Flaming Cliffs 3

[rattler]

There are enough simmers around to make the FC2 to (FC3) or what ever patch to make it worth while to ED. This sim will not go away without a fight. There is still a very hardcore portion, that fly FC2 and will continue to fly FC2 or a patch, for a long time to come. DCS is a great concept but time is running out for a lot of simmers(age, other intrests,family and medical reasons etc.)so keeping FC2 or FC3 as an alternative is something that should be looked at by ED. Alot of simmers don't have or want to wait long between modules. Great concept but takes to long to develop a module. Personal opinion.

[MoGas]

However they are a large collection of folks who have no interest in lite weight sims. Not a majority of the community to be sure by a sizable number who agree with my point of view. The point being that many reasonable people share my viewpoint.

 

Well, dont get me rong, I would like to have DCS standard all the way, but we will need many years to get there, to even think about what we are doing in the FC2 community with our events right now, you know what I mean...thats why you will always see people asking for FC3 or any upgrade...

 

Its seems like that some of you want to put the FC2 guys in the box of I dont know what, but this is rong, we have people who like different things, for example, I am not the dedicated bomber guy, fighter or multierole thats what I prefer, and I guess there are many others too, but so far, the only way to have it, is FC2.0 in some way. But it dosent mean that all this FC2 guys, dosent like DCS, they just wait for the right stuff......I guess....I know its funny, people like to see as FAST as POSSIBLE new DCS modules, but at the same time a FC upgrades....lol

 

It also will not make any differents, if those dedicated FC2 guys, who fly everday online 4-6h on comms based on real life tactics it dosent matter A2A or A2G, for those who may think right now, they are the DCS title guys, and we own the world kind of thinking, after few days, this OLD FC2 guys (light simmers), start to own the NEW DCS title pilots pretty quick again, as they may to right now on FC2...

[Steel Jaw]

Well I will admit that FC is a good gateway combat sim: my 6 year old son is discovering the merits of FC2.

[MoGas]

Well I will admit that FC is a good gateway combat sim: my 6 year old son is discovering the merits of FC2.

 

why not, my 6 year old cosine just learns to hover in the KA-50...its cool isnt it..:)

[Steel Jaw]

why not, my 6 year old cosine just learns to hover in the KA-50...its cool isnt it..:)

 

Touche....my son is also flying the Ka50, or trying, he has beter luck with basic airmanship in the A10C.

[rattler]

MoGas, I agree with your post but I would just like to add that there are some that will be satisfied with just FC2 for what ever reason. The DCS boys would argue this point but the truth is some just don't have the time to study all the material for a DCS aircraft or helo. I don't think that question has been asked and maybe it has. Most DCS fans will say , just wait till a fast mover arrives and FC2 will be history. I for one do not believe that for a second and there are lots of reasons people will stay with FC2. One example has already been given.IMHO.

[104th_Crunch]

Well I will admit that FC is a good gateway combat sim: my 6 year old son is discovering the merits of FC2.

 

That is why I think arcade modes in the DCS are great even though I never touch them. It is a gateway for more simmers into the community. Just like a survey sim like FC2 is or FC3 can be. I wish there were arcade mode servers online even for this reason.

 

If there is no real delay to DCS:Fighter making FC3, why not bring us a FC3? There is more good than harm. If FC3 delays DCS:Fighter, I hope ED decides to just move on. For us fighter guys wanting a DCS level experience, it has been and will continue to be a looonnnggg wait! Since 1999!

 

 

Concerning pilot workload and training. For those who may not be aware, there is an excellent TV series called JETSTREAM. It follows the training of Canadian F18C pilots.

It is one of the best that I have viewed, and lessons are applicable to this debate.

 

My favorite aviation series. A real behind the scenes look at training. Not to be missed by anyone on these forums.

Edited June 1, 2011 by Crunch

[HiJack]

However, one thing that might have an effect is that since you really do have to study a bit to even get airborne in DCS, there might be a little bit of a filter of sorts on who plays it and thus also who you end up meeting online.

So, just a SIM for the few IRL pilots then ;) There goes the new revenue.

 

(HJ)

[tflash]

Well, just like GG I really like the fact that you can be in different aircraft in FC2. And I do like to fly the Su-25T very much. Somehow I like its cockpit more than the A-10A/C one. Lately I'm most of the time flying the Ka-50, for a simple reason: I love the sound of the turboshaft engine.

 

I find it nice to be able to switch between FC2 / Ka-50 / A-10C, and I enjoy making and flying the same mission for the three sims. I find the missions in each sim as challenging as in the other.

 

But what completely eludes me, is how one of the sims would be more or less "hardcore" than the other. I do not need the label "hardcore simmer". My wife & kids just think I'm playing my hobby and I'm fine with that.

[Viper101]

Here's what I mean by "hardcore":

 

Simulating pilot workload. So max avionics/weaponeering functionality. I want my helmet fire.

 

Simulating pilot workload is impossible, get used to it. Just because certain individuals may have spent a few hours trying to learn how to use most of the systems in the A-10C cockpit does not make them the professional they think they are. I'm sure DCS: A-10C is programmed so you still couldn't just walk out on a flight-line and "hi-jack" a real A-10. Real A-10 pilots have spent countless hours in classrooms and reading books on everything that you believe you have learned in a few hours or maybe minutes. You might also be forgetting that you are flying a commercially made version of an official simulator made to train real transitioning A-10A pilots into the A-10C. Chances are Eagle Dynamics probably removed certain features like helmet functionality simply because it is for military use only or HMIT in general just can't be replicated in this simulator without the use of 360 FOV and/or the actual helmet.

 

My word of advise, just join the Air Force if you want to be as "hardcore" as it gets. That said, I wouldn't use the word hardcore so loosely because in reality speaking, the only hardcore pilot every one of us is a hardcore wannabe.;)

Edited June 1, 2011 by Viper101

[Steel Jaw]

the only hardcore pilot every one of us is a hardcore wannabe.;)

 

I agree. :P

[Cali]

 

My word of advise, just join the Air Force if you want to be as "hardcore" as it gets. That said, I wouldn't use the word hardcore so loosely because in reality speaking, the only hardcore pilot every one of us is a hardcore wannabe.;)

 

I would say that most people in here couldn't hack being a real life pilot. It'll be too much work for them, mentally, physically and emotionally they would fall short of it, Mower included :D

 

And Mower, I sleep good at night.

[GGTharos]

Simulating pilot workload is impossible, get used to it. Just because certain individuals may have spent a few hours trying to learn how to use most of the systems in the A-10C cockpit does not make them the professional they think they are.

 

What do you think they think they are? :D

 

I'm sure DCS: A-10C is programmed so you still couldn't just walk out on a flight-line and "hi-jack" a real A-10.

 

You sure could. Except for the 5.56 hail. Slight problem. Ignoring that, you sure could. Your safety and that of others would be at a good amount of risk, but you could.

 

Real A-10 pilots have spent countless hours in classrooms and reading books on everything that you believe you have learned in a few hours or maybe minutes.

 

Yes, but they didn't need a whole lot more time learning how to start an A-10 and take off in it than you did. Pilots do and learn a lot of EXTRA stuff, a /huge/ amount of it, that you never even think of.

 

You might also be forgetting that you are flying a commercially made version of an official simulator made to train real transitioning A-10A pilots into the A-10C. Chances are Eagle Dynamics probably removed certain features like helmet functionality simply because it is for military use only or HMIT in general just can't be replicated in this simulator without the use of 360 FOV and/or the actual helmet.

 

There was no helmet functionality, and I'm not convinced it could be easily modeled in the DTS anyway. Just because some features are indeed simplified for a bunch of reasons, they will not stop you from knowing how to start and fly the plane.

 

My word of advise, just join the Air Force if you want to be as "hardcore" as it gets. That said, I wouldn't use the word hardcore so loosely because in reality speaking, the only hardcore pilot every one of us is a hardcore wannabe.;)

 

Well, at least that's right ;)

[Boberro]

"Big majority" of what or whom?

 

I doubt the majority of A10C fliers care one way or the other about FC.

 

I will give 50 who dont from my online squad.

 

You can give 500. This is still margin ;]

[Pyroflash]

I would say that most people in here couldn't hack being a real life pilot. It'll be too much work for them, mentally, physically and emotionally they would fall short of it, Mower included :D

 

And Mower, I sleep good at night.

 

Is this the part where I come out and say that I am a real life pilot?

 

But yes, piloting IRL requires a little bit more attention than doing so in a game or sim. Aside from that however, having flown real planes for a number of years still doesn't make FC2 any less entertaining, in fact, I would argue that FC2 is just as entertaining as A-10C, if not for all the switches, then definitely for the PvP; and as others have said, it isn't any less or more hardcore than anything else out there, it is just different.

Edited June 1, 2011 by Pyroflash

[RIPTIDE]

I hear he's so hardcore, that when he ejects, he runs outside and sits in the rain for 2 hours.

[Viper101]

Is this the part where I come out and say that I am a real life pilot?

 

Civilian or military? If civilian than I would say there are a good amount of them within the LO/DCS community as well. Military on the other-hand are a bit harder to find.:P

Edited June 1, 2011 by Viper101

[Pyroflash]

Civilian or military? If civilian than I would say there are a good amount of them within the LO/DCS community as well. Military on the other-hand are a bit harder to find.:P

 

Right now, civilian, in three years, hopefully not. Most of the recruiters and pilots I know say I have pretty good chances, but we will see. I am carrying a 3.57 GPA in a respectable university, so I wouldn't count myself for dead just yet.

 

Still, there is a respectable amount of switches in a civilian plane, and the rules and stuff are still there, so I'd say being a pilot, even a civie one, takes a legitimate amount of work. At least if you actually follow proper procedures. Sadly I know of too many pilots who do not, and sometimes they pay the price for it. And where you can simply hit the re-fly button in A-10C, you can't in real life, but people tend not to think about that until after they wind up in the hospital, or worse, not being able to think about it at all.

Edited June 1, 2011 by Pyroflash

[Cali]

Is this the part where I come out and say that I am a real life pilot?

 

But yes, piloting IRL requires a little bit more attention than doing so in a game or sim. Aside from that however, having flown real planes for a number of years still doesn't make FC2 any less entertaining, in fact, I would argue that FC2 is just as entertaining as A-10C, if not for all the switches, then definitely for the PvP; and as others have said, it isn't any less or more hardcore than anything else out there, it is just different.

 

What do you fly? Flying at 120-180kts is way different then at 300-400, things happen much quicker.

 

 

 

I hear he's so hardcore, that when he ejects, he runs outside and sits in the rain for 2 hours.

 

Lmao :lol:, forget he throws himself off the roof of his house

 

Right now, civilian, in three years, hopefully not. Most of the recruiters and pilots I know say I have pretty good chances, but we will see. I am carrying a 3.57 GPA in a respectable university, so I wouldn't count myself for dead just yet.

 

Still, there is a respectable amount of switches in a civilian plane, and the rules and stuff are still there, so I'd say being a pilot, even a civie one, takes a legitimate amount of work. At least if you actually follow proper procedures. Sadly I know of too many pilots who do not, and sometimes they pay the price for it. And where you can simply hit the re-fly button in A-10C, you can't in real life, but people tend not to think about that until after they wind up in the hospital, or worse, not being able to think about it at all.

 

Flying civilian and military is a different beast, especially if you are a fighter pilot....different planet. I hope you get to fly what you want, that would be exciting!

[MoGas]

I hear he's so hardcore, that when he ejects, he runs outside and sits in the rain for 2 hours.

 

you always make me laugh....stop posting for now pls....:megalol:

[SUBS17]

What do you think they think they are? :D

 

 

 

You sure could. Except for the 5.56 hail. Slight problem. Ignoring that, you sure could. Your safety and that of others would be at a good amount of risk, but you could.

 

 

 

Yes, but they didn't need a whole lot more time learning how to start an A-10 and take off in it than you did. Pilots do and learn a lot of EXTRA stuff, a /huge/ amount of it, that you never even think of.

 

 

 

There was no helmet functionality, and I'm not convinced it could be easily modeled in the DTS anyway. Just because some features are indeed simplified for a bunch of reasons, they will not stop you from knowing how to start and fly the plane.

 

 

 

Well, at least that's right ;)

 

I've heard of a guy jumping on a real F-16 sim and starting it up and taking off after playing Falcon and also a ground crewman once took an A4 for a circuit IRL after spending sometime playing sims on a PC. Of course he got jail for it, military prison is far worse than normal prison IRL.:thumbup:

[SUBS17]

Civilian or military? If civilian than I would say there are a good amount of them within the LO/DCS community as well. Military on the other-hand are a bit harder to find.:P

 

Theres quite a few in SVN I've flown with quite a few real fighter pilots as an IP. They normally pass our trainning straight away.:thumbup:

Unless they are drunk lol.

[SUBS17]

I hear he's so hardcore, that when he ejects, he runs outside and sits in the rain for 2 hours.

 

lol that deserves a rep.:D

[Steel Jaw]

I hear he's so hardcore, that when he ejects, he runs outside and sits in the rain for 2 hours.

 

:P

[ZQuickSilverZ]

I removed my sig banners to be able to speak more freely.

 

So I shant reveal them.

 

However they are a large collection of folks who have no interest in lite weight sims. Not a majority of the community to be sure by a sizable number who agree with my point of view. The point being that many reasonable people share my viewpoint.

 

 

Seriously? Gee Mower I expected something a little more slick from the Teflon Don Juan.

Edited June 2, 2011 by ZQuickSilverZ