waiting for resolution RAZBAM Situation Post Archive (will be deleted)

[Braunn]

There's no returning Razbam here. More than one programmer have left Razbam to work for other studios. 

The hush hush about all this is the confirmation. ED wants to drag it out and sell as many modules as they can. But they know Razbam has left the building for good. 

[NineLine]

5 hours ago, freehand said:

That is a side of ED I have never come across or thought existed very blunt indeed.

Having spent a little time learning Russian (very little) it reads and translates very blunt, try not to read too much into it. No one on the Russian side knows more than anyone else. The only official comments should come from the heads of ED and RAZBAM, otherwise, it's simply opinions and beliefs. We need to continue to wait for the heads of both companies to work it out and we will proceed in the very best interest of our customers no matter what that looks like. Thanks. 

[upyr1]

6 hours ago, speed-of-heat said:

We don't know.  

However, we do know that after the Hawk by VEAO, that there were changes made to the contract to "mitigate" a developer leaving ... speculation of controls includes putting the "code" (which in other contracts i have seen also includes documentation and source etc... ) into escrow, so that in theory ED could pick up the development, in the event that a developer  "leaves"  someone else could pick up the code... 

That requires a big lift to pick up something that complex, and is likely to be resource heavy to get up to speed, etc... so it's not like putting a lego block onto a pile ... 

Taking over a module would be a challenge, however losing a popular module would be devastating to DCS. I hope the mess with Razbam gets cleared up 

[NineLine]

6 hours ago, upyr1 said:

I am hoping to get the answer from ED. Right now if a developer leaves DCS, would we be SOL? Would ED take over their modules or could another developer do so? For example if Razbam dropped could Heatblur potentially take over the Strike Eagle? 

It's impossible to answer right now, as I said above no matter what the end result is we will do whatever we can to make the post-drama the best it can be. Our united goal right now is to get back to as normal as possible life as it was before this. DCS needs the F-15E, it has it now, the best-case scenario is to get back to normal business with it.

[upyr1]

16 minutes ago, NineLine said:

Having spent a little time learning Russian (very little) it reads and translates very blunt, try not to read too much into it. No one on the Russian side knows more than anyone else. The only official comments should come from the heads of ED and RAZBAM, otherwise, it's simply opinions and beliefs. We need to continue to wait for the heads of both companies to work it out and we will proceed in the very best interest of our customers no matter what that looks like. Thanks. 

I'm not reading too much into it. I have studied Russian a bit as well, and I got the impression the person posting simply doesn't have an answer . I'm also not reading too much into anything from Razbam that isn't a flat-out yes or no. Developers come and go all the time. Anyway This question really isn't about the specifics of the Razbam/ED disputes as much as it is about ED's general policies if a developer leaves and Razbam simply got me thinking about it. 

11 minutes ago, NineLine said:

It's impossible to answer right now, as I said above no matter what the end result is we will do whatever we can to make the post-drama the best it can be. Our united goal right now is to get back to as normal as possible life as it was before this. DCS needs the F-15E, it has it now, the best-case scenario is to get back to normal business with it.

I hope the situation can be resolved soon. I don't know how big DCS is for Razbam but I don't think it is a small slice of their pie. So it would hurt everyone involved 

Edited May 30, 2024 by upyr1

[Pipe]

10 minutes ago, upyr1 said:

Taking over a module would be a challenge, however losing a popular module would be devastating to DCS. I hope the mess with Razbam gets cleared up 

Four modules will be gone and they are all popular, devastating? I doubt it, people will get over it just like the Hawk. 
I think ED is counting on this! The people that won’t let it go, will just have posts deleted and or ban hammer

 

[eFirehawk]

23 minutes ago, NineLine said:

It's impossible to answer right now, as I said above no matter what the end result is we will do whatever we can to make the post-drama the best it can be. Our united goal right now is to get back to as normal as possible life as it was before this. DCS needs the F-15E, it has it now, the best-case scenario is to get back to normal business with it.

Would you be able to confirm if at the very least there is communication between ED and RB? There's some concerning claims from key RB people that there's radio silence from ED. Could you guys at least put these claims to rest? Thanks

[Ignition]

8 hours ago, Gizmo03 said:

Sure… they had the F-15E already for another civ. Sim and it took them only 12 years to „port“ it to DCS. Sounds pretty easy to „switch“ the games with their modules… 

 

Copy paste doesn't work. Quality transfer also doesn't apply.

[scommander2]

On 5/29/2024 at 5:47 PM, Majinbot said:

An f-15e completed by Heatblur, specialized in two-seaters, a dream...

Wish it was the case so that this topics could be ended at the some points...   

[NineLine]

6 hours ago, eFirehawk said:

Would you be able to confirm if at the very least there is communication between ED and RB? There's some concerning claims from key RB people that there's radio silence from ED. Could you guys at least put these claims to rest? Thanks

I'm sorry you guys are being put through this, I truly am. This is my personal note on this. 

The only way this can be solved is through communication between both groups. I know ED management is committed to resolving this but I do not know the finer details about how that is going, how often everyone is talking, etc. 

I know that probably isn't enough to ease any concerns, and I know there is a lot of noise out there, but it's best to just stick to official announcements on the situation and not get caught up in the other stuff. 

[giullep]

We can ask a refund? I bought the f-15E on ED site… i can ask a refund to ED?

[stonewall197922]

5 минут назад, giullep сказал:

We can ask a refund? I bought the f-15E on ED site… i can ask a refund to ED?

According to license agreement no. But best to contact with support. 

[nessuno0505]

Given DCS times to do things, I bet this topic will become the longest of the whole forum.

[giullep]

1 ora fa, stonewall197922 ha scritto:

According to license agreement no. But best to contact with support. 

Ed support, correct?

[stonewall197922]

4 минуты назад, giullep сказал:

Ed support, correct?

Yes, RB support will not help you with that.

 

Edited May 31, 2024 by stonewall197922

[Gizmo03]

vor 8 Stunden schrieb Ignition:

Copy paste doesn't work. Quality transfer also doesn't apply.

I see, you got my point.

[BigBorner]

10 hours ago, Braunn said:

There's no returning Razbam here. More than one programmer have left Razbam to work for other studios. 

The hush hush about all this is the confirmation. ED wants to drag it out and sell as many modules as they can. But they know Razbam has left the building for good. 

The developers that „left“ weren’t razbam employees that put in their notice. Their freelancers. Dude is already posting JHMCS 3D Modells again. 
 

[Romandv]

18 часов назад, nessuno0505 сказал:

RB once said ED does not have their core files. But even if they had access to the files, ED already has a long queue of half-finished modules, it's unrealistic they can take the burden of m2k, av-8b, mig-19 and f-15e. Maybe they could pass them to another 3rd party (a completely new one since all the existing already have their work), but I don't believe this is possible; it's more likely RB keeps its projects and port them to another simulator, even a civil one.

 

Hmm, that doesn't sound very optimistic. The last hope was that ED would do the job himself instead of razbam, and users would finally be spared the headache of having to deal with such a third party developer.

In any case, it won't be worse for them - their reputation in DCS is already low and it's not even about a specific case, but in general, so they have nothing to lose - the world of MSFS is open to them, as there you can sell any unfinished rubbish in huge quantities.

 

Edited May 31, 2024 by Romandv

[Shot]

The "unfinished rubbish" for me still is still offering a lot for an EA module which received only 1 real update:

• A/A radar which loses less locks than any other module I'm flying
• A/G radar which looks way better than anything else I own
• GBU, CBU's, Dumb Bombs, AGM and JDAMs are functioning (there are a few bugs, but working around those you can use all ammunitions)
• Plenty of systems are already included, the ones which are missing are supposed to come later so I won't bash them for not having them in right now

So instead of bashing about ED or RB, I continue to fly the F15E.  If ED breaks the plane with an upcoming release beyond useability I'd assume that my view of things will change.  So far I've stopped pre-ordering anything and if the F15E should become unflyable I'd expect some kind of refund or compensation.  But again another personal opinion, everyone can decide where the threshold is of what is acceptable for a hobby/sim or not.

[Flia]

I'm definitely done with Razbam. I will never buy anything from them again for any simulator. I'm not going to support developers like them. I certainly don't blame ED for what happened. DCS is still a great simulator even without Razbam.

[JumpinK]

The silence about all this from ED and RB is what concerns me the most.

I spent quite some money on all RB products while waiting for more than 10 years for the Mudhen only to be left in the dark for months with speculations about what is going to happen with all of my RB modules.

From a customer perspective this is not acceptable

ED/RB does no good by staying silent for that long and I think it's not gonna be helpful for either party in the future...

The longer the silence continues the more customers gonna loose trust in both of them, I believe...

This is just my opinion.

(I just grounded the F-4E for the F-15E, because who knows how long it will be usable until it gets broken by some update and I want to at least get the maximum out of what I paid for.)

Praying for ED/RB before every flight now...

Edited May 31, 2024 by JumpinK

[Braunn]

4 hours ago, BigBorner said:

The developers that „left“ weren’t razbam employees that put in their notice. Their freelancers. Dude is already posting JHMCS 3D Modells again. 
 

Is Galinette posting JHMCS 3D models? For who and where? 

[BigBorner]

4 minutes ago, Braunn said:

Is Galinette posting JHMCS 3D models? For who and where? 

Who said galinette? Metal2Mesh, on several discords like the razbam one. 

[JuiceIsLoose]

6 hours ago, NineLine said:

I'm sorry you guys are being put through this, I truly am. This is my personal note on this. 

The only way this can be solved is through communication between both groups. I know ED management is committed to resolving this but I do not know the finer details about how that is going, how often everyone is talking, etc. 

I know that probably isn't enough to ease any concerns, and I know there is a lot of noise out there, but it's best to just stick to official announcements on the situation and not get caught up in the other stuff. 

Does ED management know there is a large number of people looking for an update on this situation? We have no way to communicate that to ED management. We can only voice this through forums and discord, which unfortunately you all as the CMs have to bear. People are passionate about DCS and their RB modules, I think everyone at ED can appreciate that passion. But when the only response we get is that management is committed to a resolution, it leaves people wondering if ED management is actually talking with RB. I don’t expect the CMs to give an update on the situation (I would expect ED management to provide that update), but frankly where else can people go to voice their concern other than the forums or discord and hope that these concerns get brought to ED management. 

[VpR81]

3 hours ago, Flia said:

DCS is still a great simulator even without Razbam.

But only half as good w/o the Strike Eagle...