DCS now supports OpenXR natively

[Steel Jaw]

Trying to find and download OpenXR is confusing as hell, anyone have a simple and direct link to it please?

And is OpenXR a sepearate app you run along side your Oculus 2 software or is it no an API plug-in you put into the DCS software?

[mbucchia]

2 hours ago, Steel Jaw said:

Trying to find and download OpenXR is confusing as hell, anyone have a simple and direct link to it please?

And is OpenXR a sepearate app you run along side your Oculus 2 software or is it no an API plug-in you put into the DCS software?

You don't download OpenXR, it's a feature your platform already supports. All you have to do is enable it, which is explained in the first 2 posts of this thread.

[VC]

Silly question, but I'm getting conflicting answers from people. Is this feature now on by default, or do we still need to do the "force enable" as in the first post of this thread?

And will the runtime still be SteamVR (my headset is a Vive Pro), so no change in terms of how the UI looks when I play?

[mrsylvestre]

I do not have a Vive Pro but a Pico 4 so YMMV but on my system, the OpenXR feature is the default with the multithreading (MT) dcs.exe found in the bin-mt/ folder of the DCS installation. I do not have to use any kind of "force enable" anymore. I *think* that the single-threaded executable, on the other hand, defaults to vanilla SteamVR.

I assume the same will apply with the Vive Pro. You can confirm which runtime has been used by looking into the dcs.log file. On my system the OpenXR runtime used is the one provided by SteamVR (the Pico 4 is not a native OpenXR headset for PCVR) but MBucchia's 3rd-party tools that depend on OpenXR, such as the OpenXT toolkit and QuadViews work flawlessly. From this VivePort page, I guess it should be the same with a Vive Pro.

[Qcumber]

On 10/5/2023 at 10:13 AM, VC said:

Silly question, but I'm getting conflicting answers from people. Is this feature now on by default, or do we still need to do the "force enable" as in the first post of this thread?

And will the runtime still be SteamVR (my headset is a Vive Pro), so no change in terms of how the UI looks when I play?

If you run MT it automatically starts in open XR through whichever vr runtime you use (oculus, steam vr, windows mixed reality). You don't need to force it any more.

[VC]

OK thanks, now the reverse question. How do I force MT to not use OpenXR, and just use SteamVR/OpenVR normally?

[dburne]

1 hour ago, VC said:

OK thanks, now the reverse question. How do I force MT to not use OpenXR, and just use SteamVR/OpenVR normally?

Why? MT was created for Open XR. Just run regular DCS.exe.

 

Edited October 7, 2023 by dburne

[VC]

2 hours ago, dburne said:

Why? MT was created for Open XR. Just run regular DCS.exe.

Because I want the benefits of MT, better FPS on average, but MT gives me weird random frame drops and stutter between periods of better FPS. I'm trying to narrow down causes, and found some threads where people with SteamVR native headsets were complaining that OpenXR was stuttery.

[dock999]

19 hours ago, VC said:

OK thanks, now the reverse question. How do I force MT to not use OpenXR, and just use SteamVR/OpenVR normally?

Yes u can!. You can launch  MT via VD panel . When MT is launched by this way, MT runs OpenVR rather than OpenXR and U can even bypass SteamVR.

[VirusAM]

Yes u can!. You can launch  MT via VD panel . When MT is launched by this way, MT runs OpenVR rather than OpenXR and U can even bypass SteamVR.

Wrong...
MT doesn't support openVR.
You can run DCs Mt via steamvr, but OpenXR runtime will be used.

[dburne]

29 minutes ago, VirusAM said:

Wrong...
MT doesn't support openVR.
You can run DCs Mt via strange, but OpenXR runtime will be used.

 

Yep!!

[dock999]

38 minutes ago, VirusAM said:

Wrong...
MT doesn't support openVR.
You can run DCs Mt via strange, but OpenXR runtime will be used.

Have you EVER TESTed by urself??  U So-called "ED Beta tester"

I can prove to you :   ( BTW  PICO4 is one of my headset)

1) DCS MT can be run by OpenVR with no command line rather than OPenXR .2) The Launch Must be completed through WD panel 3) it can bypass  SteamVR

I just did a test for you "" beta tester??"   and the followings are just some lines from the log file . I also have attached the entire log file to the message

A:

023-10-08 12:26:21.630 INFO    APP (2768): Command line: "C:\Program Files\Eagle Dynamics\DCS World OpenBeta\bin-mt\DCS.exe"
2023-10-08 12:26:21.630 INFO    APP (2768): DCS/2.8.8.43704 (x86_64; MT; Windows NT 10.0.19045)
2023-10-08 12:26:21.630 INFO    APP (2768): Application revision: 223704
2023-10-08 12:26:21.630 INFO    APP (2768): Renderer revision: 24140

B:

023-10-08 12:27:29.345 ERROR   VISUALIZER (2768): OpenXR exception: XrResult failure [XR_ERROR_FORM_FACTOR_UNAVAILABLE]
    Origin: xr
    Source: Projects\Visualizer\Source\OpenXR\openxr_program.cpp:447
2023-10-08 12:27:29.534 INFO    VISUALIZER (2768): LAUNCH IN VR OculusRift: OculusRift : Oculus Rift S
2023-10-08 12:27:29.535 INFO    VISUALIZER (2768): render thread initialization...

C; Look at the screenshot: this is the hallmark of MT: CPU limited warning sentence . However The DCS MT was running under OpenVR

 

dcs.log

[Qcumber]

It looks like this is running oculus runtime rather than steam VR. VD requires either oculus or steam VR. However, it should still use open xr. I have both a rift s and a Pico 4 so can verify that MT runs in open XR whether this uses oculus or steam VR runtimes. If you check in VD game overlay it will tell you which runtime is being used. 

[VirusAM]

Have you EVER TESTed by urself??  U So-called "ED Beta tester"
I can prove to you :   ( BTW  PICO4 is one of my headset)
1) DCS MT can be run by OpenVR with no command line rather than OPenXR .2) The Launch Must be completed through WD panel 3) it can bypass  SteamVR
I just did a test for you "" beta tester??"   and the followings are just some lines from the log file . I also have attached the entire log file to the message
A:
023-10-08 12:26:21.630 INFO    APP (2768): Command line: "C:\Program Files\Eagle Dynamics\DCS World OpenBeta\bin-mt\DCS.exe"
2023-10-08 12:26:21.630 INFO    APP (2768): DCS/2.8.8.43704 (x86_64; MT; Windows NT 10.0.19045)
2023-10-08 12:26:21.630 INFO    APP (2768): Application revision: 223704
2023-10-08 12:26:21.630 INFO    APP (2768): Renderer revision: 24140
B:
023-10-08 12:27:29.345 ERROR   VISUALIZER (2768): OpenXR exception: XrResult failure [XR_ERROR_FORM_FACTOR_UNAVAILABLE]
    Origin: xr
    Source: Projects\Visualizer\Source\OpenXR\openxr_program.cpp:447
2023-10-08 12:27:29.534 INFO    VISUALIZER (2768): LAUNCH IN VR OculusRift: OculusRift : Oculus Rift S
2023-10-08 12:27:29.535 INFO    VISUALIZER (2768): render thread initialization...
C; Look at the screenshot: this is the hallmark of MT: CPU limited warning sentence . However The DCS MT was running under OpenVR
 

dcs.log

All I can see is that you were running DCS emulating an Oculus device, and this is what Virtual desktop does when you use the menu "launch game" in the virtual desktop tray icon.
So yes, you can use the pico 4 without steamvr...you can easily do that with virtual desktop as you did..
Also, openVR is a steamvr only runtime (which will be soon abandoned by Valve itself). So without running steamvr it is not possible to use openVR (this is in general, not DCS specific).
And yes...I tested this, and I tested many more things (which I cannot discuss here of course).
No need to heat up....I just corrected a wrong info that you wrote.
So in the end, I can 100% assure you, that DCS in MT cannot be run with openVR.

[VirusAM]

It looks like this is running oculus runtime rather than steam VR. VD requires either oculus or steam VR. However, it should still use open xr. I have both a rift s and a Pico 4 so can verify that MT runs in open XR whether this uses oculus or steam VR runtimes. If you check in VD game overlay it will tell you which runtime is being used. 

Exactly... He is using oculus runtime...
Virtual Desktop emulates an Oculus device.
By default it uses steamvr, if you run any game with the launch game menu in the tray icon it will bypass steamvr emulating the oculus runtime.
But DCS in MT runs only with OpenXR.
Every major VR player uses OpenXR runtime...so independently from oculus, steamvr, or windows mixed reality software OpenXR runtime is always used.

[dock999]

5 minutes ago, VirusAM said:

All I can see is that you were running DCS emulating an Oculus device, and this is what Virtual desktop does when you use the menu "launch game" in the virtual desktop tray icon.
So yes, you can use the pico 4 without steamvr...you can easily do that with virtual desktop as you did..
Also, openVR is a steamvr only runtime (which will be soon abandoned by Valve itself). So without running steamvr it is not possible to use openVR (this is in general, not DCS specific).
And yes...I tested this, and I tested many more things (which I cannot discuss here of course).
No need to heat up....I just corrected a wrong info that you wrote.
So in the end, I can 100% assure you, that DCS in MT cannot be run with openVR.


 

I do not have Oculus.

I was using Pico 4 via VD. For some reason Pico 4 runs Oculus running time

[VirusAM]

I do not have Oculus.
I was using Pico 4 via VD. For some reason Pico 4 runs Oculus running time

Not for some reason...it is by design.... Virtual Desktop has this capability.
If you use pico4 with Virtual Desktop, you will be emulating an Oculus device...that is how it works...
If you use Pico's streaming assistant you will be able to use it with DCS only with steamvr and you will see the pico4 detected as a pico4

[dburne]

MT = Open XR. There is zero reason to run MT if one wants to go through Steam VR. 

[speed-of-heat]

16 minutes ago, dburne said:

MT = Open XR. There is zero reason to run MT if one wants to go through Steam VR. 

No, there is still improved performance...but I agree as stands SteamVR does not seem to be able to run MT...

 

[VC]

12 minutes ago, dburne said:

MT = Open XR. There is zero reason to run MT if one wants to go through Steam VR. 

I get it, MT forces OpenXR only. But the second half doesn't make sense, MT and the VR API are separate things. MT has benefits in terms of spreading out CPU load and improves FPS for CPU bound system, which is the case regardless of VR or flat screen or rendering system. So if OpenXR runs worse than OpenVR, but MT in itself provides other benefits anyway, then absolutely there is a reason to want to run MT with OpenVR/SteamVR. Hopefully this will be an option in the future.

[speed-of-heat]

I have tried changing Steam to be the default OPENXR runtime, but I can't get this to be stable with WMR...

[actually_fred]

I've not tried forcing MT to OpenVR, but it definitely is possible to force it to the legacy Oculus API by sufficiently breaking your OpenXR configuration - DCS MT will always *try* to use OpenXR, but if it fails in the right way, it'll fall back to the Oculus API.

[Zebra1-1]

On 10/6/2023 at 12:52 PM, Qcumber said:

If you run MT it automatically starts in open XR through whichever vr runtime you use (oculus, steam vr, windows mixed reality). You don't need to force it any more.

So we don't need to add the string to the DCS.exe anymore? Is this true for the Steam version too?

[Qcumber]

3 hours ago, Zebra1-1 said:

So we don't need to add the string to the DCS.exe anymore?

Yes. That is correct for the MT version. You will still need to add the string for the ST version to run in open xr. 

 

3 hours ago, Zebra1-1 said:

Is this true for the Steam version too?

I believe so but I don't use the steam version. 

[mrsylvestre]

On 10/8/2023 at 3:20 PM, VirusAM said:

If you use Pico's streaming assistant you will be able to use it with DCS only with steamvr and you will see the pico4 detected as a pico4

Aha! Does that mean that the MT version of DCS.exe cannot work with Pico's streaming assistant? It is something that has been bugging me for some time, I think that back in May, I could run it with SA but when I tried recently, I could not make it work anymore (but then, perhaps I remember wrong and I used the single-threaded version at the time).