Force Feedback Support?

[hazzer]

Great effects:) I notice there isn't any movement when trimming on the stick, could this be implemented

[Milopapa]

Great effects:) I notice there isn't any movement when trimming on the stick, could this be implemented

 

I believe that is what they said is coming next.

[Delta59R]

Agree, even the 'basic' implementation is amazing! Buffetting, jet wash, stalls... wow.

 

 

 

Yeah! when I noticed the jet wash trimmer from the phoenix launch out front of me...WOW, or going supersonic AKA Ballistic at low altitudes, stick shake matches cabin shake :D

[Renko]

Question to the FFB lovers

 

With the last update did you lost the FFB for the buffeting?

Cant feel the aerodinamic of the aircraft anymore.

 

And cant use the Hold Altitude AP.

Because the stick needs to be in the phisical center for entering AP REF.

And with the new FFB trim effect, the stick moves.

[vadupleix]

Question to the FFB lovers

 

With the last update did you lost the FFB for the buffeting?

Cant feel the aerodinamic of the aircraft anymore.

 

And cant use the Hold Altitude AP.

Because the stick needs to be in the phisical center for entering AP REF.

And with the new FFB trim effect, the stick moves.

 

No buffeting for me as well, now dogfight becomes harder

 

Edit: I take that back, after moving the FFB shacking slides to 100% I can feel the buffeting in high AoA again, someone pointed out that the transonic buffeting is gone though I haven’t tried for myself.

 

The problem now is that even with FFB force at 100% it’s still very weak as if there’s barely any centering force in low speed dogfight

Edited March 27, 2019 by vadupleix

[Sadist_Cain]

Still got the buffeting here just not nearly as strong.

 

Noticed the recent update has a lot softer roll axis, it's difficult to feel the differences in airspeed because the change in pressure is so very slight even turned up to 100.

Edited March 28, 2019 by Sadist_Cain
wrong things

[fat creason]

I’m planning on turning up the base spring strength for FFB in both axes plus increasing buffet strength. I test with everything at 100% on a MS FFB2 just FYI. I’ll look into the AP not engaging due to stock not being centered and other things like electrical/hydraulic power and control surface and linkage damage.

[Cox]

Problem FFb2

 

Hello everyone, I have a biiiiiig problem with the Force Feedback since the last patch, I am a user of MsFFB2, I explain:

-The force pushes my hand to the right side when i center my joystick,

as if the plane was really badly trimmed ! (but it's not)

I have try->starting "in flight","on the ground" ,same problem,with the Mig-21, it works wonderfully ,...

I can't fly my BEAUTIFUL CAT anymore in this condition ,and ... ...

damn damn,damn,i love it ,...

If anyone has a good solution for me, I will be eternally grateful ! :thumbup:

Sry for my basic english !

[Eldur]

Try that Swap Axes option in the FF menu where you assign the axes.

[fat creason]

Hello everyone, I have a biiiiiig problem with the Force Feedback since the last patch, I am a user of MsFFB2, I explain:

-The force pushes my hand to the right side when i center my joystick,

as if the plane was really badly trimmed ! (but it's not)

I have try->starting "in flight","on the ground" ,same problem,with the Mig-21, it works wonderfully ,...

I can't fly my BEAUTIFUL CAT anymore in this condition ,and ... ...

damn damn,damn,i love it ,...

If anyone has a good solution for me, I will be eternally grateful ! :thumbup:

Sry for my basic english !

 

Yes, try swapping axes as Eldur suggested. I have this same issue sometimes, DCS is weird about randomly swapping the axes. A good way to test is by holding down the pitch trim, if the roll axis moves you know you have to swap.

[fat creason]

After further study it appears that the artificial feel system in this flight control system is rather primitive, simply a spring/cam, damper, and bob weights. That's how the FFB model will work. The trim system actuates a screwjack attached to the spring/cam system to move the stick as trim actuator moves.

Edited March 28, 2019 by fat creason

[Sadist_Cain]

interesting stuff here on the F-14 stick assembly. I like the idea of the damper that'll stop me breaking the aircraft with over stressing :D

 

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=J-8cAgAAQBAJ&pg=SA1-PA99&lpg=SA1-PA99&dq=f-14+tomcat+stick+artificial+feel&source=bl&ots=7XQ8UEjXaL&sig=ACfU3U3SrzOAe4WHB3_gKcNxzrhFWlawKw&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjY9dKkgaThAhUBRBUIHbuDAxAQ6AEwBnoECAcQAQ#v=onepage&q=f-14%20tomcat%20stick%20artificial%20feel&f=false

 

 

Edited March 28, 2019 by Sadist_Cain

[No.401_Wolverine]

Yeah, beta update on the March 27, 2019 seemed to really drop the centering force and there doesn't seem to be any noticeable difference whether at .4 mach or .9

 

Also seems to be not much difference in force if deflecting the stick just past center or all the way to the stop.

 

Figured out the trim swap thing (happened before with Sabre I think) but I find the 'Cat significantly less enjoyable to fly with the reduced stick centering.

 

I was getting stick movement when trimming previous to this update so not sure what the change was there.

 

Pleeeease increase stick centering forces back to where they were or close to it.

 

MSFFB2 stick here, if that's relevant info.

 

(Seems like there might be a bug in the forces update? Someone reported the forces snapping back to high levels after being in flight for a while or when they ran out of fuel. Maybe this just happens when starting already in flight. Will test more.)

 

EDIT: Yup, cold start was fine, flew great. Air start was wonky..

Edited March 28, 2019 by No.401_Wolverine

[birdstrike]

yeah it seems as if this really is only happening when spawning mid air. made a cold start yesterday, and there the centering forces felt strong!

[Sadist_Cain]

Some of the functions of the stick are interesting like the eddy current damper I mentioned before or the lateral stops where at High Q the stick is limited to a half throw in roll, could that perhaps be simulated to an extent?

Never going to stop the stick moving but a noticeable 'stop' doesn't seem far fetched.

 

Albeit basic there's some interesting features there. I'm curious when they say 'Feedback' to what extent are the referring?

 

You'll have to flutter your eyelashes at Victory and see if he'll grab your stick to let you know what feels right :joystick:

[Cox]

Thanks Eldur and Fat creason for your response,i am trying this tonight :joystick::pilotfly:

 

 

EDIT : So,i have inverted the axe in FFb setting,and... problem solved, thank you guys !!!

Edited March 28, 2019 by Cox
Problem solved

[fat creason]

Unfortunately the FFB interface ED has provided is very limiting and has no documentation. Artificial “soft” stops and the like are not possible since it’s very easy to push through the maximum force consumer FFB sticks can provide. All I can do is adjust the spring strength and the zero force position. Some new higher-end FFB devices with better sensors and motors would be nice...

Edited March 28, 2019 by fat creason

[Renko]

Really appreciate that you guys, put some work on give us some good FFB to those of us who have and use FFB sticks.

And understood the effort to figuring out how it even work, without documentation.

 

I always wonder how the actual high end Hotas miss the FBB, that provides some much to the sim. Like the FFB wheels that racing sims can enjoy now.

[MAD-MM]

Some new higher-end FFB devices with better sensors and motors would be nice...

 

 

I search for this the past 10 Years...dont think you get more lucky :cry:

 

 

So far i remember the Patent on FFB will soon run out, pretty sure more FFB Sticks will return.

 

 

 

For my part was more then happy with your first FFB Version, even it can't reproduce accurate the Tomcat Controls, it is most important in Dogfights.

 

 

 

But anyway for combat there nothing better then a FFB Stick, even a Sidewinder thats is now silly old School Technic looks like a child Toy, give you allways a overall response of the Flight Regime without watching your instrument Panel.

 

 

The best + Point it did not have centering Spring Force...

 

 

I invested so mutch time in the Warthog, with polshing the internall Gimbal search for way to improve smoothness, it was a rude awaking every time i have to use him. now he sitting again back under the Tabel where he belongs, and i kick him sometimes with my Feeds

[fat creason]

I use a VKB MCG as my primary stick mainly because of the extra buttons it provides and the gimbal is decent. Would definitely use a FFB stick if a nicer one came out.

[MAD-MM]

The Point with not enough Buttons is pretty Valid in the Tomcat...

But there is allways a Solution...killing a new CH Stick for example..

 

 

My new Project for Tomcat, Frankenstein Sidewinder

 

 

[Foxmike]

Ok, this is how my ms sw ffb2 looks. I put in some more resistors and the force is strong enough this way, I actually have to reduce settings to 70-80 % for realistic feedback. Buttons are enough, I used my old serial port TM F22.

My Warthog stick is only used as sidestick flying F-16.

There's no better way to fly the different modules in DCS, esp. Huey an WW2 warbirds than with FFB, only the Hornet is a candidate for the Warthog stick anymore.

Edited March 28, 2019 by Foxmike

[Sadist_Cain]

I use a VKB MCG as my primary stick mainly because of the extra buttons it provides and the gimbal is decent. Would definitely use a FFB stick if a nicer one came out.

 

 

With folk like you guys making the f-14 and developing the ffb for it it certainly doesn't hurt the chance.

 

With all the sticks flying around, the availability of ffb wheels and the patents expiring it's about time someone took a leap to develop an ffb stick base

[Cox]

I allow myself to give you my opinion ,(my ffb problem is solved,thanks to you again) !

I was able to try the new ffb effect,and ...sorry ,but I preferred BY FAR the old version of ffb ,sometimes simplicity has good ,thanks anyway for the job guys ! I know you do for the best !

[ViFF]

Unfortunately the FFB interface ED has provided is very limiting and has no documentation. Artificial “soft” stops and the like are not possible since it’s very easy to push through the maximum force consumer FFB sticks can provide. All I can do is adjust the spring strength and the zero force position. Some new higher-end FFB devices with better sensors and motors would be nice...

 

Hey Fat,

 

Have you checked the implementation of the FFB on the F-5E Tiger II ?

 

Belsimtek implemented the Aileron Spring Stops at approximately 60% of throw on each side of the roll axis. When reaching these stops you encounter the feeling of reaching a detent of sorts and you need to apply a greater lateral physical force with your hand/wrist to go past the Spring Stops and hold the stick in place. Essentially they succeeded to model different forces on the same half axis.

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=171154

 

Thanks for pointing me to this thread for feedback regarding FFB. Love what you've done so far and looking forward to what you're still planning to add.

 

Cheers!