Oculus Rift and DCS World Discussion

[PiedDroit]

You consider a 33% loss to be a 'slight' FPS hit? :helpsmilie:

Yes, why not? 60 fps is still useable.

But, take some time to read my previous comments, I'm not trying to say that there is no or little FPS impact, I'm trying to find out if the CPU is a bottleneck.

Of course the GPU will be sollicited, that's why the recommended GPU is a GTX970 (I'm using GTX680), but if the CPU is not too impacted, that's good news since most of the time the simulation games are CPU-hungry.

 

For example with my previous rig I couldn't get a decent FPS with Arma 3 (or 2, don't remember), even with lowest settings/screen resolution. Why? because of CPU!

[dot]

The Viewports are rendered separately.

 

One for Left and One for Right.

 

So everything is rendered twice.

 

Everything, Draw Calls, textures, is doubled. (essentially).

 

You can run DCS with side by side left/right viewports without OR

 

I really hope DCS will be able to run at 90 FPS in VR,

 

Maybe multithreaded rendering could help with this?

 

Also you don't need to render everything twice.

 

Stereoscopy is very important for objects up close - (cockpit).

 

Parallax effect for distant objects > 100m is so low (due to low screen resolution on VR HMD) that there is no pont in rendering distant objects twice.

[SkateZilla]

For OR its not just rendering twice, but rendering twice in stereoscopic 3d etc.

[dot]

For OR its not just rendering twice, but rendering twice in stereoscopic 3d etc.

 

Valve did an interesting talk about VR rendering at this years GDC:

 

They seem to think that brute force rendering everything twice is simply - bad.

[DerekSpeare]

As it appears to me we have two contenders fighting over the ~500 dollar price point. I am not alone in my willingness to pay a grand for a "super-dee-duper" Oculus/Vive on steroids. Maybe they will have more higher end options in the future.

[SkateZilla]

Valve did an interesting talk about VR rendering at this years GDC:

 

They seem to think that brute force rendering everything twice is simply - bad.

 

I can watch that conference on repeat all day...

 

 

That being said, other thab 2 viewports I.dunno how the dx9 calls are formatted. Likely brute force but I.cant say for sure.

[Chivas]

I would imagine we will see improved VR HMD's every year or so, especially as home computers improve, and VR technology/displays are improved/optimized. Best guess is the first Oculus and Vive units will release with reasonably close specs, with Oculus selling around a hundred dollars cheaper if they still plan to sell the Rift units at cost, and their input solution doesn't throw a spanner into their evaluation.

[SkateZilla]

Ths crap again........ They were trying to sue him for the last 2years.

[Chivas]

There may or may not be any validity too the claims, either way its doubtful it will effect the product we buy next year. Facebook, and Oculus have plenty of good lawyers to deal with any contingency.

[dot]

That happens because human eyes are pretty close to each other. It's not a technology limitation but what really happens in real life.

 

Yes, this effect is visible in real life where resolution is not an issue, so there is no need to draw distant objects twice in VR.

[Mr Whippy]

For something like DCS then you could probably get away with the cockpit only after about 250m in altitude... and even on the ground maybe the airfield is ample to give you parallax in renderings.

 

I'm not sure how the DCS renderer works, or how it'll work in DCS 2, but I'm guessing with DCS 2 being a ground up renderer with stereo rendering in mind at least a bit, then they'll have optimised it quite a bit for rendering.

 

It's always gonna cost more to do 3D, but I bet there is a lot you can do to cheapen the cost of double rendering if you design with it in mind.

 

I'm not even sure what the new DCS 2 renderer is, is it deferred or forward rendering?

 

Given the potential need for lots of lights/flares and night time explosions and all that stuff, I'd expect deferred, but you never know, given 99.9% of the time you just have a sun as the only light source/shadow caster.

 

 

 

Either way, given the cost of a VR system vs say loads of screens and/or cockpit screens on your desk or trackIR etc, then I'd happily buy a VR and a monster GPU as it's still cheaper than a load of screens and a similarly high powered GPU!

 

Dave

[SkateZilla]

Im guessin, since OVR was saying before it would take a $800 PC to get decent performance,

 

and not they are saying a OVR PC would cost $1500 all together,

 

Im guess ORCV will cost $600+

[dot]

Right now you can build PC with Oculus recommended specs for VR for about 650$.

http://pcpartpicker.com/p/pqP4kL

I think the price is not the issue, but technical requirements of running high end gaming rig optimally (windows, drivers, stability, etc.).

 

If VR is for the masses (according to Oculus) then the question is can average PC users easily maintain a VR gaming rig?

[rcjonessnp175]

They will hype it till the end then release price. Dont care about price 600 be totally fine and honestly thats where it should be to ensure a good quality product that works and lasts, unlike what the dev kits are.

[SkateZilla]

I want an AMD Fiji, 4096bit memory, good for VR.

[cichlidfan]

If VR is for the masses (according to Oculus) then the question is can average PC users easily maintain a VR gaming rig?

 

I suspect that, at least in the near term, mobile VR (i.e. Gear VR) will be for the masses.

[Fri13]

For how many the TrackIR 5 price of around $150 is too much?

For how many a $350 for HOTAS?

 

The Rift as any other will be a special tool, TrackIR will be cheaper and usable but not so immersive at all. HOTAS is required for pleasure and speed, but just a joystick is enough.

 

To get a 90fps constant that is pretty tough for many who wants latest games. But if just for DCS etc, it is doable unless price for VR is itself too high, and I believe the limit is around $200-300 for many. (I drop every few months 2000-3000€ for other hobby so it isnt question for me, as i draw my limit to $350)

[Chivas]

It depends if Oculus still plans to sell their units at cost, but either way I suspect the Oculus will sell for between 350 and 500 dollars, still cheaper and more immersive than a good monitor and TrackIR. I know I will probably never have to upgrade my monitor or TrackIR again, as my gaming needs will be in VR. I'll sell the TrackIR5, and any old monitor will do just fine for research etc. :)

[cichlidfan]

OR is either going to be a high end gaming device that will be somewhat expensive or it will be a lower priced device for the masses. It will not be both. If they try for both they are screwed. Jack of all master of none.

 

Gear VR and the Rift are two completely different products.

[Chivas]

Its OBVIOUS, and the developers have stated the fact many times that the Oculus Rift is intended to be a highend device targeting the highend gaming PC market. They just didn't know how highend until they had most the HMD specs nailed down, and how much they could optimize their first consumer headset. Oculus has never waivered from that plan, but there has been much speculation since the Facebook buyout that the Rift would be built exclusively for social media. There has never been a single fact to base that theory on. That said there is absolutely no reason a highend VR headset couldn't be used for social media aswell.

 

They also provided Samsung with the necessary tech for their GearVR mobile headset. Mobile VR will escalate the VR market much quicker for obvious reasons. Their deal with Samsung should also give Oculus access to highend displays with tech like high Fill Rate, high HTZ, Global display, etc necessary for the best VR possible in their first consumer version, at a reasonable pricepoint. Its a win/win partnership. Carmack has been working exclusively with mobile VR tech, which should bode well when they can eventually make the Oculus Rift wireless.

[rcjonessnp175]

That's cheap if you ask me. 1000 dollars alone is just the video cards these days....

[rcjonessnp175]

It doesn't cost 1500. That is total system cost of computer plus the rift by the way......

[Chivas]

I doubt it was planned marketing. The writer of the article took a statement from Irbe ,and used it as the title of his article. People who read the article would understand he was talking about total PC and Headset price. Unfortunately some people who haven't followed the development, and/or didn't read the article might assume that it was the cost of the headset.

 

When I read the article a few days ago, my first thought was there would be a number of posts in the VR forums from people suggesting they were going to buy the Vibe headset because the Rift was gonna cost 1500 dollars. It has happened, but I was actually surprised when it didn't happen here. ;)

[Chivas]

Good News, Bad News

 

Ghost Machine Launches Alpha, Greenlight for VR Flight Sim Warhawks http://vrfocus.com/archives/16064/ghost-machine-launches-alpha-greenlight-for-vr-flight-sim-warhawks/

 

Good News.....

 

VR could invigorate the flight sim market again

 

Bad News......

 

It will be mostly arcade type sims

 

Good News.......

 

Many of the new arcade flyers could create a demand for more demanding combat flight sims, creating a market big enough for developers to jump back into the genre.

[InspectorGadget]

How are you setting the DK2 up Direct or Extended mode in the CP of Rift?

 

Also how are you setting the Game to run Direct to Rift or in windowed mode or split screen?

 

Lastly (I clearly Have one and it is tricky some times to get all this correct..lol)

How are you setting it up inside of DCS???

 

Thanks for the help.

I love this stuff and bought the same Simulator I saw on UTube DCS, then, I bought the Rift DK2 and last I bought the B206 which will take a while to get here.

Then I have to learn how to configure that thing up to all work together.

Right now I cant even figure out how to configure a 3D logitech Joystick to accept the left and right and forward and back motions of the joystick..lol

 

Not to forget I just built an Alienware Laptop 4700 I7 with 770 Nvidia and they told me that wouldn't work either with Rift. But I got mine working excellent with 75FPS

1 TB of SSD HD 1 TB of SSHD HD and 64gig mSATA with 32 gigs Ram...

 

All of the computer work in last three-four weeks, Rift for about a week now.

DCS yesterday and tonight I bought to modules UH1H and the BlackShark...

 

So its a lot of reading configuration issues out the butt, and MUCH more to look forward too including, Learning to really fly a Helicopter, which I can do in real life control wise (got to take off land and hoover and fly with a Pilot in the Army) and I installed Avionics in Blackhawks but it has been 20 years..lol

 

Ok sorry I threw up in your thread, but hey I dont see many other Rift users here right now...I got excited...

Mark

Nice to meet ya by the way...

Edited June 4, 2015 by InspectorGadget