resolved Collective actuator always in ALT Mode?

[comcat]

HI

I have the suspicion that since the update that introduced the ALT hold mode, the Collective actuator is constantly fighting to keep the alt, even ALT hold mode was NEVER engaged.

anybody else seeing this?

I watch the controls indicators and the green line on the collective is always way off...even if i re center, it goes off again to hold altidude.

so if i pull the nose up to fly NOE/ contour, the SAS drops the collective... is that correct?

collective SAS .trk

[Tholozor]

I've noticed it as well, it also seems to go well beyond the command authority range for the servo.

[Raptor9]

I've made a point of these two behaviors (exceeding it's authority as well as it's behavior without ALT hold on) as well. It seems to try to maintain the VSI position when ALT hold isn't on.

[comcat]

It's almost not flyable close to the ground now because of this.... I feel like I am not in control anymore and since i have to reset the SAS so much it messes with all axes.

 

 

[comcat]

any word on this?

[comcat]

@Raptor9@BIGNEWY@NineLine

Hello ED.

I really try to be patient here, but all I am asking for is a little "we are working on this." or "you are out to lunch, this is is how it is, deal with it."

I know what I am talking about and the issue is soooo annoying, for a module that was hyped so hi. I am crashing into trees because SAS is having control over the Collective.

It's broken.

please, please please. at least say we are all on summer vacay or we are not doing anything about it.

 

appreciated.

 

Edited August 1, 2022 by comcat

[daemon1808]

Ah, I though I was crazy.... But no, I have notice it too. From sometime I have found that the SAS is trying to "correct" me every second, and takes its own decidions. That not happened  some time ago.

I want to rise because there is a montain ahead... Nope, skynet.... I mean SAS, decides that flying directly to it is correct and tries to nullify my inputs (i can see my collective bar up and the green SAS bar waaaaay down)

I want to sink because there is a sudden SAM threat in the RWR... Nope, Synet... I mean SAS... Decides that to continue at the same altitud is the best strategy.

So, I have to continually press trim foward to nullify SAS inputs. I am not sure, but I don't think that this behaviour is same IRL (and if it is, this helicopter is trying to kill you or what?)

This, combined with the other thread about ALT hold not working (I swear that I can't maintain altitude out of ground effect, despise the people that says that it is working and only is not shown in the HIADSS) makes me think that there is some kind of issue regarding everything that have to do with altitude.

Please ED, check this

Edited August 5, 2022 by daemon1808

[kaffepanna]

This sure makes it difficult. SAS picks a altitude at random and then tries to maintain it. Also found that after a while the actual altitude hold wont engage any more.

[NeedzWD40]

As the altitude hold doesn't work well right now, my go-to interim fix has been to kill the collective SCAS channel before every flight. You'll get an FMC caution when doing so, but no longer be fighting the system over the collective.

[comcat]

On 8/6/2022 at 2:13 PM, NeedzWD40 said:

As the altitude hold doesn't work well right now, my go-to interim fix has been to kill the collective SCAS channel before every flight. You'll get an FMC caution when doing so, but no longer be fighting the system over the collective.

I like that idea a lot, didn't really know there is a way to kill the collective channel...please share how you switch it off.....!!

 

thank you

 

 

 

[admiki]

21 minutes ago, comcat said:

I like that idea a lot, didn't really know there is a way to kill the collective channel...please share how you switch it off.....!!

 

thank you

 

 

 

A/C->util->turn COLL channel off

[Floyd1212]

This will defeat all Trim functionality altogether, yes?  Once one of the channels is offline, you can't really continue to make use of the others, unless there is another step to clear the warnings and allow it to resume with what it has remaining?

[Tholozor]

8 minutes ago, Floyd1212 said:

This will defeat all Trim functionality altogether, yes?  Once one of the channels is offline, you can't really continue to make use of the others, unless there is another step to clear the warnings and allow it to resume with what it has remaining?

Negative, trim is still functional. The only thing disabled is the SCAS collective servo, cyclic and pedals trim as normal.

[admiki]

Hold modes work too (obviously, alt hold mode is ineffective since servo is turned off).

[comcat]

19 hours ago, admiki said:

A/C->util->turn COLL channel off

Thank you much, this saved the apache for me....

[normanleto]

Thanks, I was sure that some ghost update today inflicted a sudden drop in apache handling. Your A/C option put things back. Except COLL, please do not turn the last channel on (NOE), it makes flying somehow nasty.

[bradmick]

NOE approach mode automatic schedules the stabilator to 25 degrees training edge down when the true airspeed goes below 80 knots, it’s to improve visibility over the nose when operating NOE. That being said, manually scheduling the stabilator is the primary way of accomplishing the same thing. The manual mode is preferred because it gives more control over the movement of the stabilator. 

[Dallas88B]

On 8/19/2022 at 6:24 AM, admiki said:

A/C->util->turn COLL channel off

Really! Thank you for posting that

[comcat]

not fixed in last update, just added the actuator saturation warning tone to it, so it beeps now even if the COLL actuator is off.... well.

[Floyd1212]

Awesome. Looking forward to that.

[kaffepanna]

1 hour ago, comcat said:

not fixed in last update, just added the actuator saturation warning tone to it, so it beeps now even if the COLL actuator is off.... well.

Yes, I also just realized that. Even if you turn off the FMC COLL that saturation warning still sounds as if its on. (also checked that no other channel were saturated). Guess I have to shelve the apache for another month  

[Yeager51]

per the title, when lifting the collective I'm not getting predictable lift.  The indicator just bumbles around, and as I apply more collective the load does not increase predictably but bounces around.  When I apply increasing collective the ship just tips over and that's that.  The only thing that has changed from yesterday is the application of the update from today, 24.08.2022

[Tholozor]

There's a collective issue with the SCAS servo: 

Current workaround is to disable it from the FLT -> UTIL page and disable the COLL option under FMC. That will give you direct collective control.

[inexus]

10 hours ago, kaffepanna said:

Yes, I also just realized that. Even if you turn off the FMC COLL that saturation warning still sounds as if its on. (also checked that no other channel were saturated). Guess I have to shelve the apache for another month  

I wonder if it's time to try the Hind. I hear some people refer to it as 'abandon ware' but it will allow us to join the cold war server  

[Schlomo1933]

Somewhere in the Background is still "a altitude hold mode" on.

Even when no Altitude Hold is selected.

You can clearly see it in the Control Window ( Alt + Enter). If you are doining some change in the Collective, the SAS starts to fight you and tries to hold some random Altitude. It also ignores the 10 % Authority limit. 

(As allready mentioned) the only thing what is helping as a work around, is to switch OFF the "COLL" FCS. But the saturation warning will still played.    

Edited August 25, 2022 by Schlomo1933