DCS: AJS-37 Viggen Discussion

[Snail]

the RB 75 is the Swedish Designation for the AGM-65A.

 

With the RB 75T being a AGM-65A with a heavy blast-fragmentation

warhead like some of the Later AGM-65 Variants.

 

Sweden never acquired the AGM-65B but Leatherneck have said they are gonna add it as well since it would be useable by the AJS 37

(as it was compatible with any aircraft capable of using the AGM-65A)

and it has a Zoom function that will make it easier to use compared to the RB 75s with their Zoomed out Seekers.

(that make the RB 75 / 75T harder to use for target acquisition etc then they would have been IRL due to ingame limitations concerning resolution etc).

 

Unless the solution was found in tweaking the resolution of the image display. A zoomable RB75 feels a bit like cheating (though it's useful ingame ;-) )

[drPhibes]

So if I understand this correctly they are using ED's AGM65B instead of designing their own Rb 75?

 

No. The 65B is in addition to the Rb75/T. So there will be 3 different Mavs available.

[Pocket Sized]

So if I understand this correctly they are using ED's AGM65B instead of designing their own Rb 75?

 

I asked on the AMA and they said they're developing their own implementations of the seeker head behavior. Will be interesting to see how it compares to the A-10C.

[mattebubben]

So if I understand this correctly they are using ED's AGM65B instead of designing their own Rb 75?

 

I dont think there is a AGM 65B ingame atm =P

 

if so what aircraft has it? the earliest that can be carried by the A-10A ingame

is the AGM-65D.

[IonicRipper]

No. The 65B is in addition to the Rb75/T. So there will be 3 different Mavs available.

 

Oh... Well thats a bit strange then IMO. At least we have the option not to use it. I know I wont if indeed it was not carried by the Viggen

 

I dont think there is a AGM 65B ingame atm =P

 

if so what aircraft has it? the earliest that can be carried by the A-10A ingame

is the AGM-65D.

 

Youre right I think I was mistaken with another game that has Bs (Falcon 4.33 most likely)

[Sarge55]

@ mattebubben - If green indicates inert in Sweden what colour is live ordnance?

[AdurianJ]

@ mattebubben - If green indicates inert in Sweden what colour is live ordnance?

 

Sweden follow the NATO standard i think.

 

Yellow = Live

Green = Inert

Blue = Practice

Brown = Ballast warhead

Red = incendiary

White = Illumination

[RaXha]

Sweden follow the NATO standard i think.

 

Yellow = Live

Green = Inert

Blue = Practice

Brown = Ballast warhead

Red = incendiary

White = Illumination

 

That's true these days but im not sure we always did. :-) I found this old chart. :-)

 

[renhanxue]

Not during the Cold War. The standard was similar, but different enough to be confusing. For projectile weapons of caliber 20mm and greater, hand grenades and rockets, the base color of the body of the round is as follows:

 

Black: AP (kinetic), APHE, HEAT

Red: SAP (semi armor piercing)

Grey, unpainted or "special surface treatment": HE, canister, smoke, incendiary, illumination

Yellow: HE (60mm caliber or less only)

Green: inert (or mockup round)

 

Additionally, there should be a ring painted on the round (or around the warhead, in the case of rockets where the warhead and the rocket body count as two separate rounds) that denotes the type of warhead, as follows:

 

Yellow: explosive (omitted if the round is already yellow)

Orange: incendiary

Light grey: smoke

Blue: practice (if the round is manufactured solely for practice use, it can be painted entirely blue)

Brown: dummy (inert warhead with the appropriate weight but no effect)

 

In the case of rockets they usually seem to have painted the entire warhead in this color - the marking standard mentions that "for ease of manufacturing, the ring may sometimes be extended to cover the entire body of the projectile". Additionally a black ring may be added to denote that the round has some armor piercing ability (for example some HE rounds with thicker walls that still aren't quite SAP).

 

Special cases (going down the pedantry rabbithole now just for the sake of it):

- illumination rounds have the word LYS in white somewhere on them, and usually the duration of the light is also added

- tracers are denoted by either a ring around the tip of the projectile or the last two digits of the manufacturing year of the tracer, in the same color as the light of the tracer itself (exception for some yellow rounds that have tracer as standard where this may be omitted)

- the letters RSV ("riktad sprängverkan", shaped charge) is sometimes added to HEAT rounds

- canister rounds are marked with the letters GRKT ("granatkartesch")

 

Ammunitionskatalog för flygvapnet has pictures of all of this in action. Live rb 75's are white (counts as "unpainted", I guess) with a yellow ring, HEAT rockets are grey with a black warhead with a yellow ring, practice rockets are grey with a brown warhead, etc. Green with a yellow ring would be rather confusing since it would indicate that the round is inert but has a live warhead.

 

e: RaXha got there first, with a handy illustration to boot.

Edited January 5, 2017 by renhanxue

[RaXha]

e: RaXha got there first, with a handy illustration to boot.

 

Yea well, my illustration doesn't help much without knowing how to read the descriptions. :P

[AdurianJ]

Also ammunition can vary a great deal in how dangerous it is to practice with within the same color range.

 

I remember that we used Blue hand grenades and they basically had a small fire cracker inside that you could replace and they where used for training.

But the 9mm rounds that the AT4 anti tank weapon used which had the same ballistics as the projectile where as dangerous as any 9mm round.

[Snail]

9mm??

[drPhibes]

9mm??

 

 

[slightly off topic] Sub-caliber training kits are available for several types of shoulder launched anti-armor weapons (rocket propelled grenade launchers and recoilless rifles like the Carl Gustaf etc). They use specially made tracer rounds with ballistic properties that are quite similar to the real thing, so they can be used for cheap training. The sub-caliber devices consist of a complete barrel and breech(w/striker) assembly that mounts in the barrel of the weapon system in question.

[renhanxue]

He's referring to the family of 9mm practice weapons for the Swedish recoilless rifles (granatgevär m/48 and m/86 as well as pansarskott m/68 and m/86). On the grg (Carl Gustav, in international parlance) this is a dinky little single shot 9mm pistol-like gun mounted inside what is essentially an inert round for the real thing. On the single-use launchers (Miniman and AT4) the practice weapon is mounted fixed in the main weapon's tube since, well, single use. When you fire the weapon as normal the 9mm practice weapon goes off with a rather anticlimactic "plop" (the muzzle velocity is subsonic) and you get a tracer round that has ballistics similar to the real thing out to maybe 150 meters. While it's a lot less dangerous than a real 84mm HE or HEAT round, it's effectively still a pistol round and normal range safety rules apply.

 

It's mainly intended for practicing the handling (and in case of the grg, reloading) of the weapon over and over again until it's reflex. For actual aiming practice there's also a 20mm variant which is actually recoilless and matches the ballistics of the real thing a lot closer throughout the normal firing envelope. Both of these also have the advantage of not making a gigantic overpressure blast, which is good for work safety reasons (there are medical limitations on how many of these you're permitted per day in peacetime).

 

e: beaten again, I type too slow

Edited January 5, 2017 by renhanxue

[drPhibes]

e: beaten again, I type too slow

 

HAH! It's Karl XII all over again :P

[Pizzasalladland]

HAH! It's Karl XII all over again :P

 

Wow, dont go that path!

[SandMartin]

Guys, in last tutorial - "ZONE TWO" - means Afterburner Stage 2 ? I.E. maximum stage of afterburner ?

[renhanxue]

Guys, in last tutorial - "ZONE TWO" - means Afterburner Stage 2 ? I.E. maximum stage of afterburner ?

It does mean stage 2 afterburner, yes, but there are three stages total. "Max zone 3" is what you say when you mean max afterburner (there is a bit of throttle adjustment possible within each zone).

[nomdeplume]

Guys, in last tutorial - "ZONE TWO" - means Afterburner Stage 2 ? I.E. maximum stage of afterburner ?

And to add to renhanxue's comment, when he kicks in the afterburner (1:15 of the ARAK pop-up attack video) you can see the afterburner stage indicator lights on the right side of the dash - he overshoots and lights stage 3 for a moment so you can see all 3 lights until he throttles down a bit to leave it in stage 2.

[BravoYankee4]

He's referring to the family of 9mm practice weapons for the Swedish recoilless rifles (granatgevär m/48 and m/86 as well as pansarskott m/68 and m/86). On the grg (Carl Gustav, in international parlance) this is a dinky little single shot 9mm pistol-like gun mounted inside what is essentially an inert round for the real thing. On the single-use launchers (Miniman and AT4) the practice weapon is mounted fixed in the main weapon's tube since, well, single use. When you fire the weapon as normal the 9mm practice weapon goes off with a rather anticlimactic "plop" (the muzzle velocity is subsonic) and you get a tracer round that has ballistics similar to the real thing out to maybe 150 meters. While it's a lot less dangerous than a real 84mm HE or HEAT round, it's effectively still a pistol round and normal range safety rules apply.

 

It's mainly intended for practicing the handling (and in case of the grg, reloading) of the weapon over and over again until it's reflex. For actual aiming practice there's also a 20mm variant which is actually recoilless and matches the ballistics of the real thing a lot closer throughout the normal firing envelope. Both of these also have the advantage of not making a gigantic overpressure blast, which is good for work safety reasons (there are medical limitations on how many of these you're permitted per day in peacetime).

 

e: beaten again, I type too slow

 

For the practice weapons there is a possibility to add an extra charge (signaturladdning) that simulates the back blast with some more "boom". Both for the 9 and 20 mm and for the blinds, which add some realism when you use the Simfire laser equipment =)

 

Shooting with the 9 mm (actually this is pretty similar to a standard pistol round) was really dissapointing. The 20 mm is however a little more fun. But shooting a full 8.4 cm round makes the world spin for a short moment :thumbup:

 

 

 

Note the blue ring at the AT4

Edited January 6, 2017 by BravoYankee4

[IonicRipper]

^ That reminds me of our army here in Canada for some reason. It seems our forces have a lot in common.

 

Any footage or info about the Rb 05? Im curious to see how it will be to guide these to targets considering the lack of 3d perception.

Edited January 6, 2017 by IonicRipper

[Snail]

Thanks for the explanations. I shot with 9mm rounds myself (UZI) when I was drafted in the '70's. It didn't make much of an impression ;-)

[Pocket Sized]

Last night marks the second dream I've had in which the Viggen releases, and the fourth dream about the Viggen in general.

[Pocket Sized]

Also, does the HUD have any general purpose navigation modes in which it isn't slaved to a waypoint? I imagine most of us will be spending a lot of time flying without any particular flight plan. I probably need to re-read the HUD section of the manual....

 

Edit: It seems like the HUD slave switch would keep the pitch ladder from moving left or right, however the manual doesn't mention what this switch does outside of low altitude or landing modes.

Edited January 10, 2017 by Pocket Sized

[The_Pharoah]

wow, 395 pages.

 

anyway, I'm still deciding whether to purchase or wait. Can someone explain something to me? how exactly will it be used in the attack role ie. ignoring anti ship strikes, does the Viggen have a TGP or do we have to find targets with the Mk I eyeball?