Please, remove unnecessary liveries from DCS builds. Put them in separate packs

[M1Combat]

3 hours ago, 5ephir0th said:

Selected options are stored on files (like graphics options stored on options.lua), updater just has to check that file a do what is set on it, thats exactly how actual module manager works. Making the default option not download adittional liveries would fix the problem before the first run

I believe I addressed all that in my post

2 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

It would be best if the official skins were locked and unalterable like other files. Deleting then can be an exploit in MP since many planes have bright metal as their default. 

I agree.  That would be significantly better.

[skywalker22]

Even if you delete (or anything else) when doing a repair of the game (not sure how its with updates) everything will be re-installed. So no point in deleting any official content.

[SharpeXB]

6 hours ago, skywalker22 said:

Even if you delete (or anything else) when doing a repair of the game (not sure how its with updates) everything will be re-installed. So no point in deleting any official content.

But you’d have to run the repair. Clearly people are able to remove the livery files. 

[Exorcet]

8 hours ago, skywalker22 said:

Even if you delete (or anything else) when doing a repair of the game (not sure how its with updates) everything will be re-installed. So no point in deleting any official content.

Yep, a livery manager is what we need. Choose what gets downloaded and remember our settings.

[RazerVon]

Still wishing for this. 60GB of liveries is insane to force onto players.

[ebabil]

all modules should come with default liveries. users should get to decide whether they install or not. also, all high res 3d models kill the SSD spaces for nothing. Users should have the choice between low res place holders and high res models

[RazerVon]

Update: This is ridiculous.

Edited September 12, 2023 by RazerVon

[Rudel_chw]

6 hours ago, RazerVon said:

This is ridiculous.

yet there are users who would like to have even more skins:

 

which users group should ED please? … 

Edited September 12, 2023 by Rudel_chw

[SharpeXB]

2 hours ago, Rudel_chw said:

yet there are users who would like to have even more skins:

Yes

Honestly the skins are the chief artwork in the game right after the aircraft themselves. Having all the aircraft look the same is exceedingly dull especially in an era like WWII. 

[Northstar98]

On 9/12/2023 at 10:17 AM, Rudel_chw said:

yet there are users who would like to have even more skins:

 

which users group should ED please? … 

 

You can actually please both simultaneously by having a livery manager that leaves things as is by default (i.e install all default liveries, that way the ones who want the most liveries don't have to touch anything), but lets users uninstall liveries if they want to.

This exact system is already present for our modules and terrains, so why is it so controversial to do the exact same thing with liveries? The DCS repair utility is already able to scan for and redownload missing liveries, so the basic functionality is something that already exists, all it would need is a way to specify which liveries it should and shouldn't download.

If it's going to be problematic for multiplayer, the liveries can be added to the integrity checker at the server host's/mission editor's discretion.

Edited September 13, 2023 by Northstar98

[RazerVon]

On 9/12/2023 at 2:17 AM, Rudel_chw said:

yet there are users who would like to have even more skins:

 

which users group should ED please? … 

 

Both, by having them uninstalled by default, but having a repository for downloading individual liveries.

[SharpeXB]

2 hours ago, RazerVon said:

Both, by having them uninstalled by default, but having a repository for downloading individual liveries.

Not a great idea because there are hundreds of them. It’s too time consuming to sort through. Like the User Files Skin section, just too much extra work. 
 

You can also get a 2TB SSD these days for $65 so this whole topic isn’t worth worrying about. 

Edited September 14, 2023 by SharpeXB

[probad]

but the whole point of picking a livery is so other people can see it

[SharpeXB]

31 minutes ago, probad said:

but the whole point of picking a livery is so other people can see it

Right. Allowing them to be randomly uninstalled by other players makes it pointless to use one yourself. And in the case of camouflage it materially affects the gameplay. 

[The Oligopolist]

You can save a lot of space by compressing your DCS installation folder.

You can use CompactGUI:

https://github.com/IridiumIO/CompactGUI

The Xpress4k compression will minimize any performance impact (which is minimal anyway) and as you can see will cut down on the install footprint considerably.

Just be aware that updates etc will expand the install size of files they replace so make sure you leave some space available on your drive.

Edited September 14, 2023 by The Oligopolist

[Northstar98]

14 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

Not a great idea because there are hundreds of them. It’s too time consuming to sort through. Like the User Files Skin section, just too much extra work.

This is nonsense - hundreds of files is a non-issue. The DCS repair utility already sorts through nearly 90,000 files in over 10,000 folders and is able to compare them against those in EDs servers without issue. The basic functionality of getting all available default liveries and finding which have been installed/not installed is already catered for in its entirety - the only thing missing is a way of specifying which get downloaded.

14 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

You can also get a 2TB SSD these days for $65 so this whole topic isn’t worth worrying about.

Exactly what about that is reasonable? Why should people have to spend money to store date that they: A.) Don't want B.) Don't need and C.) Can be deleted without consequence (especially in SP).

14 hours ago, probad said:

but the whole point of picking a livery is so other people can see it

In single player, I'm pretty confident the AI doesn't mind.

13 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

Allowing them to be randomly uninstalled by other players makes it pointless to use one yourself.

How, exactly?

13 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

And in the case of camouflage it materially affects the gameplay.

Only in multiplayer - where a solution to this problem has already been developed.

Edited September 14, 2023 by Northstar98

[SharpeXB]

7 minutes ago, Northstar98 said:

Why should people have to spend money to store date that they: A.) Don't want B.) Don't need and C.) Can be deleted without consequence (especially in SP).

Because we’re talking about $1.30 in hard drive space. I have to imagine this is a non-issue for anyone that can otherwise afford a gaming PC or to even buy the game. How are we on page 3 over $1 of hard drive space? Unless this is a necro thread from 2012…

Edited September 14, 2023 by SharpeXB

[Northstar98]

8 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

Because we’re talking about $1.30 in hard drive space.

That doesn't answer the question... The point remains exactly the same - besides, I know you like to do this one a lot, but nobody can add $1.30 of hard drive space (let alone so they can store data they don't need or want, that can be deleted without consequence), you have to buy a new drive, so that you can, again, store data you don't need or want to store.

Why should anybody buy a new drive so they can store data they don't need, don't want and that can be deleted with little to no consequence?

8 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

or to even buy the game.

The game is free Sharpe...

Edited September 14, 2023 by Northstar98

[SharpeXB]

17 minutes ago, Northstar98 said:

That doesn't answer the question...

Sure it does. This is a three page discussion about the cheapest component of a PC these days.

18 minutes ago, Northstar98 said:

The game is free Sharpe...

I think you can figure we are taking about the modules here.

[Northstar98]

On 9/14/2023 at 4:02 PM, SharpeXB said:

Sure it does. This is a three page discussion about the cheapest component of a PC these days.

Sorry, no it doesn't.

Why should I have to store data I don't need and don't want, that can be deleted with little to no consequence?

Saying "storage is cheap" doesn't answer that question. Do you download random stuff you don't want or need, that can be deleted without consequence, because storage is cheap? If your answer is no, then why should anyone else?

And the discussion would end up shorter if people would realise that actually, the system being asked for has already been developed and the work to facilitate it has already mostly been done.

On 9/14/2023 at 4:02 PM, SharpeXB said:

I think you can figure we are taking about the modules here.

Then... Say that?

Edited September 27, 2023 by Northstar98

[SharpeXB]

1 minute ago, Northstar98 said:

Saying "storage is cheap" doesn't answer that question.

Yes it does, the low cost of this greatly lessens the relevance of the whole topic. There are more important things for ED to work on.

5 minutes ago, Northstar98 said:

Then... Say that?

I think only you were confused by that terminology. 

[Northstar98]

1 hour ago, SharpeXB said:

Yes it does, the low cost of this greatly lessens the relevance of the whole topic.

It doesn't even logically follow - so no it doesn't.

Storage space isn't even the only concern here either... Because even if I have loads of free storage (I do), why should I store unnecessary data, that can be deleted without consequence?

My hunch (owing how hard you're peddling this narrative) is that you can't actually answer that question, or even worse, agree that storing unnecessary data, is exactly that - unnecessary. It wouldn't be the first time you've argued against something despite agreeing with it.

So I'll ask it again: why should anyone store data that is not necessary for them to store? If you don't answer this question, I'm going to go with my hunch.

1 hour ago, SharpeXB said:

There are more important things for ED to work on.

Ahh, the classic Sharpe line, it's funny how seemingly everything in this wishlist section always has something else more important, even when it's something you agree with.

But maybe this time is different, so maybe you'd like to give a crack at naming one (just the one) important feature that would be delayed or wouldn't happen if ED were to consider this request, for which the majority of the work has already been done and that already exists for modules and terrains?

Edited September 14, 2023 by Northstar98

[SkateZilla]

60GB is nothing compared to other platforms of similar category and visual fidelity.

 

[SharpeXB]

1 hour ago, Northstar98 said:

why should I store unnecessary data, that can be deleted without consequence?

Well there can be consequences. I won’t speculate about cheating but the ability of players to manipulate skins can be a way to cheat. I’ll just leave it at that. It would be better if the game had official liveries included in the IC. User made ones obviously wouldn’t be included. This doesn’t apply to SP but still an issue with adding that feature. 

27 minutes ago, SkateZilla said:

60GB is nothing compared to other platforms of similar category and visual fidelity.

Yeah the average game today is over 100GB. DCS actually seems small considering to all its content. Of course this is feasible today because hard dive space is cheap. 

[Northstar98]

2 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

Well there can be consequences. I won’t speculate about cheating but the ability of players to manipulate skins can be a way to cheat. I’ll just leave it at that. It would be better if the game had official liveries included in the IC.

I'm all in favor of having official liveries be included into the IC, at the discretion of mission editors. That way if mission editors/sever hosts want to mandate these liveries (or at least certain liveries) be installed in an unmodified state to be able to join, they can. No problem there.