reported earlier igla missiles way way too weak. Tested

[bolek]

This is not so much of an issue but an observation. I was just trying to see how Igla works and practicing on Mi-26 (big target ). I scored 4 successful hits but the Mi-26 just shrugged it off like it was nothing. I know it's a big helicopter and Igla is small, but 4 hits? Eventually I had to gun him down...

[Ephedrin]

vor 6 Stunden schrieb bolek:

This is not so much of an issue but an observation. I was just trying to see how Igla works and practicing on Mi-26 (big target ). I scored 4 successful hits but the Mi-26 just shrugged it off like it was nothing. I know it's a big helicopter and Igla is small, but 4 hits? Eventually I had to gun him down...

I guess it's less of an issue with the igla but rather with the damage model of the AI aircraft. The AI Mi8 can take two or three stingers and a direct salvo hit of a Gepard or Zu23 and fly the 100km home with a long trail of smoke and a burning engine.

Edited December 17, 2022 by Ephedrin

[Blinky.ben]

Yeah i put 4 inglas in one huey and zero damage, one even got a direct hit on the tail rotor and still nothing at all was damaged.

[BioZ]

Hi, I've played with the KA-50 III a bit, and it seems as the new Igla damage is a bit off.

Please see the following track ka-50vsMI-8-1.trk

In the trk provided it takes 8 iglas in the rear aspect to take out a mi-8. 

I am not saying that iglas with 1.2kg warhead should oneshot, (It doesn't take much time to find a yt video of igla taking out a cobra with the first attempt) but when it takes 8 to take down a heli it just seems like something is off.

Additionally in one of the latest videos of Growling Sidewinder, he hits AH-64D 4 times without it taking any significant damage. (Video with time code attached below)

 

 

With a minusclue lock range of igla and its near-zero damage iglas are rendered useless.

Yes, I am an MP player therefore here I am writing about how weapon X should demolish everything

 

With best regards,

Edited December 17, 2022 by BioZ

[razo+r]

Does this also happen with aircraft?

If aircraft also tank  iglas, then it's an igla issue.

If aircraft go down without issues, then it's a helicopter issue.

[BIGNEWY]

Hi, 

the this is reported. 

thank you

[ebabil]

I made a try with the iglas againts an AI unarmed mi-8.

I spent all 4 iglas with a success hit. Almost nothing happened.

Then I fired some vikhr, guns, vikhr again. So it took me 4 iglas + 3-4 vikhrs + gun to down a single helicopter.

Is this normal? Track attached

bs3.trk

[Mr_Blastman]

Eh, the Huey often takes 2 - 3+ to bring them down.

 

Be happy.  The vikhr actually will hit a Huey, whereas in the Hind the AT missiles miss 100% of the time.

 

Still, I think these iglas feel a bit underwhelming...

 

[ams999]

It's been reported - Iglas are pretty bad at the moment

 

Concerning Vikhrs: I shot down another Ka-50 today (three times) and each time one Vikhr was enough to turn it into a lawn dart so I didn't notice a problem with them.

Edited December 18, 2022 by ams999

[schurem]

So what happens if you hit a jet with an igla?

[jubuttib]

3 hours ago, Mr_Blastman said:

Be happy.  The vikhr actually will hit a Huey, whereas in the Hind the AT missiles miss 100% of the time.

Just to clarify, are you talking about shooting aerial targets with the anti-tank missiles, using Petrovich or a human gunner guiding them?

 

On the main subject, I just ranted a bit elsewhere on how effing tough AI helicopters are, and have ranted in the past. I play a lot of Foothold, and you need to be killing helicopters all the damn time there...

 

Quote

But be that as it may, the main problem really is that right now the AI helicopters can take a LOT more punishment than player operated ones. I've lost Mi-8s to infantry small arms fire in seconds, while I've also put 8 M151 rockets and a decent burst from the GAU-8 into an AI Mi-8 and it just flew away...

In Foothold enemy helicopters are in fact a constant problem, Ka-27s and Mi-8s servicing target areas and enemy helicopters making attack runs, and I've seen situations where a Hind eats multiple Patriot missiles without going down, Mi-8s take 3 Sidewinders and fly away (on fire all the way home, some 200 km away...), and Ka-27s take 3 A-A Vikhr shots and fly away. I've also seen friendly AH-1Zs and Gazelles absolutely shot to shreds with multiple missiles and AAA fire, and they refuse to go down.

AI helis, apart from maybe the Huey, can just take an enormous amount of punishment right now. Admittedly you do sometimes get lucky and down them in one hit, but you also see the opposite.

 

Edited December 18, 2022 by jubuttib

[Mr_Blastman]

Using Petrovich to shoot the human pilots in hueys.  I have never had one hit.  They miss every time.  They also miss against AI.

 

[jubuttib]

2 hours ago, Mr_Blastman said:

Using Petrovich to shoot the human pilots in hueys.  I have never had one hit.  They miss every time.  They also miss against AI.

And I assume you've tried with the air-to-air variant of the missiles, not the anti-tank/personnel ones? I think the only real reason why the Vikhr works as well as it does is because in AA mode it switches to a proximity fuse, which the Hind's ATGMs lack, unless you pick the specific AA ones.

Back on the subject of the IGLAs and their effectiveness:

I'm not 100% convinced it's just a question of the IGLAs being ineffective, at least when used against other helicopters. I just tested in a mission with a BS3 vs. a Ka-27, and even expanding all of my HE and API rounds into it (hit % about 50-70%, I got REAL CLOSE before opening fire), after slapping two IGLAs on it already, I could not destroy it.

I finally destroyed the Ka-27 by taking Vikhrs onboard as well, and after 7 Vikhrs hits and one IGLA (laser burned out so had to swap to IGLAs) I managed to kill the damn thing.

Has anyone tested successfully how the IGLAs fare against planes? From experience with the Hind I can say that the R-60s barely seem to scratch the Mi-8s and Ka-27s, but take down planes with ease.

Edited December 19, 2022 by jubuttib

[Mr_Blastman]

28 minutes ago, jubuttib said:

And I assume you've tried with the air-to-air variant of the missiles, not the anti-tank/personnel ones? I think the only real reason why the Vikhr works as well as it does is because in AA mode it switches to a proximity fuse, which the Hind's ATGMs lack, unless you pick the specific AA ones.

Back on the subject of the IGLAs and their effectiveness:

I'm not 100% convinced it's just a question of the IGLAs being ineffective, at least when used against other helicopters. I just tested in a mission with a BS3 vs. a Ka-27, and even expanding all of my HE and API rounds into it (hit % about 50-70%, I got REAL CLOSE before opening fire), after slapping two IGLAs on it already, I could not destroy it.

I finally destroyed the Ka-27 by taking Vikhrs onboard as well, and after 7 Vikhrs hits and one IGLA (laser burned out so had to swap to IGLAs) I managed to kill the damn thing.

Has anyone tested successfully how the IGLAs fare against planes? From experience with the Hind I can say that the R-60s barely seem to scratch the Mi-8s and Ka-27s, but take down planes with ease.

 

I only carry the anti-tank ones online, and they don't even hit.  They sail right past the Hueys.  What I think Petrovich does is target the rotor mast pole, which is a miniscule target to hit, which they never do.

[jubuttib]

Fair, though I wouldn't expect Petro to ever manage a direct hit on an aircraft. The AA ones seem to work fine.

[Roadsweeper]

Yeah I have noticed this too. 

With regards to Igla vs planes, I've not tried it on an actual combat jet, but the "Shooting range" training mission tasks you with taking out 2 Reaper drones, if you count them as 'planes' being they are fixed wing. I had to use all 4 Iglas just to down one drone, and had to down the other using the gun.

 

Pretty sure it shouldn't take 4 anti air missiles to take down a drone, even though the reapers are quite large.

But, also agree about the helo damage models. Something weird going on there. Another training mission gives you two CH-47s to shoot at. Downed one with a single Igla (no idea how, maybe hit the pilot), the 2nd one took the remaining 3 Iglas, then I fired ALL my cannon ammo at it, from sitting on its six at about 100m and pumping in a short burst at a time, so most of the rounds hit, both HE and AP, by which point the thing was looking like swiss cheese and had one engine burning nicely, but still flying perfectly happily. I then got fed up and RAMMED it from behind. I fell to the ground, blew up, and it flew on happily and landed at its designated runway.... Yeah... no!!!

[No_Brain]

I actually managed to hit the Huey 4 Times with the igla and it was still flying ^^ Sadly i havent recorded it but it was the Shooting Range on Caucasus. 
Even with its small explosive Mass i think one igla should be enough to atleast damage the tail rotor enough so that the Huey atleast has to land or lose control.

[Sideburns]

The Rapier SAM has a similar issue, usually takes 3-4 shots to take out a jet or helo due to the small warhead modelling.

[Kappa-131st]

On 12/18/2022 at 12:51 AM, BioZ said:

Hi, I've played with the KA-50 III a bit, and it seems as the new Igla damage is a bit off.
In the trk provided it takes 8 iglas in the rear aspect to take out a mi-8. 

With a minusclue lock range of igla and its near-zero damage iglas are rendered useless.

The damage model of IA helicopter is totaly wrong...
Mi-8 are more resistant than T-90, and on my last mission with my squadron, it take 4-5 Vikhrs to kill a Mi-24
In my opinion, the true problem is not the IGLAS. The true problem is the damage model of the IA helicopters !

I try to make an event script to print the % of hitpoint loose by a Mi-24 after be hiting by an Igla, using getLife() and getLife0() : 
local liferemain  = event.target:getLife()/event.target:getLife0()*100
trigger.action.outText("life : "..liferemain.."%",10)

Result : Mi-24 is at 93% og his HP after taking an IGLA !!!

@ED : You must make your IA helicopters much more vulnerable!

[fastfed]

Just did about an hour of testing with all sorts of aircraft, mostly other helo's.

 

Seriously, in real life there is no way it would take 5+ missiles to destroy an aircraft. I firmly believe a stick of dynamite taped to the exterior of any single aircraft (maybe not the a10) would destroy it.

 

Yet this 2.5# warhead does almost nothing. sorry but this needs to be addressed ASAP 

[razo+r]

It's already reported and being looked into

[ak22]

Is the current IGLA bugged it took 3 hits to take out and apache?  If their were this bad in real like why would the VKS bother putting them on the KA-50? 

They have shot down Su-25 & KA-52 other aircraft with one hit in real life...  

Edited January 2, 2023 by ak22

[razo+r]

 

 

 

 

 

[okopanja]

In 2006, Apache was shot down in Iraq with SA-7 (Strela-2), which is inferior to any of igla versions.

Edited January 2, 2023 by okopanja

[Appleonastick]

On 1/2/2023 at 7:04 PM, okopanja said:

In 2006, Apache was shot down in Iraq with SA-7 (Strela-2), which is inferior to any of igla versions.

 

It even shot down an AC-130H in 1991 (The Strela-2)

Edited January 6, 2023 by Appleonastick