DCS 2.9.6 Delay

[Pipe]

Any chance we could get a hotfix for the F-15E radar? While we’re waiting for the update

[Hammer1-1]

1 hour ago, Pipe said:

Any chance we could get a hotfix for the F-15E radar? While we’re waiting for the update

Ive already pitched that idea, doubtful they heard me from behind all the crying and complaining.

[giullep]

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/it/files/3339338/
 

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/it/files/3339292/

 

watch here at the moment

[Dangerzone]

On 7/8/2024 at 3:35 PM, vvm13 said:

As I understand it, the point of the Open Beta was to separate those who can tolerate a certain amount of bugs from those who cannot. If the idea fails, then this again has to do with communication. It was necessary to write in big red letters near each date that this was only an assumption and the likelihood of a change was obvious. And write next to each Beta in big red letters that there must be bugs and this is not for gentle souls.

Actually, the idea of Open Beta as I understand it - is to give users an Open Beta version for testing - not to have access to features earlier if you're happy with the bugs. Yes - some may use it for game play, but that wasn't the intended purpose. 

I too would love to see Open Beta and a Release version, as I would love to be able to test out the new features with my current missions and scripts, and have time to work on (or give feedback of bugs) prior to it actually going to the live main missions and servers - you know, use open beta for actual beta testing like I used to...

But ... ED tried that, and it failed. More people used Open Beta, not for testing but actual game play. Then more server owners switch to Open Beta for their main servers because more people wanted features sooner. Then more players went to Open Beta servers because that's where most of the players are. Then ED had to recommend a 'beta' version for new players to use for multiplayer because there were too fewer serves on Stable release in comparison. Then players got upset that there were bugs in the Open Beta version because it was their 'main' install for playing even though it was labelled Beta. There are plenty of complaints on this forum about people upset with the bugs in Open Beta because it was effectively the main version.  Then for the few of us remaining on stable for primary gaming and using open beta for testing (as designed)... well, the actual release cycles got further delayed out sometimes to 3 or 4 months to a point where we were either left way behind, or compelled to switch to Open beta. It was a deadly spiral that was only getting worse with each passing month. 

So, while I would love to see Open Beta returned as Open Beta  and see it treated as a true "Beta" test version, I know it's not practical because it won't be treated as a "Beta" test version.  Even the replies here seem to indicate that people want it because they want the features sooner, not because they're willing to do actual beta testing, or provide proper bug reports. (With tracks, etc). 

So, I think ED have made the best choice under the current circumstances, where beta users are vetted to those who actually will use it for "Beta" testing purposes - so we don't run into the same issues we had again previously. Yes - this sucks for me as well, because I too, am outside of that closed beta circle - and though I would really love to do some scripting on the new features soon to be released both to have scripts ready on release day, and beta test missions to know that they're going to work with the new changes on the day of release (the real reason for a beta version), if it's between having what we had a year ago , vs what we have now - I'll take what we have now. 

Edited July 10, 2024 by Dangerzone

[MAXsenna]

@Dangerzone I agree. You should apply for the closed beta. I preferred the OB to get new features early, and I believe one of the reasons it "failed" was because Stable didn't get patched for months in the end.
In any case, the system is utterly flawed, and it shows. Things gets broken all the time, and campaign makers have to scramble to make fixes, which then for some reason can't be pushed weekly. A campaign/mission file can't possibly interfere with the rest of the Sim. Some campaign creators even makes single fixed missions available due to frustration, and all you have to do is copy it to the right folder. So I can't possibly imagine why this is so hard to achieve regarding other fixes in the core. But what do I know. It's been said before, the whole thing needs a rewrite... While I'm still lovin' it!
Keep it up! I'm also astonished regarding the patience @BIGNEWY and @NineLine have. I don't!

Sent from my SM-A536B using Tapatalk

[LeCuvier]

27 minutes ago, MAXsenna said:

...In any case, the system is utterly flawed, and it shows.

I'm not sure we have enough insight to make that statement, but yes, it looks like the software would need a clean-up effort, with no feature additions during that time.

As to Open Beta, I'm one of those who used Open Beta only, with the Stable version only in backup. But I agree, it cannot work for the reasons mentioned above. For a beta test version you need a population of disciplined users who follow the defined process for reporting issues/bugs, examine issues thoroughly and document them clearly.

[BIGNEWY]

39 minutes ago, MAXsenna said:

In any case, the system is utterly flawed, and it shows

It shows the process and the tasks are complex, and if we need to take time to fix an issue we will do. 

4 minutes ago, LeCuvier said:

I'm not sure we have enough insight to make that statement, but yes, it looks like the software would need a clean-up effort, with no feature additions during that time.

As to Open Beta, I'm one of those who used Open Beta only, with the Stable version only in backup. But I agree, it cannot work for the reasons mentioned above. For a beta test version you need a population of disciplined users who follow the defined process for reporting issues/bugs, examine issues thoroughly and document them clearly.

Beta was being used as a release version by the public, of course everyone wants the new content quicker, regardless of it being stable or open beta the result would have been the same in this case, a delay. 

As soon as we have a new date for the patch we will let everyone know. 

thank you 

[MAXsenna]

39 minutes ago, BIGNEWY said:

It shows the process and the tasks are complex, and if we need to take time to fix an issue we will do.

Yes, yes, I know that l. Apologies, I probably came off a lot harsher than I intended. Love and passion brings frustration as we all know!

I do enjoy DCS immensely, I almost have time for it every day. And I'm positive that's the intention and goal for all of you guys in Eagle Dynamics. Keep at it! Announce Central Europe, 'Nam and Korea, and you won't be able to do anything else than being active here in the forum.

[silverdevil]

11 hours ago, MAXsenna said:

Lunaediesophobia

LMAO Max

[Dangerzone]

2 hours ago, MAXsenna said:

@Dangerzone I agree. You should apply for the closed beta.  

Thanks. I appreciate the vote of confidence, but there is no way to apply. It’s by invitation only, and I believe they have more than they need anyway at the moment. 

[BIGNEWY]

1 hour ago, MAXsenna said:

Yes, yes, I know that l. Apologies, I probably came off a lot harsher than I intended. Love and passion brings frustration as we all know!

I do enjoy DCS immensely, I almost have time for it every day. And I'm positive that's the intention and goal for all of you guys in Eagle Dynamics. Keep at it! Announce Central Europe, 'Nam and Korea, and you won't be able to do anything else than being active here in the forum.

Dont worry at all, and thank you for giving feedback, we appreciate it. 

I hope we do get Nam one day

1 minute ago, Dangerzone said:

Thanks. I appreciate the vote of confidence, but there is no way to apply. It’s by invitation only, and I believe they have more than they need anyway at the moment. 

We usually pick from community members who are helpful here on the forum or discord, or have particular skill sets in DCS, I started as a volunteer in 2013 just by helping people on the forum.  

[virgo47]

2 hours ago, MAXsenna said:

In any case, the system is utterly flawed, and it shows. Things gets broken all the time, and campaign makers have to scramble to make fixes, which then for some reason can't be pushed weekly. A campaign/mission file can't possibly interfere with the rest of the Sim. Some campaign creators even makes single fixed missions available due to frustration, and all you have to do is copy it to the right folder.

Yes, it should be possible to fix campaigns without sharing the fate with some big update. Campaigns and missions are totally downstream components so they should not break anything. As a user, I'd not mind going through the update process (which for many of us is to disable all the mods first and then reenable them again) for a few missions - or opting not to if there is no campaign of my interest.

[=Mac=]

I used Open Beta exclusively. But, I KNEW it was a Beta. I knew it would have bugs. I reported a couple frustrating ones in the past. But I flew public missions with the understanding that things would (often) be FUBAR. Occasionally, things would get hilarious like aircraft bouncing hundreds of meters in the air, sometimes to disappear completely. Sonic booms would bring chuckles when someone rubber-banded.

As frustrating as "wait" is, I value a good, solid release more. Get it right, ED; I'll wait. There's nothing out there like the miracles that you have given us.

[gonvise]

@BIGNEWY, Is there any chance the patch will come out this week or are we talking about a delay of several weeks? Have you considered dividing it into parts, for example, just Afghanistan?

[BIGNEWY]

15 minutes ago, gonvise said:

@BIGNEWY, Is there any chance the patch will come out this week or are we talking about a delay of several weeks? Have you considered dividing it into parts, for example, just Afghanistan?

We are still working on some stoppers and they will need testing, at the moment I do not have a new date to share sorry. 

Splitting into parts would just make this patch more complicated and more time consuming. This is an unusual patch as it is a very busy one so we just have to make sure we get it right. 

thank you 

[Slippa]

I appreciate the transparency, as well as that things are laid out here on the forum.

Bug fixes and updates I’m happy to wait for. I’d rather whatever’s released works as it should, if there are bugs that turn up to be squished by all means squish em.

So long as the communication’s here and clear I’m all good. It’d be nice to be crashing me Hook today but I’d rather wait and crash it myself than have it now and let it crash itself, along with a CTD or something.

For now I can busy myself chasing tankers or trimming trees with props. Busy, busy 

[freehand]

I'm easy ... like Sunday morning.

[Slippa]

18 minutes ago, freehand said:

I'm easy ... like Sunday morning.

Ooh, that’s why I’m easy 

[Ala12Rv-Tundra]

3 hours ago, virgo47 said:

Yes, it should be possible to fix campaigns without sharing the fate with some big update. Campaigns and missions are totally downstream components so they should not break anything. As a user, I'd not mind going through the update process (which for many of us is to disable all the mods first and then reenable them again) for a few missions - or opting not to if there is no campaign of my interest.

I don´t think campaigns break anything, more like DCS core evolves and campaigns(which are payware, remember) must work perfectly.

[MAXsenna]

I don´t think campaigns break anything, more like DCS core evolves and campaigns(which are payware, remember) must work perfectly.

Not what we meant. We have been told campaign updates can't be pushed outside the patch cycle, even if they don't interfere with the core game at all. That's one major thing, in my personal opinion, ED should look into changing in the future.

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[RazorD]

i am sure there are people who are looking to use the sale in conjunction with this update ( fc 2024). Are you going to extend the sale?

[MAXsenna]

i am sure there are people who are looking to use the sale in conjunction with this update ( fc 2024). Are you going to extend the sale?

Good idea!

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[Mikey74]

 

[Andrew8604]

6 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

I hope we do get Nam one day

I see how Afghanistan is split up.  (I pre-ordered that!)  I'm thinking "if" that works out well, a Vietnam Map should maybe be split up similarly.  Helo's and CAS work are mainly central and south, while the "lead sleds" are mainly up north, coming from Thailand and Yankee Station.

[Raven434th]

7 hours ago, RazorD said:

i am sure there are people who are looking to use the sale in conjunction with this update ( fc 2024). Are you going to extend the sale?

not to mention those that still haven't received their refunds yet for the F15e...its been over 2 weeks...

Edited July 10, 2024 by Raven434th