reported Offset aimpoint logic after latest update (DCS 2.8.1.34437)

[desertowl]

Hello all,

Can someone explain the logic of the new offset aimpoint system?

1. The triangle marks are for some reason gone

2. when setting OA1, OA2 drifts to a random location (at least I couldn't find any logic to it)

It will be most welcome if someone can elaborate on the issue.

Best,

Mk

[WHOGX5]

I can confirm that OA's have been completely broken in the latest patch. The triangle marks aren't gone, but they're really, really far off of where they should be. I tried to make an OA 10,000ft above a steerpoint at 50 feets distance and it was a multiple of 10 nm off and looked like it was even below the ground.

PS: Regarding my last sentence, that's just what it looked like to me. I can't say whether it was off in altitude or distance because it was in a mission and I didn't have time to investigate it. All I can say definitively is that I should have seen it above my steerpoint since it's just offset in altitude, but I saw it below the steerpoint instead from my perspective.

Edited December 19, 2022 by WHOGX5

[BIGNEWY]

if you are reporting an issue please include a short as possible track replay example showing an issue. 

thanks

[Ramses823]

I don't know how to upload a track but I can say Offset Aim points are broken now they aren't working at all...

[Moonshine]

indeed they are broken. tried to set up symbology for a pop-up attack using VRP, PUP and the OAs for visual references.

the altitude of the OAs always seems to reset. even before i typed anything in the OA1 page, there was already some values there for no reason at all (did not slew any radar, tgp etc. nor did i cycle the sighting options at all) plus the altitude reset. watch for yourself.

repeatedly typing in the desired altitude did not achieve anything, instead it reset either to 0 or to negative values for whatever reason. unuseable

@BIGNEWYcan this be moved in the bug reports section?

 Offset-Aimpoint-location_bug.trk

Edited January 4, 2023 by Moonshine

[_SteelFalcon_]

On 1/4/2023 at 4:57 PM, Moonshine said:

indeed they are broken. tried to set up symbology for a pop-up attack using VRP, PUP and the OAs for visual references.

the altitude of the OAs always seems to reset. even before i typed anything in the OA1 page, there was already some values there for no reason at all (did not slew any radar, tgp etc. nor did i cycle the sighting options at all) plus the altitude reset. watch for yourself.

repeatedly typing in the desired altitude did not achieve anything, instead it reset either to 0 or to negative values for whatever reason. unuseable

@BIGNEWYcan this be moved in the bug reports section?

  Offset-Aimpoint-location_bug.trk 2.19 MB · 1 download

 

i'm seeing the same weird stuff...

[Moonshine]

and here is my attempt trying to set OA1 and OA2 with the TGP. (as described here by wags: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnqFHMok-hA)

upon designating OA2, the position of OA1 gets lost and overwritten by OA2 or vice versa.. (in the end OA1 and OA2 end up being at the same location) also note that none of those triangles indicating the OA location ever show up in this method in the current OB build (unlike in wags video).

 

 

after trying that, i end up manually entering OA1 and OA2 as you would for a pre-planned pop-up attack (or as you would load in via Data Cartridge).

triangles show up, yet OA1, despite having set an altitude of 3800ft, seems to be below ground.

the TGP however seems to look a what i presume the correct OA1 position in the air somewhere. however, despite the sighting option being set to OA1 (left MFD OSB 10), the SPI (which is now OA1), the target box is still on the waypoint and not on OA1 location. also something wrong there. 

watch towards the end of my track, you can see me trying to find the OA1 location. as i cant find it anywhere i re-enter all its data again and discover the triangle somewhere below ground

 

all of this worked perfectly fine prior to the last minute christmas update.

Offset-Aimpoint-location_bug2.trk

Edited January 6, 2023 by Moonshine

[GrEaSeLiTeNiN]

Latest Open Beta as of 8 Feb 2023.
Can't get triangles to show in HUD with the TGP method as was demonstrated in Wags video here. OA1 is always in the wrong place. Trk included. What am I missing? Similar problem reported here I think but not sure why it was closed? Thks

DCS F16 OAP TGP BUG 8Feb2023 Latest OB.trk

[BIGNEWY]

30 minutes ago, GrEaSeLiTeNiN said:

not sure why it was closed?

we close reported issues as all information we require for the report has been added to our internal report. The endless bumps on issues can get in the way of seeing new issues like yours if we do not lock the threads. 

Regarding your track I will take a look soon to check if it is the same issue or not, thank you

[BIGNEWY]

Confirmed this is reported already and a fix will be in a future patch 

thanks

posts merged

[Burner1111]

Lads, could someone confirm, is the OA1 and OA2 working, as I cannot mark those correctly?

I'm creating TGP targets, marking one with TGP, second with OA1 and third OA2. Going back to TGP, all seems ok but switching OA1, it's fully lost and not marked and moves as SP. Only OA2 gets marked. And HUD does not show it correclty at first, after second marking.

Am I doing something wrong here (maybe something changed?) or it's broken, again!? It has worked well before.

And, why OA1 or OA2 sometimes jumps nowhere to the TGP target and I have to "find" those targets/points with difficulty? Like it goes to SP mode and wont go back to near TGP or WP, even when cancelling TGP down or trying to CZ (that does not show)?

Test file attached.

Burner

F16 OA1 broken.trk

Edited February 15, 2023 by Burner1111

[Moonshine]

Yes its broken again

 

Edited February 16, 2023 by Moonshine

[BIGNEWY]

Posts merged

[RogueRunner]

Seems you cannot use waypoints higher than 25 to create OAP's Is that a feature?

 

My thinking is to create an OAP for something I cannot see but I know it's brg/distance from something I can see. The quickest way would be via a markpoint

[RogueRunner]

lemme go try with OA2, thx

[RogueRunner]

40 minutes ago, Moonshine said:

yes you can. go to List -> DEST -> Dobber Right once to get to STPT 1-699. select desired Steerpoint with either the rocker switch or by typing it in on the ICP. once you have the desired steerpoint selected, dobber right to get to OA1, right again to get to OA2. works all the way down to 699

doesn't work, OA1 or OA2 you can cycle only to wpt 25, not higher. Also cannot enter something higher than 25 via the ICP

[Viciam1]

My oap dont stay, how you do it? 

Select stpt like 3 as example. Point track target...press oap1. Press tms up on next target...press oap 2 then find target and tms up again...then go back to target. 

Dont work fam

[Moonshine]

14 minutes ago, RogueRunner said:

doesn't work, OA1 or OA2 you can cycle only to wpt 25, not higher. Also cannot enter something higher than 25 via the ICP

yeah youre right, 25 is the highest you can go for OA. 

[Viciam1]

for oap to work...does Tgt have to stay at the actuat stpt and then you create 2 oaps around that? Or can you sort of set 3 targets...like tgt at tank 1...oap1 at tank 2 and and oap2 and tank 3?

 

or is it tgt should look at where ever stpt coordonates are like centre of runway and then oap1 and oap2 look at tank or truck?

[Moonshine]

there are multiple use cases for OAs

you can get launch and steering information to OA1 and OA2 by pressing Left MFD OSB 10 (or right, depends on which MFD you have the sensor on) on either the tgp or the FCR when in AG master mode. so yes you could designate 3 different targets like that

Edited April 8, 2023 by Moonshine

[Moonshine]

also, dont waste your time on it, in the current OB its broken (again). location of OA doesnt save. @BIGNEWY can this be moved to bug-reports?

goes alongside this bug, which is already reported:

did it according to Wags video and this currently is not working (watch towards the end where he designates OAs with the TGP): 

 

Track:

OA_does_not_save_position.trk

Edited April 8, 2023 by Moonshine

[Viciam1]

Ok thats stupid

[AvroLanc]

2 hours ago, Moonshine said:

also, dont waste your time on it, in the current OB its broken (again). location of OA doesnt save. @BIGNEWY can this be moved to bug-reports?

goes alongside this bug, which is already reported:

did it according to Wags video and this currently is not working (watch towards the end where he designates OAs with the TGP): 

 

Track:

OA_does_not_save_position.trk 421.73 kB · 1 download

 

This is NOT how OA’s are supposed to work.  Wags’s video was wrong and does not represent how OA’s are supposed to be used. 

I’m not sure exactly how offset aimpoints currently function in the OB, but this method for designating 2 additional targets is not a use case. 

[Moonshine]

I know youd use them for pop up attacks primarily to get visual references in how to fly the pop up, even that is bugged, see my referenced post.

As i said, there might be multiple use-cases. whether its the „correct“ way of using them like in wags video i beg to differ and wouldnt use it like that myself. However for some reason he made a video showing this exact method in which case ED might have info about this type of use

and if its clearly wrong, then that video would be better removed since it causes confusion 

either way its not working as it should since even for a pre planned pop up attack, the OA1 triangle is not at the correct height.

Edited April 8, 2023 by Moonshine

[AvroLanc]

47 minutes ago, Moonshine said:

I know youd use them for pop up attacks primarily to get visual references in how to fly the pop up, even that is bugged, see my referenced post.

As i said, there might be multiple use-cases. whether its the „correct“ way of using them like in wags video i beg to differ and wouldnt use it like that myself. However for some reason he made a video showing this exact method in which case ED might have info about this type of use

and if its clearly wrong, then that video would be better removed since it causes confusion 

either way its not working as it should since even for a pre planned pop up attack, the OA1 triangle is not at the correct height.

 

OK, so the problem is that at the time of the Wags' video, Offset Aimpoints were incorrectly implemented i.e. their function was completely NOT accurate to how they're supposed to work. They've been improved since then, but again, I'm not sure how they are currently. I might go check now.

Using the the OA triangle in the HUD as a pull down reference for Pop-Up attacks is a valid useful trick, but clearly is not the reason for their existence. 

Agreed on removing the Video.

The answer to the OPs question is to manually create a custom steerpoint in the 1-25 range and then use the VIP function.