Multiple Jets

[Pyroflash]

Okay, things are getting really exciting around here that is for sure!

 

However, with so many aircraft being released, I am wondering what will happen if two (or more) third party devs decide to release the same aircraft. Or if they try and compete with ED (as if that was even possible).

 

A mission designer makes a mission with aircraft x, however since there are three different versions of the same aircraft in DCS:W, how are we going to distinguish them from one another in the aircraft slots when designing a mission. We can't call them F-16C-A, F-16C-B, and F-16C-C can we?

 

Let me elaborate on what I mean, because obviously a mission designer isn't going to put three different versions of the same aircraft in the mission.

 

A person has F-16C-A, and wants to play online. The mission designer has made a mission with F-16C-B in it, but it is displayed as F-16C in the slots list. How will the game handle people trying to connect and load into slots with the wrong version of an aircraft. Will the game come up with an error text and a link to purchase the correct one? Will the player be allowed to load in anyways with his different aircraft? Will the player simply load in to a blank space with no aircraft, go back out, and buy the F-16C-C module, and still not be able to play?

 

This is becoming an increasingly real issue that needs to be fleshed out before problems occur.

Edited June 1, 2012 by Pyroflash

[falcon_120]

I think you're going to fast,I don't think ED will give permission for the same aircraft,at least not the same version.Too hypothetical to talk about something that hasn't even happened.

[Pyroflash]

I disagree, before it is likely to happen is the best time to ensure that it doesn't happen. Two months ago, I would have agreed with you completely, but right now things are changing, and it is important to prepare the proper contingencies for potential failure points.

[Nate--IRL--]

Let me elaborate on what I mean, because obviously a mission designer isn't going to put three different versions of the same aircraft in the mission.

.

 

Why not? It is simply copy and paste. The player will choose which module on mission start, if he owns more than one. Otherwise it'll default to the one he owns. If you want to excluded a particular module (eg a slight sim version), don't place it in the mission.

 

Nate

[Daze]

There should be categories and 3rd party developers need to make sure their plane fits into at least one. Eg. DCS Fidelity, Flaming Cliffs Fidelity (you pay for the aircraft to be added to FC3, you don't pay for a standalone FC fidelity aircraft) and DCS Fidelity Civilian Aircraft (that is if people want civilian aircraft). I think ED really need to keep a close eye on what they let in as I think they could ruin what DCS has going for it by introducing a whole load of inaccurately modelled super planes that will auto lock you from 20 miles and have a 2.0 thrust/weight ratio.

 

What I'm trying to say is: I don't want DCS: World to become the new FSX. I'd like it to be a real world combat simulator where you know that whatever plane you buy is of the highest fidelity and that you won't be dogfighting super planes in multiplayer.

 

I would also like to see terrain addons for new parts of the world, however, I wouldn't like to see terrain improvements for current terrain (unless as a free update as part of a patch) as I think that would soon turn into a bottomless money pit.

Edited June 1, 2012 by Daze

[Esac_mirmidon]

Absolutely agree with you Daze. Good post.

[Pyroflash]

Please try to keep the fidelity arguments out of this unless it actually relates to the topic at hand.

 

Why not? It is simply copy and paste. The player will choose which module on mission start, if he owns more than one. Otherwise it'll default to the one he owns. If you want to excluded a particular module (eg a slight sim version), don't place it in the mission.

 

Nate

 

I meant, how are different modules going to be differentiated from each other in respects to how they appear in the slot listing for a server?

 

It could get really confusing if DCS:W has three different available F-16C's, but only one works with the server. Especially if current naming conventions for slots are to be followed e.g. A-10C, Ka-50, etc.

 

Also, have a player be able to connect with any of the modules he owns might not be the best option as it might not work too well with the mission. Consider trying to follow JTAC SADL marks on an F-16C, but your version of the F-16C doesn't feature SADL capability. This could potentially break mission types such as "on station" where the requirement to be able to self identify waypoints is an absolute must.

Edited June 1, 2012 by Pyroflash

[Nate--IRL--]

Please try to keep the fidelity arguments out of this unless it actually relates to the topic at hand.

 

 

 

I meant, how are different modules going to be differentiated from each other in respects to how they appear in the slot listing for a server?

 

It could get really confusing if DCS:W has three different available F-16C's, but only one works with the server. Especially if current naming conventions for slots are to be followed e.g. A-10C, Ka-50, etc.

 

I don't see why they can't be named in the aircraft list separately, for example -

 

IRIS F-16

A2A F-16

DCS F-16

 

Nate

[Pyroflash]

This of course would be the best option available.

 

The secondary purpose of this thread is also to make people aware that there might, at some time, be an issue.

[joey45]

This is a tricky one.

 

Only ED can say

"Nope, it's already been done, pick another plane to make."

[HungaroJET]

We can't call them F-16C-A, F-16C-B, and F-16C-C can we?

 

 

Yes we can. No problemo.

[Pyroflash]

This is a tricky one.

 

Only ED can say

"Nope, it's already been done, pick another plane to make."

 

Yeah, but then there is an issue where a certain module falls into disrepair due to collapse of/lack of support from the developer.

 

Then there might be an opening for another developer to come in and take up the slack with a module of their own.

[HungaroJET]

Yeah, but then there is an issue where a certain module falls into disrepair due to collapse of/lack of support from the developer.

 

Then there might be an opening for another developer to come in and take up the slack with a module of their own.

 

Oh, come on man. Do not panic.

We have 87 (default) empty slots more which can be used for airplanes

(42 remained to me), but this number is also not strict, we can add more slots if we need ;)

[cichlidfan]

The secondary purpose of this thread is also to make people aware that there might, at some time, be an issue.

 

In business, as in Real Life, that is a given!;)

[Elnocho3]

Great post by Blaze, completely sums up my concerns regarding opening up DCS to 3rd party aircraft..

 

What I'm trying to say is: I don't want DCS: World to become the new FSX. I'd like it to be a real world combat simulator where you know that whatever plane you buy is of the highest fidelity and that you won't be dogfighting super planes in multiplayer.

 

All I'm bothered about is having a fair and accurate selection of aircraft. Fair meaning no cheating.

Edited June 3, 2012 by Elnocho3

[NRG-Vampire]

All I'm bothered about is having a fair and accurate selection of aircraft.

 

war is not fair, likewise.

or do we need only serious freeflights? :D same in FSX?

anyway, in MP choose an F-22 or T-50 PAK-FA, or J-20 :D

[Mouse]

"Fairness" is up to server hosts and mission creators.

[BHawthorne]

The more, the merrier. Let the server ruleset sort it out. My vision of what DCS would be would involve all sorts of land, air and sea vehicles. If certain vehicles don't meet the fidelity you want, limit them to AI only on the server.

Edited June 2, 2012 by BHawthorne

[Grimes]

 

A mission designer makes a mission with aircraft x, however since there are three different versions of the same aircraft in DCS:W, how are we going to distinguish them from one another in the aircraft slots when designing a mission. We can't call them F-16C-A, F-16C-B, and F-16C-C can we?

 

Will the player be allowed to load in anyways with his different aircraft? Will the player simply load in to a blank space with no aircraft, go back out, and buy the F-16C-C module, and still not be able to play?

 

Currently in DCS World if you open up a mission which utilizes an aircraft you don't have installed it will simply go directly to spectator view. If the mission is setup with multiple "client" slots you will be given a list of aircraft to spawn into. I think it will display all aircraft that are set to client, but will only allow you to spawn into a/c which you own.

 

Of course it is easy enough to go into the mission editor to change an aircraft to whichever type you have. I could fly the A-10C campaign with a P-51D if I wanted to, I probably won't be able to complete it, but it is still possible.

[neroroxxx]

Spanky just said on the IRIS simulator thread that they dropped 1 plane from their list because another developer was "already working on it" im assuming ED will stand behind 3rd party developers that they have a contract with and if say IRIS has a f-14 survey wil say A2A has a study f-14 they would both be limited to certain things like speed, fuel, weapons and so on when u battle against them.

 

I mean we got an f-22 coming but theres no AI f-22 what if we get a harrier or a ZERO sim? We would all have to have at least the AI version, im guessing the developer would provided an AI version of the plane to ED that will come as part of the world which would mean ED will decide which version to use for ai and what version has the right data so no matter if u r playing agains the study or survey sim the person flying it will be limited to what the DCSW's AI is limited to if its the same plane.

 

Im sure ED has this figured out already and we'll hear about it soon enough, now lets all go back to refreshing the e-shop's page until the combined arms "BUY IT NOW" button appears :-)

[Nate--IRL--]

Spanky just said on the IRIS simulator thread that they dropped 1 plane from their list because another developer was "already working on it"

 

Forgive me, I missed that, could you give me a link?

 

Nate

[NoJoe]

Forgive me, I missed that, could you give me a link?

 

Nate

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=89448

 

Skip ahead to the question at 6:50 (or straight to 7:24 to hear that line specifically). :)

 

--NoJoe

[john_X]

guys, i'm in a big confusion here. i am working at the entire F-16 family, including double seatters. from my point of view, it's hard to make a decision which one to release for fc3.

as i see what's the direction things are going on, i consider seriously to make my F-16 a third party project, to have some benefits from this hard work, specially for the thing that i'm a single mod developer. My problems are:

-even i'll model every version of the viper, with both of the engines, the cockpit is different for each one. so for 5 variants, for example, it'll be needed to build 5 cockpits.

what is the thing to do? maybe making a team with somebody like cockpits developer.

 

i know many of you believe ED won't give other third parties for the F-16, but i can make every other version instead of theirs, but only external shape. if you got any ideas, i'm very interested, and soon i'll start a poll about:

"are you going to buy any version of viper? does it worth it, or i just cancel all the things?

i have to mention, this one is a very detailed one, at the same level with ED's, or even better.

Edited June 3, 2012 by john_X

[NRG-Vampire]

guys, i'm in a big confusion here. i am working at the entire F-16 family, including double seatters. from my point of view, it's hard to make a decision which one to release for fc3.

 

We have 87 (default) empty slots more which can be used for airplanes

(42 remained to me), but this number is also not strict, we can add more slots if we need ;)

 

Hey John, you can release all of your F-16s.

You see HJ added - worikng on - dozens planes into DCS and as i heard he has 6-7 versions of F-16s. I hope japanese F-2 also. :thumbup:

[chromium]

I think ED really need to keep a close eye on what they let in as I think they could ruin what DCS has going for it by introducing a whole load of inaccurately modelled super planes that will auto lock you from 20 miles and have a 2.0 thrust/weight ratio.

 

I think that this is not an ED's problem, but a mission designer one.

 

Remember that even if someone will make an X-Wing for DCS world, whithout proper slot added by mission designer there won't be any X-Wing in the mission. :smilewink:. So all you have to do is check that your (or else) server won't allow X-wing, if you do not like to fly in that environment :)