still waiting on my FOIA request to get actual data on the AIM-54 directly from the United States government. It will take at least 1 month to get the documents I requested.

 

Wait, actually get, not “we can’t find it”? 

[The_Tau]

15 hours ago, BubiHUN said:

Can anybody give me some information wich variant of AIM54 would be the best choice in the current version?

Any 54 C variant

[WolfHound009]

Any updates on the Early -As? :)))))))))))))))))))))))))))

 

 

Edited November 16, 2022 by WolfHound009

[SmeagleGoneWild]

19 hours ago, BubiHUN said:

Can anybody give me some information wich variant of AIM54 would be the best choice in the current version?

I’ve had the most success with 54A Mk60. Both C’s are just getting defeated too easily in my test but the A Mk60 has been incredibly successful 

[IronMike]

55 minutes ago, SmeagleGoneWild said:

I’ve had the most success with 54A Mk60. Both C’s are just getting defeated too easily in my test but the A Mk60 has been incredibly successful 

That seems to be a bit of a placebo imo. They share virtually the same impules, and practically same flight model, only that the C can go active and has an improved guidance. The -A being better is very unlikely.

[SmeagleGoneWild]

29 minutes ago, IronMike said:

That seems to be a bit of a placebo imo. They share virtually the same impules, and practically same flight model, only that the C can go active and has an improved guidance. The -A being better is very unlikely.

Oh I’m not doubting that lol, there’s no science here, just what had been working strangely enough. I started with the C Mk60 and I couldn’t get any hits. And tbh, now I feel dumb, the C can go active but the A can’t? I thought this whole time it can go active lol. 

[near_blind]

34 minutes ago, SmeagleGoneWild said:

And tbh, now I feel dumb, the C can go active but the A can’t? I thought this whole time it can go active lol. 

The C will always go active.

The A will only go active if fired in TWS with the target still tracked at the time the radar calculates the missile should activate it's seeker, or if fired active at launch.

 

The A will not go active if you fire it in PD-STT, if you turn away before the active signal is sent, or if the distance between an extrapolated track and the actual target is too large.

The C also has better countermeasure resistance for whatever that's worth in DCS these days.

[BubiHUN]

4 hours ago, SmeagleGoneWild said:

I’ve had the most success with 54A Mk60. Both C’s are just getting defeated too easily in my test but the A Mk60 has been incredibly successful 

Today I had my last sortie for trying settings and climbing into space for increasing succes rate of my Tomcat. 
AIM54 is trash, Tomcat is grounded until it gets a fix. Taking into account how "fast" the development is, this could mean years.

[RustBelt]

10 hours ago, near_blind said:

The C will always go active.

The A will only go active if fired in TWS with the target still tracked at the time the radar calculates the missile should activate it's seeker, or if fired active at launch.

 

The A will not go active if you fire it in PD-STT, if you turn away before the active signal is sent, or if the distance between an extrapolated track and the actual target is too large.

The C also has better countermeasure resistance for whatever that's worth in DCS these days.

It’s more accurate to say the C won’t just go dumb if it loses guidance. Like the A does.

8 hours ago, BubiHUN said:

Today I had my last sortie for trying settings and climbing into space for increasing succes rate of my Tomcat. 
AIM54 is trash, Tomcat is grounded until it gets a fix. Taking into account how "fast" the development is, this could mean years.

Someone’s new to DCS.

We’ve all been there, eventually it wears you down.

[IronMike]

16 hours ago, BubiHUN said:

Today I had my last sortie for trying settings and climbing into space for increasing succes rate of my Tomcat. 
AIM54 is trash, Tomcat is grounded until it gets a fix. Taking into account how "fast" the development is, this could mean years.

It won't get a fix, because it is not broken - the performance as is, is extremely close to how it was irl. If you still think it is trash, that is fine, you have a right to this opinion. Maybe guidance will get improved by ED for missiles in general, or the AI's reaction to them, but neither is a Tomcat or Phoenix issue.

[The_Tau]

 maybe some tweaks to guidance though? (that damn notch climb maneuver).

I would point out one thing, that people say its "trash", but in comparison to what exactly? AIM120? wow a late 1960s missile is bested by missile from 1991? What a shocker.  In those 20 years only other missiles which can be compared with it was AIM7 Sparrow, Matras,  R24 and R27R/T variants. 

Edited November 17, 2022 by The_Tau

[Karon]

4 minutes ago, The_Tau said:

I would point out one thing, that people say its "trash" in comparison to what exactly? AIM120? wow a late 1960s missile is bested by missile from 1991? What a shocker.  In those 20 years only other missiles which can be compared with it was AIM7 Sparrow, R24 and R27R/T variants. 

This.

For whatever reason, many put in the same basket the F-14A/B with the F-16C\F/A-18C. It makes very little sense