AN/AAQ-33 Advanced Targeting Pod Discussion

[YoYo]

It was supposed to be state-of-the-art, but it turns out to be the least useful because the image is so blurry (basic mode). This falls far short not only of Lightning but also of what it should be (videos and photos above). Without SP, you can search endlessly for a target, whether it's a vehicle, let alone a single soldier. It won't be useful until this is improved.

[Furiz]

Nice to see Manual updated same time the pod released, good job

[Hempstead]

I am not seeing the document updated. It's still "DCS: F-16 Early Access Guide" dated Dec. 29, 2024 on the DCS web site. Can't seem to find the updated doc with sniper pod.

[Furiz]

27 minutes ago, Hempstead said:

I am not seeing the document updated. It's still "DCS: F-16 Early Access Guide" dated Dec. 29, 2024 on the DCS web site. Can't seem to find the updated doc with sniper pod.

You can find it in your DCS folder - DCS World\Mods\aircraft\F-16C\Doc

Edited Wednesday at 07:02 PM by Furiz

[Hempstead]

32 minutes ago, Furiz said:

You can find it in your DCS folder - DCS World\Mods\aircraft\F-16C\Doc

Ah...  I see it. Thanks!

 

So, it's www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/Downloads need to have the file updated.

[NineLine]

4 hours ago, YoYo said:

It was supposed to be state-of-the-art, but it turns out to be the least useful because the image is so blurry (basic mode). This falls far short not only of Lightning but also of what it should be (videos and photos above). Without SP, you can search endlessly for a target, whether it's a vehicle, let alone a single soldier. It won't be useful until this is improved.

You get the best picture you need to be in TV NARO XR mode. In this screenshot you are not. 

[TobiasA]

vor 4 Stunden schrieb YoYo:

It was supposed to be state-of-the-art, but it turns out to be the least useful because the image is so blurry (basic mode). This falls far short not only of Lightning but also of what it should be (videos and photos above). Without SP, you can search endlessly for a target, whether it's a vehicle, let alone a single soldier. It won't be useful until this is improved.

Double-tap EXP on your stick to go into XR.

[RyanR]

The ATP is not as easy as the previous pod. 

Was our Litening pod simply unrealistically good in terms of optics/laser/etc? I kinda thought so. Perhaps reality is just more difficult?

-Ryan

Edited Wednesday at 10:33 PM by RyanR

[Mateo]

I think it was just an example picture. When you slew even in XR the blurry pic again make it difficult to find the new targets. 

[Moxica]

 

 

[DSplayer]

The LITENING TGP we have right now has unrealistically good lossless digital zoom which it should not have. The ATP implementation, however, does have the digital zoom limitations. Otherwise, I feel like the ATP is pretty easy to use, but the HOTAS commands are not the exact same as the LITENING's and I would suggest reading the manual chapter on the ATP to become fully acquainted with the system and how it works.

[Avenger31]

Yeah, I totally agree with the statement that Lightning is much superior to the new Sniper pod, I compared it and even with XR I can't have a clear and close image like with Lightning Narrow/9x. I think it needs more refinement and that in the future it will be what it claims to be state of the art

[jojojung]

vor 44 Minuten schrieb Avenger31:

Yeah, I totally agree with the statement that Lightning is much superior to the new Sniper pod, I compared it and even with XR I can't have a clear and close image like with Lightning Narrow/9x. I think it needs more refinement and that in the future it will be what it claims to be state of the art

Yeah I tested the both pod too. And the Litening is far superior then the Sniper ATP. Thats unrealistic of course but thats how it is at the moment. Especially when slewing the pod the Litning has always the super sharp and clear view even with most digital zoom. 
Dont get me wrong: I like the implementation of the sniper very much, the reality isnt that easy and I like how it is modeled - as real as it gets! But Im afraid that nobody will take the Sniper ATP as long as the Litning is that unrealisticly modeled and that far superior. The Litning Pod needs to be refined in my opinon!

[Ivandrov]

I don't get it, there was a bunch of talk about how the LITENING has had unrealistically clear overall image but especially the digital zoom for years. The new ATP implements the digital zoom realistically, and people are upset that it isn't as good as the LITENING?

Edited yesterday at 12:43 AM by Ivandrov

[jojojung]

vor 1 Minute schrieb Ivandrov:

I don't get it, there was a bunch of talk about how the LITENING has had unrealistically clear overall image but especially the digital zoom for years. The new ATP implements the digital zoom realistically, and people are upset that it isn't as good as the LITENING?

Exactly not Most guys are absolutely happy with the implementation of the Sniper ATP. But in contrast to this realistic implementation it becomes more and more clear to a lot more players that the Litning pod is not modeled well. Thats all, I think! 

[Ivandrov]

2 hours ago, jojojung said:

Exactly not Most guys are absolutely happy with the implementation of the Sniper ATP. But in contrast to this realistic implementation it becomes more and more clear to a lot more players that the Litning pod is not modeled well. Thats all, I think! 

Some people are, as seen above.

 

Anyway, I took it for a spin. Was able to identify vehicle types well before getting into Maverick range using the TV Narrow XR mode. So, as far as in-game utility goes, seems fine to me. Will be taking it instead of the LITENING if I'm flying the -16 from now on.

Edited yesterday at 03:13 AM by Ivandrov

[fisadev]

[this was merged here from another thread]

Litening pod in max zoom (TV, MAN RNG knob all the way and expand active):

Sniper pod in max zoom (TV, MAN RNG knob all the way, and TVXR active):

The ATP is known for having way more definition than previous generations of pods, so this doesn't make much sense. Am I missing something? One thing I noticed is that in TVXR, the MAN RNG knob doesn't change the zoom, it's always at 1.0X. Maybe that's the reason and it should be able to go to 4.0X like in the other modes?

The same happens in IR, with an even greater difference in favor of the Litening.

Thanks in advance for the help!

Edited yesterday at 04:49 AM by fisadev

[Ivandrov]

The LITENING has always not suffered from any image degradation from the digital zoom in-game.

 

In reality, the 9x digital zoom would allow you to count the pixels almost on your hands. It's incredibly bad.

 

I believe ED still plans to downgrade the LITENING on the -16 to the LANTIRN and this visual fidelity will disappear.

Edited yesterday at 03:45 AM by Ivandrov

[fisadev]

  Ivandrov:  I can imagine that's the case, but that doesn't explain why the Sniper would have less zoom than the Litening, it should still be the other way around.

[Ivandrov]

4 minutes ago, fisadev said:

  Ivandrov:  I can imagine that's the case, but that doesn't explain why the Sniper would have less zoom than the Litening, it should still be the other way around.

It's just software zoom. The Sniper is more powerful as far as Analog optics, and it's XR mode.

 

The digital zoom is just a number that's programmed into the pod and/or aircraft software with some max ceiling. If you really want to compare them properly, it would be with the LITENING at the same 1x level in its narrow mode.

Edited yesterday at 03:50 AM by Ivandrov

[fisadev]

Again, that doesn't mean the Litening would have greater zoom. The Sniper can have digital zoom too (in fact, the XR mode is a digital zoom).

Both have optical and digital zoom, and the Sniper is a newer pod with more powerful optics, so the most logical thing would be for it to have greater zoom overall (for instance, same level of digital amplification over a greater optical zoom, would yield a greater final zoom).

[Ivandrov]

3 minutes ago, fisadev said:

Again, that doesn't mean the Litening would have greater zoom. The Sniper can have digital zoom too (in fact, the XR mode is a digital zoom).

Both have optical and digital zoom, and the Sniper is a newer pod with more powerful optics, so the most logical thing would be for it to have greater zoom overall (for instance, same level of digital amplification over a greater optical zoom, would yield a greater final zoom).

XR mode is not just digital zoom. It is also an image processing technique as evidenced by the unique way it interacts with slewing of the pod and time it takes for the clearer picture to come in.

 

Again, the level of digital zoom available is completely up to whoever programs the software in the pod or aircraft. It has nothing to do with the capabilities of the pods themselves.

 

IRL, the 4x-9x range in the LITENING would be mostly useless as the pixelation would be terrible.

Even the 4x in the Sniper also seems pretty useless from the one screenshot I have seen of it.

Edited yesterday at 03:56 AM by Ivandrov

[fisadev]

As I already told you: being a newer pod with better optics, it would be expected that the Sniper would have greater zoom. There would be no reason to reduce the digital zoom capabilities to a point where it has less overall zoom than previous generations of pods. If older generations of pods could get that level of digital zoom, newer generations will obviously use at least that much digital zoom, if not more, coupled with the better optics.

 

[Ivandrov]

1 minute ago, fisadev said:

As I already told you: being a newer pod with better optics, it would be expected that the Sniper would have greater zoom. There would be no reason to reduce the digital zoom capabilities to a point where it has less overall zoom than previous generations of pods. If older generations of pods could get that level of digital zoom, newer generations will obviously use at least that much digital zoom, if not more, coupled with the better optics.

 

If you have something other than "logic" to describe how the Sniper should be operating than feel free to share. Otherwise, it's working as expected.

[fisadev]

Quote

it's working as expected

You have absolutely no evidence to sustain that. It can absolutely be a bug.

Edited yesterday at 04:04 AM by fisadev