Oculus Rift and DCS World Discussion

[metalnwood]

Everybody talks about fps with VR, well with my dk2 and Dcs I never got judder until the fps went down to 30 ish range. Also never once felt sick or had any problems so you can't blanket statement if you drop below 75 or 90 fps it's horrible because that is not true. Depends on the user. Everybody is forgetting the most important factor and that everybody responds differently to VR and its frame rates. Don't get wrapped around the axle my experience was awesome even when fps was in 40's but evidently I have very good VR tolerance.

 

Hello, with respect to my reply on the topic, I wasnt so much saying that you would feel sick immediately if things got under 75 frames but unlike a monitor, you usually know if it has dipped below 75.

 

On a monitor if you dip from 75 to 60 you may not notice it has but you certainly do on the rift. As Derek also pointed out, under 75 and the dk2 will not do low persistence and that is noticeable for sure.

 

For software that supports timewarp and maintains 75 even though the game is less then the problem is much less and low persistence will still work.

 

My points were along the line that you cannot compare the changes in fps on a monitor to the rift, they do behave differently. Yes, it will effect different people to varying degrees but it is hard to argue with the research that oculus has done which says that most people benefit from the DK2 refresh rate and the CV1 refresh rate cured most of the people that still has issues with 75fps.

 

@Rangi I found I needed a small amount of time to get used to a racing cockpit, a slightly longer period of time to get used to a flying cockpit. I put this down to racing working perfectly and flying not having the framerate required so it can get to you a little. A tolerance will build up for it.

 

As far as first person shooters, thats a different ballgame for me. Cockpit experiences, no issues at all in the DK2. Running around. Yes, issues. I think you can build up the immunity but I dont play them enough to even try. I think a lot of that is related to lots of bobbing from walking/running in game that screws with the brain. I think they know that and will do something to make it work a bit better.

[joebloggs]

@Rangi -I handled the cockpit game fine, but I still want to puke after about 20 mins in first person games. I have tried to get used to playing this type of game, but I just cant handle because it's such a bad feeling. Once I start feeling sick I feel like that for hour after and don't even want to look at the Rift because it makes me feel even more sick. Some people recommend chewing ginger while using it and all sorts of other things, but I'd probably be sick from chewing ginger because I hate the stuff LOL.

 

Even though I fly jets mainly in DCS, I have to say the choppers are a blast in VR and are better then the Jets.

[Frusheen]

Question for dk2 users that get the vr malady;

have you found that you build a tolerance to the queasiness, or is it as bad after months of use as when you first started?

 

There seems to be two causes for sickness with me. With motion sickness I only ever have issues in games with first person movement. These are usually ported titles not designed for VR. In cockpit games such as DCS where you have a fixed reference I have no issues.

 

The second cause of sickness is judder. Any game which does not maintain high enough frame rate can be very uncomfortable. Initially this used to make me feel a bit queasy. Not so much anymore but it is still very uncomfortable and completely breaks immersion.

 

I don't get motion sick in real life so others who do may find their tolerance will vary.

 

Either way further improvements to game optimization and better rift implementation should see DCS becoming even more comfortable to use in VR.

[Enduro14]

Well I think one way of building up tolerance is to game on a 55 inch screen in 3D. Otherwise all the stuff I have done at work I'm sure helps aka scope and lots of Nvg's time. If you just a 2d gamer going to vr I can see where the adjustment period would come in. Also realize just because some company is stating all sickness is gone with 90 hz I call bs on it not everybody can handle certain stimulations of the brain. Don't read the hype across the Internet I would try a demo if your new to vr or had problems with the dk2 i foresee many cv1 on eBay in the ip coming months because we are only human and not all humans can do everything. Hence why we have selections in the military. New tech it's a gamble hope it works out for those new and those who had problems with dk2.

[Glowing_Amraam]

I've had the DK2 since the dev kits shipped, and I have never had any issues whatsoever. People get motion sick for various reasons, but people also get sick just by riding a car and not beeing able to see the road... It will be an issue for some people, but for most people it will not be an issue.

 

I've played maybe 50+ different VR demoes/games, from DCS, to FPS shooting and anything in between. For me, no issue, and you get used to how "it works" by looking around and moving around with the keyboard/controller or whatever.

 

But for games, such as where you move around using your own body, motion sickness would barely be an issue as long as you dont get any judders etc. That's my take on it anyway. I can't wait for these things to be released! :)

[_Acoustic_]

This is good stuff. I plan on taking up the P-51 first from a cold start and flying it like a passenger plane for the first couple hours rather than jumping in and pulling 5G turns and loops while engaged in ACM.

[ariyaner]

How to center view

 

hellas

 

i tried after a long time again dcs in my oculus rift dk2

and the new version 1.5.2 is much more better

but i have a big problem

i cannot center the view - and when i start dsc in the rift i look backwards :cry:

 

so simple question - how can i center my view ?

[Glowing_Amraam]

hellas

 

i tried after a long time again dcs in my oculus rift dk2

and the new version 1.5.2 is much more better

but i have a big problem

i cannot center the view - and when i start dsc in the rift i look backwards :cry:

 

so simple question - how can i center my view ?

 

"5" key on your numpad on the keyboard.

[hansangb]

Huh...interesting. Just as a frame of reference, I don't get sick on boats while fishing. I don't get sick flying NOE in a packed C130/141 sucking in jet fuel fumes. Never got sick doing the same in Chinooks, Blackhawks etc. And of course, never get sick while riding/reading in cars.

 

*BUT* with Rift, if the frame rate is below 75FPS, I get sick in a matter of minutes. 75 or above, I can fly A10's/Huey's for an hour or more with no issue.

 

How anyone can with Rift with 30FPS is beyond me. I'd also say we're looking at different counters.

 

But, different things tend to get people sick, so maybe there's something to "I never get sick in VR no matter how laggy it gets" It's just beyond me based on my background and my experience with motion sickness.

 

March/April can't come fast enough!

[hannibal]

Screen resolution is irrelevant for comparisons as well. You get one resolution with Many of us have been using this regularly for more than a year, the collective knowledge just here on this forum is likely encyclopedic. I've told newbs this many times that when you first get a VR device and begin using it, you will need some time to adjust to it. Once that passes, you'll not even think about it.

 

you sir, are my hero!

keep the VR topics flowing!!

 

also another point i want to bring up in terms of VR and DCS, is CONTENT!!

 

just recently, DCS release campaigns for A10C, F15, Ka50...

 

i think a VR oriented campaign is needed!

a campaign that would be co-op oriented, and focus on either the Su25T or FC3 modules.

new oculus owners will look for good rift experiences.. DCS is great, menu's in the works..

but once they start flying, then what? not everyone (newbiess) will get modules off the bat. Su25T already free for them, why not have a quality campaign dlc for su25t/fc3 as a choice to suppliment content in their oculus/DCS experience!

 

but im happy to know eagle dynamics is working on a functional menu/cockpit interaction for the VR experience!

[hannibal]

comments about cooperative play in VR by epic games studios dev..

 

"VR can be isolating without it, and he says that having a shared space and community within VR instantly makes an experience more compelling."

 

http://www.roadtovr.com/epic-games-nick-whiting-designing-bullet-train-interaction-fidelity/

 

so again, vr menus, co-op content will further the DCS VR experience!

[Glowing_Amraam]

 

*BUT* with Rift, if the frame rate is below 75FPS, I get sick in a matter of minutes. 75 or above, I can fly A10's/Huey's for an hour or more with no issue.

 

How anyone can with Rift with 30FPS is beyond me. I'd also say we're looking at different counters.

 

Well, my only experience is with the DK2, and though I don't get motion sick with fps less than 75, the judder and "jerkiness" is extremely annoying, and it kind of is a strain on the eyes as well. And you could get very easily motion sick from it, obviously.

 

But when it's smooth, which it basically have to be to be able to enjoy VR, it's not an issue whatsoever, and it probably isn't going to be an issue for most people. :)

[badaboom]

Thanks GA:thumbup:

[joebloggs]

I've had the DK2 since the dev kits shipped, and I have never had any issues whatsoever. People get motion sick for various reasons, but people also get sick just by riding a car and not beeing able to see the road... It will be an issue for some people, but for most people it will not be an issue.

 

I'm thinking most people will not tolerate it given the amount of topics on the Internet there is about it. I've shown the DK2 to many friends and they have all left feeling sick or been sick after playing First Person shooters. I do hope the 90Hz is the sickness cure, but I'm very doubtful because they said the same thing about 75Hz.

[DerekSpeare]

...

 

But for games, such as where you move around using your own body, motion sickness would barely be an issue as long as you dont get any judders etc. That's my take on it anyway. I can't wait for these things to be released! :)

 

This is a good point. There are two causes of disorientation in essence. There is the first cause related to a user who would is susceptible to motion sickness in general. The second is "VR Induced Disorientation". What causes that most acutely is judder or when the frame rates go below the HMD's refresh rate. That gives rise mental dissonance from the mixed signals from the inner ear and eyes resulting in queasiness.

 

While some users can get used to it and grow their "VR Legs", others may not be able to. Doing the best to run VR applications on a high end system should help to prevent judder/ghosting/flickers/frame skips, which would reduce the chances for VR disorientation.

 

I personally feel the issue is overblown. Most folks who have experienced it report it goes away after they get used to VR gaming.

 

DCS + Oculus = WOWOWOW for me. Racing is a blast as well. For flying and driving, VR is a natural fit.

[joebloggs]

Does anyone think just thinking about sickness can make you feel sick in the Rift? Maybe it's because I'm thinking I'm going to feel sick that makes me sick in First Person Shooters.

[hansangb]

I don't know about others, but for me, it's not psychosomatic. That's the reason why I posted my background. And Derek is correct, there is some adjustment you have to go through, but quite frankly, you get over that quickly. Whatever adjustment your brain needs, it quickly gets shadowed byt the sheer awesomeness of VR. Like I said, there is *nothing* like tracking a SAM by looking over your shoulder and down while flying *and* maintaining the orientation because it's natural. You simply *cannot* do that with TrackIR's of the world.

[Glowing_Amraam]

I'm thinking most people will not tolerate it given the amount of topics on the Internet there is about it. I've shown the DK2 to many friends and they have all left feeling sick or been sick after playing First Person shooters. I do hope the 90Hz is the sickness cure, but I'm very doubtful because they said the same thing about 75Hz.

 

I've had probably 15 people tried my DK 2 here, and the only time someone got a little motion sickness was either because of judders, an insane theme park ride (Cyberspace is awesome) or that they were playing an FPS game for the first time using VR, which takes some getting used to (IMO at least).

[DerekSpeare]

...Whatever adjustment your brain needs, it quickly gets shadowed byt the sheer awesomeness of VR. Like I said, there is *nothing* like tracking a SAM by looking over your shoulder and down while flying *and* maintaining the orientation because it's natural. You simply *cannot* do that with TrackIR's of the world.

 

QFT :thumbup:

 

@Glowing Amraam - GREAT videos! :clap:

[Enduro14]

I don't know about others, but for me, it's not psychosomatic. That's the reason why I posted my background. And Derek is correct, there is some adjustment you have to go through, but quite frankly, you get over that quickly. Whatever adjustment your brain needs, it quickly gets shadowed byt the sheer awesomeness of VR. Like I said, there is *nothing* like tracking a SAM by looking over your shoulder and down while flying *and* maintaining the orientation because it's natural. You simply *cannot* do that with TrackIR's of the world.

 

Fact nothing compares!

[Frusheen]

I got my KW-908 Jetseat yesterday and I got a few minutes to fly last night. Decided to try my hand at some pinnacle landings.

 

[dot]

I've played assetto corsa yesterday with T300 racing wheel and after changing some settings in TM control panel I ended up with only spring force.

 

It felt really weird, almost like driving blind, it was really hard to figure out what the car was up to...

 

Can't imagine what it must be like driving an aircraft with 'soggy' stick on a spring :P

(I'm using Logitech G940)

[TOYKILLA]

The G940 FFB realy sucks and it's all plastic :-) Test an Thrustmaster Warthog,that ist a Bodnar Wheel against your G920 :-). You can not compare SimRacing with Flight Sim...If you like real Fun,Buy a SimXperience Stage 4 motion Simulator... Can't wait for my CV1 with DCS and AC,iR,PCars and many more ...

Edited February 11, 2016 by TOYKILLA

[dot]

Hm, I see now that my post probably sounds a bit sarcastic, but I really think that you are missing a lot if you have a spring joystick :)

 

Warthog is nice and very expensive, however it has a spring which is big NO imho.

 

And, no offence but talking about toys, SimXperience Stage 4 motion Simulator looks like massage chair gone crazy.

 

Google '6dof motion platform', that should be much better for CV1.

[dot]

How well is DCS performing on amd cards in VR?

I've had nVidia cards for years mainly because of more stable drivers, but I'm thinking of getting R9 290 till new GPUs arrive later this year.

Can amd drivers handle 1080p projector, 1080p monitor and DK2 without playing up, or should I stick with nvidia?