New A-10 model..

[Yeniceri]

when you install a-10 mod by modman, the mod also puts a file in your /ME folder named "meinit.a10.changes.txt"..

at that file there is a guideline to edit the meinit.xml manually in the cases you described..We as simmod STILL working on finding a way to modify meinit instead of changing it but failed to come up with a acceptable solution YET..Meinit is a big problem...

 

About the a-10 glitches...

There are off parts and sections compared to the RL A-10. But the cost of fixing them is not worth the trouble it couses. And we stated that in readme..

Believe us.. every error you find on the model, we find them before you..

There was a simple calculation. "will it worth the trouble fixing it?".

We decided that it wont then moved on..This is the best we are willing to do for A-10. This mod was like a school for us. We learned many many things along the way. There is a thread (not public) in beta section called "A-10 Debrief". There, we are still discussing what we should avoid and what we missed at the making of A-10. At next mod we will avoid these mistakes and raise the bar higher..

SIM-MOD's A-10 is the most detailed and accurate A-10 in a simulation ever build yet..If you guys are not satisfied with it, your only choice is play with a more primitive one..

I can understand the criticism and welcome it.

I have no any kind of ill feelings about anyone who criticize it or pointing out the mistakes.. I'm just having a hard time understand the way of thinking thats all..Imagine a friend of yours cant cook. He or she eats garbage fast foods and stuff. You go and shop, make a delicious meal, set the table and serve the meal. And he says "thanx but it could be better than this" what would you think??? He might be right if you look at solid facts. Wouldnt you want to grab his head and drown him on the freakn soup??

 

Anyway.. I will not write about this subject again..

Forget the time spend for that mod, forget the sim-mod or the crew or anything similar. Try the hog.. You didnt like it? Uninstall it..

Thats what i do for the mods i dont like or find not worthy to keep on my HD. But i never, ever did criticize a mod until today, not even slightly, not even verbal!

 

Cheers

SIM-MOD

141st Yeniceri

[Deadman]

Ok man you asked for it.

It dioesnot matter what criticism is to you what does it really mean

Criticism

 

1.the act of passing judgment as to the merits of anything.

2.the act of passing severe judgment; censure; faultfinding. 3.

the act or art of analyzing and evaluating or judging the quality of a literary or artistic work, musical performance, art exhibit, dramatic production, etc.

4.a critical comment, article, or essay; critique.

5.any of various methods of studying texts or documents for the purpose of dating or reconstructing them, evaluating their authenticity, analyzing their content or style, etc.: historical criticism; literary criticism.

6.investigation of the text, origin, etc., of literary documents, esp. Biblical ones: textual criticism

 

 

We will go wit number three to save time . Who Are you to Judge any of Sim-mods work don't you need technical expertise to be a judge of something like this?

 

If there were a tool to do the mod to the Meint file replacing entrice instead of the hole file don't you think we would have tried to use it?

give us a little credit I seam to remember a problem i helped you solve with out passing judgment on you why do you now get to pass judgment on us?

 

 

 

Guys, it is not about not having respect for the work SIM MOD team has done. Respect has nothing to do with criticism. Criticism (IMHO) is good for reality check and improving things in general. Actually many times not being critic is a lack of respect.

 

For me those Ailerons are minor things... really but, for the creators of this model it should have been like a scratch on a diamond.

 

The big problem for me is the meinit.xml which is not edited by the installer but replaced with one from another install of (basically) another user. Now I have for example my Su-25T selection of skins disabled but I have 10 or more skins (names in the drop down list) that I don't have installed. And what happens when I try to install the next mod or maybe the next ED patch that will overwrite the Meinit.xml from this one?

 

Now, when adding the fact that the SIM MOD team says "we will not go back to it" you get a simple unsolvable problem. Which is called obstacle usually :D .

 

Now, please don't jump on me as I just want to raise some problems in a rational manner and try to justify why they should be addressed.

[littlejohn1959]

this mod was FREE . the modders dont owe anything to anyone .

the guys gave up their time freely , to create it . if it is causeing alot of problems for certian individuals , you have the option to un-install it and go back to the a-10 that was there to begin with .

i have lots of mods install here . some conflict with eachother .

its my choice what mod i will install . i know i cant have em all .

it is next to impossible to install every mod that is out there .

alot will conflict . its a known fact .

sometimes , we cant have our cakes , and eat them too .

even though we would like to .

if i was a modder , stuff like this would kind of turn me off from freely giving my time ,trying to enhance this game .

until someone comes up with a better a-10 , ill cheerish this one , and feel GREATFULL that someone gave up their free time , to put it here for ME , to play with .

perfection , is in the eye of the beholder .

to me , this mod is PERFECT .

:joystick::pilotfly::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

way to go , sim-mod .

cheers .

[Luse]

I agree with little john,

 

If you dont like they way the ailerons look,

 

G Back and make your own model, These guys have spent so much of THEIR FREE time working on this model for us, and all you can do is find problems with it.

 

Look at the good things with it, They totally out weigh the bad things..

 

IMO Its the best thing since sliced bread

 

Good work Sim-Mod Team.

[zaelu]

Yeniceri, I had read the documents that came with the new A-10. But one is to read them and one is to agree with them. And I am referring only at the part "we will not return to the A-10"... which for me is like a perplexing religious declaration. Why? What's wrong with spending some more free time to polish your own work? Not for my or other one sake... but for the sake of making it shine more. Why this self imposed "masochistic" perfectionism from the first try?

 

I truly hope you (the SIM MOD team) will change this because I see it more beneficially to projects to let them open to later modification and improvement.

 

And to respond to your comparison with the food, Yeniceri. Let's say you are invited to a friend for dinner and you are served with a food you haven't eaten before but, you observe that the food, although great and excellent served (and wetted with good drinks) has a bit too much salt. Now... you have too options:

 

1. Tell the host your little observation

 

or

 

2. Don't tell the host and let it pass.

 

Telling could be taken as an affront (maybe not directly) and not telling could be bad also in the long term, excess salt is bad for health... tomorrow he will cook for the King etc, etc.

 

Now you decide... I tell him... wth... he's my friend... how would you feel if your friend would take you by the head and push your face in the soup? :no_sad:

 

Which brings me to Deadman's post. Maybe I am not... "the best friend" but I consider my self a well intentioned forum friend. Does it matter who I am? Does it matter what my credentials are? From your definitions you quote doesn't immediately result that I have to bring my diplomas before I make a criticism.

 

I could not tell apart a pixel from a texel and still I could say two things about the new A-10 mod:

 

1. The meinit.xml file is replaced instead of modified which disables any mod that SIM MOD team couldn't make compatible with and reduces future compatibility with other mods and generally brings problems.

2. The ailerons don't work as in the real plane

 

Now lets assume I am an idiot and a moron... hey... a spoiled child too if you like...

 

Does those two points go away? :rolleyes:

 

And finally... my "criticism" was not a mean one... "Hey... wth you did to my xml/ailerons? I want them fixed asap god dammit! And a beer... a cold one..."

 

So you ask... where do you find a tool for meinit.xml editing? Well... how about the guy that make the "triple ejection rack" in the first place?

 

Take a look:

 

 

and also on the F15 installer/uninstaller:

 

 

 

 

So please don't be offended by my points. I feel an internal obligation to post them. Don't throw the soup at me... maybe if we add a bit of water? :D:D

[theGozr]

Very very hard to make them understand something i gived up on that.. you'll get bashed..

;) But they do a good job it just need to get some TLC..

[SuperKungFu]

we know how to add simple lines into the meinit, HOWEVER, when it came to the A-10, there was A LOT of lines to add. And it was just wayy too much for a scripted line, that is why we are still finding an easier way.

 

The problem is, if you go back and change something in the model, it might destroy the unwrap. So basically it causes a ripple effect and screws up the skin, damage model, animations...etc. that is one of the main reason why we can't go back. Please try to understand this concept, because unless you are in Yeniceri's shoes, this is asking for a lot. Especially for a free mod.

[zaelu]

SuperKungFu, I know how much you guys struggle at first with the unwrap so it would be insane for someone to ask you to go back to that stage for those ailerons. I was just enumerating them because they are somehow a visible minus in the model (for a good observer or for a A-10 pilot :D ) and I was thinking that if a way to solve it much simpler would be found the only obstacle you would have would be the self imposed rule not to get back on her.

 

Lets say you change the animation and switch the place of arguments controlling those and you have a distortion in the texture of the air-brakes... would it be a lesser or a bigger bad? Of course... if Yenicery sometime in the future when he has time gives it a try... is not a rush.

 

As for the .xml thing. I am glad you still search for a better solution. If I find something myself I let you know.

[littlejohn1959]

until another TEAM gets together and gives freely of just about a years worth of THEIR FREE TIME ,i am gonna hold on to this bird ,and fly it with pride , knowing that at least there is still a few people left in this world who will give FREELY , to benefit others .

 

 

in closing my discussion on this thread ,,,,,,

 

to the sim-mod team .

you guys are to be commended for this FREE MOD .

there are ALOT of us , that do apprecitate ,,,YOUR hard word , and YOUR free time,,,, that went into making this mod .

i doubt if i personally need to tell you guys to rise above some of the stuff mentioned here in this thread .

as a team , you guys can handle alot of bull%^%%% , i am pretty sure .

you guys are great .

keep up the fantastic work .

maybe you should consider a FEE, the next mod you guys make .

then , people '' MAY '' have a right , to complian .

just a suggestion .

hats off guys .

keep cool .

keep modding .

cheers , big time .

[192nd_Erdem]

zaelu,

 

You may think it's just a "minor" thing to do, but as they said even changing that "minor" thing may mean major reworking of the complete model, which is kind of unnecessary regarding that they also have other things to work on.

 

I think it's best to take it as "as it is", and if you can't live with it; simply uninstall and wait for detailed DCS module. I know, I hate those "OMG IT'S FREE111" arguments whenever a critic rise up, but a little empathy does it for me for this one.

 

Also, my congrats to the dev team for their work.

 

Cok iyi iş cıkarmışsın Yeniceri, tebrikler :)

[Cosmonaut]

Are we still here :music_whistling: .

 

The reason they said that there wouldn't be any updates for this Model was most likely to stop the very thing that is happening in this thread... And that is, people flying in external view while holding up pictures to their screen comparing the image in hand with the simod A10. Time is a factor in any project and I have paid money for FS9 addons that don't even come close to what Yeniceri and team have produced for us.

 

Also some of the comments here aren't criticisms at all they are flat out complaints that their pet part of the A10 is missing a rivet or two .. I mean come on if you ask if something is going to be changed and you are given a reasonable reply, then to go any further is just complaining and only aiding in putting off other members from starting similar projects.

 

I hope those that think of themselves as "critics on behalf of the community" don't see this post as stifling debate that is only meant to make the sim better for all of us becasue that's not it at all what I'm trying to do is give some people in this thread a reality check that they are in danger of ruining the A10 party we're trying to have here. :D :sorcerer::drunk::cheer3nc::prop::clown_2::yay: :holiday:

[DrCrow]

zaelu,

 

You may think it's just a "minor" thing to do, but as they said even changing that "minor" thing may mean major reworking of the complete model, which is kind of unnecessary regarding that they also have other things to work on.

 

I think it's best to take it as "as it is", and if you can't live with it; simply uninstall and wait for detailed DCS module. I know, I hate those "OMG IT'S FREE111" arguments whenever a critic rise up, but a little empathy does it for me for this one.

 

Also, my congrats to the dev team for their work.

 

Cok iyi iş cıkarmışsın Yeniceri, tebrikler :)

Good Works

Aynı Dili Konuştuğum İnsanları Görmek Burda Başka Güzel

[NotiA10]

A BIG THANK YOU TO ALL YOU GUYS AT SIM-MOD FOR CREATING THIS GREAT A10 MOD !!!

 

you have given my beloved hog an outstanding face lift. thanks heaps again. this is simply stunning. And that it received an absolutely beautiful JAWS skin is the biggest bonus for me (thank you rugg !)

 

In regards to the critics: please be reminded that this hog model is just so much better than the one we had to contend with. I have to say that i am a bit surprised about the few but nevertheless complaints.

[tflash]

Maybe this is more appropriate:

 

A BIG thank to sim-mod for this superb mod, that I really enjoy flying!

[Deadman]

You know guys in reality there has been so little criticism of the is project and so little thanks out of the 2,000 down loads. Just kind of guessing here what 2 real complaints so that 0.1 percent of a ruff estimate of 2000 downloads and,Let say to be generous ruffly 200 thank you note so about10% of downloads. Witch leaves us with 89.9% of the people that have downloaded that have not expressed their thoughts.Please do its nice to say thank you :thumbup:

[Yeniceri]

inbound sochi!!!

[BBL]

Even though, I do not fly so often in the Hog, i must say to all of you from sim mod, and especially yaniceri , the job that you guys did with the hog is magnificent, and you have my respect for that. Congrats dudes!!!

[Deadman]

LMAO Good one

[Mustang]

LOL Yeniceri :D

[Luse]

LOL thats awesome

[badaboom]

I have not flown FC for about 2yrs until this model was released,Now I can't get enough!!!!Cheers to SimMod Team, a big Thank You for bringing me back!

[Weta43]

Are you guys seriously complaining about the fact that a group who has put what must hae been hundreds of hours into this (awesome) mod for free - as a gift to you have said that they're not prepared to keep working on it anymore?

 

I can see that people might truly be trying to be helpful when they point out mistakes, but once the simmod group have said they're finished with it, it's incredibly ungrateful to try pushing them into doing more work.

 

They're fixing BUGS & when they're done with that they've done everything & more that could be expected from them in what is a gift to the community.

[BrumTx]

One simple and short comment for the people who don't like the install.

 

" Don't like it delete it and stop moaning "

 

'Just be grateful that so many people did so much work for so long free and at a cost to their families and friends for over a year ' would you have been prepared to do that for the community ?

[littlejohn1959]

i with you cozmo .

party on dude .

cheers . :thumbup:

:cheer3nc::yay::clap_2::bounce::balloon::drunk::beer:

 

:director:lets hear it for the sim -mod team .

hip ,hip hurray .

hip , hip , hurray .

[Shepski]

I forgot to mention...

 

Thank you very much to everyone who worked on bringing us this fantastic model with skins, missions, and more in such a short period of time!!!

 

Well done guys and looking forward to the next release!

 

Cheers