Landing correctly

[morgon]

Hi again, am getting the hang of sim and thanks to replies on here and video links, 2 months on am now getting through missions using the planes functions and weapons as best I can but landing is now becoming a nightmare, so could someone reply to me with a step by step how to land correctly on final approach once at low speed, gear is down and air brakes on? I just can't bring the plane to a stop and end up running out of runway lol. I am sure there are a few things I need to be doing and help would be appreciated as normal. Just want to land the plane once a mission is completed not just exit in mid air without landing to finish mission :thumbup:

 

Ps please keep jargon low as I'm no pilot by far, I flew a stunt kite once that's the level I'm at :huh:

[MxGDiChello]

I have the same problems as well,I would like a response.

[Revelation]

At what speed are you landing? It sounds like your airspeed is to fast.

 

Try coming in at 130 knots. You should be able to land without any issues without using your airbrakes. Granted weight of aircraft, i.e. fuel remaining and ordanence not deployed will effect your landing speed. Once your wheels touch down - full airbrakes and 0 throttle. In real life you would wait until your speed is down a ways before initiating the wheel brakes. In the sim you can initiate them right away.

[morgon]

Hi thanks for reply, I am around the speed you say maybe 140knots sometimes and full air brakes with throttle off when touched down but I just keep rolling and rolling till I'm in the trees. Il be honest I may be pressing the wrong buttons for brakes I think that may be most logical reason can you confirm the braking button/procedure as it may just be me fumbling with buttons, thanks.

[Speedbrake]

Keyboard command for brakes is "W". It you quick click it it turns on the brakes which will slow the aircraft. If you hold it down the plane will stop quicker.

[morgon]

I wil try again when home and hopefully see no more trees up close, thanks for all replies again :)

[Yurgon]

These helped me a lot:

 

 

[morgon]

Great thanks, added to my ever growing a10 utube vids collection, really do like to watch and learn:thumbup:

[FreeFall]

Good thread:

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=85434

[Hamblue]

Until you get the hang of it, hit the red button (emergency jettison)on the top left of the console. It will get rid of any ordinance you have left and make the plane lighter. As noted earlier, lower the flaps and get the airspeed down to 130 or alittle lower. Use the tire marks as a target to touch down. A couple of seconds before touching hit the air brakes.

Press and hold the W key or rudder pedal wheel brakes if you have them. You should be able to taxi off half way down the runway.

[doright]

Airspeed on approach and final are critical. Use the AoA indexer (to top left of HUD) try to keep green circle and lower arrow to be lit on approach and pitch control to set your speed. Use throttle to adjust the flight path marker on the HUD. Settle the flight path maker on the end of the runway, your flare will carry you to the rubber skid marks for touch down. It takes pratice but really try to think pitch = airspeed, throttle = aim point. One isn't independent of the other but for most corrections it gets your approach settling in the right way.

Don't forget to open the airbrakes fully after touchdown. The airbrakes have limited travel airborne but on the ground then a weight on wheels switch will allow them to open all the way. Finally use the whole runway. You do it right and just a little bit of brake maybe need at the end of the runway where the armament safety crew should be waiting.

Edited July 28, 2012 by doright

[LawnDart]

It takes pratice but really try to think pitch = airspeed, throttle = aim point.

 

I've never used this technique in any jet I've flown. It works better using pitch for airspeed and power for altitude in smaller props and general aviation IMHO. In jets I just point the nose for the aiming point and adjust throttles for airspeed (otherwise you could find yourself chasing the glideslope/visual approach path... quite badly).

 

As mentioned they do go hand-in-hand, but I always start with airspeed adjustment needed = power, and altitude/aiming point adjustment = pitch.

 

It also helps greatly knowing the typical N1 setting (or N2 if preferred) you're looking for while established on final approach and fully configured. It'll vary a little depending on your weight but not significantly. Referencing your target N1 also helps - for example: If you're high, but on speed you'd pitch to correct for the glideslope and adjust throttle to a setting lower than your target N1 since you're steepening up your approach path to remain on speed. Other scenario: If you're on glidepath, but Vref +10 you'd reduce throttle to a setting lower than your target N1 and then add a little back pressure as your speed decreases to remain on glideslope. Once re-established, set power to ~N1 target and pitch for picture (aiming point).

Edited July 28, 2012 by LawnDart

[MxGDiChello]

Revelation worked with me last night, make sure your air brakes are actually working. Like test mid flight to see if they are opening and closing. Because this was my problem. I still made the landing even after turning my air brakes on about 3/4 of the run ways end. And hold Wheel brakes as soon as you touch down.

[razgriz33]

Just as a final approach technique:

IRL from my experience you dont flare all the way down which is a common mistake in flight simming, you keep a level attitude and let the aircraft sink, -slightly- pitching down if required and in our case changing pitch and throttle as if to end up crashing just before the numbers, this is to prevent a stall before we want to "embrace the earth". Then when it feels right (like instinct) take off the power, pull the nose up to glide along the runway at 10-5 feet, it's not an exact science. when your loosing lift the aircraft will want to descend, let it but pull back a little more as if you were rearing a horse just to take the edge off of the touchdown.

 

Extend the airbrakes, hold the W key and if you like a little bit of rudder input.

 

To answer your original question i think the other posters are right, didn't sound like brakes were applying but i thought i'd share my experience, everybody does things differently but

.

 

p.s. just in case anybody benifits, P51's maybe even KA50's remember BUM FFITCH when your downwind

 

Brakes - off, Undercarriage - down, Mixture - rich, Fuel -sufficient and on correct tank, Flaps - down, Instroments - like barometer etc,Temps and pressures, Carb heat - 5 second blast, Hatch+harness

 

 

To re-iterate im not saying that's how it is done, that's just how i've been taught. hope this helps somebody

Edited July 28, 2012 by razgriz33

[WildBillKelsoe]

Hello,

 

to land the hog, follow these steps (25 miles out)

 

1- when you're done with the mission, turn all weapons off.

2- look to the up front controller (under the HUD)

3- look at CDU on MFCD (the 2 screens in front of you, right and left)

4- go with number 4 first, press CDU

5- go with number 2 second, press FN then 2

6- now you have divert page on CDU

7- select Batumi

8- look at the HSI (the compass ahead of you).

9- get a 5 degree offset by turning aircraft towards sea and away from the needle. 5 degrees.

 

10- lower thrust to both engines and descent to 1000 feet. maintain 175 KIAs on final, lower gear, don't touch flaps or speedbrakes.

11- as the HSI starts moving suddenly, turn toward it so it faces the 12 o'clock position

12- smoothly lower thrust to 159 KIAs

13- descent to 500 feet

14- as you see the runway edge, and the meatballs (4 lights to the left of runway when you're landing), lower flaps one notch, and increase speed to 165. maintain 165 to edge of runway

15- deploy brakes to kill speed. at 40 feet AGL, flare and let the main wheels rub the runway. keep holding stick back. your speed should be 135-145 KIAs on touchdown.

16- press INSERT to activate nosewheel steering.

17- apply wheel brakes intermittently (like heart beats) while holding nose up.

18- the hog will land on its nose, and once 50 KIAs appears on HUD as airspeed, punch the brakes and little corrections to be centered on the RWY.

 

post a track so we can help you.

Edited July 28, 2012 by WildBillKelsoe

[BlueRidgeDx]

I don't want to be rude, but that is completely wrong. I think there have been other threads on this, so a search should turn up some useful information. If not, I'd be happy to write something comprehensive on the subject...after my visiting relatives leave tomorrow, assuming someone else doesn't do it first.

 

In a nutshell, you should fly the whole approach with 40% speedbrakes - there's no gauge, so just hold the switch for two "potatoes". Get configured early, it will make your life much easier. Full flaps and gear down as soon as you're lined up with the runway. At common weights, the approach is flown at 140kt or so. For the exact speed, simply decelerate until the green circle on the AoA Indexer lights up. Place the TVV right on the approach end of the runway, and keep it there. Ideally, you want to position the TVV and the runway 3 degrees below the horizon (put it just below half way between 0 and -5 on the pitch ladder). You should trim the airplane so that you don't have to maintain any stick pressure. Maintain that speed until you're over the runway at about 20 feet. At about 20 feet, pull the throttles back to idle, and pull back gently enough to move the TVV to far end of the runway. You should touch down about 500 feet down the runway.

 

Do not hold the airplane off, trying for a soft landing. Unlike small GA airplanes, jets should never make "full stall" landings. As soon as the main wheels are on the runway, get the speedbrakes out to 100%, and get the nosewheel down. Unless its a short runway, you shouldn't need to get on the brakes immediately. As you decelerate through 50-70 knots, get the nosewheel steering on, and use brakes as necessary to make the desired turnoff.

[Hamblue]

In the end the ops problem is probably one of 3 things.

1. Landing too fast.

2. Touching down too far down the runway.

3. Air/Wheel brakes not applied.

[159th_Viper]

I just can't bring the plane to a stop and end up running out of runway lol.

 

 

This.

vvvv

 

 

In a nutshell, you should fly the whole approach with 40% speedbrakes - there's no gauge, so just hold the switch for two "potatoes". Get configured early, it will make your life much easier. Full flaps and gear down as soon as you're lined up with the runway. At common weights, the approach is flown at 140kt or so. For the exact speed, simply decelerate until the green circle on the AoA Indexer lights up. Place the TVV right on the approach end of the runway, and keep it there. Ideally, you want to position the TVV and the runway 3 degrees below the horizon (put it just below half way between 0 and -5 on the pitch ladder). You should trim the airplane so that you don't have to maintain any stick pressure. Maintain that speed until you're over the runway at about 20 feet. At about 20 feet, pull the throttles back to idle, and pull back gently enough to move the TVV to far end of the runway. You should touch down about 500 feet down the runway.

 

Do not hold the airplane off, trying for a soft landing. Unlike small GA airplanes, jets should never make "full stall" landings. As soon as the main wheels are on the runway, get the speedbrakes out to 100%, and get the nosewheel down. Unless its a short runway, you shouldn't need to get on the brakes immediately. As you decelerate through 50-70 knots, get the nosewheel steering on, and use brakes as necessary to make the desired turnoff.

 

 

 

 

To facilitate further illustration, herewith track. At a GW of 80% (17 000kg) and maintaining a 3-degree slope on descent, your speed holds at about 130 knots all the way down. Notice how at Batumi, following Blue's instruction, I only had to tap the 'W' key about 5 or so times before turning left to the parking area.

 

Track: A-10 landing.trk

Edited July 29, 2012 by 159th_Viper

[Abbath]

Keyboard command for brakes is "W". It you quick click it it turns on the brakes which will slow the aircraft. If you hold it down the plane will stop quicker.

 

Do that in RL and the brakes will be destroyed. Full brakes is not the proper way to land the plane.

[PlainSight]

1. For every 1000 feet above ground, you must be 3 nautical miles from the runway.

2. Aim your velocity vector at the start of the runway. This is crucial.

3. Pitch the aircraft high enough for the AOA indexer to light green.

4. control the velocity vector position with throttle and AOA with pitch/trim.

5. Flare, if you're NOT flying the FA18.

 

The beauty of this method is that it works in every airplane, and with any weight, but I cannot use any less jargon.

[WildBillKelsoe]

1. For every 1000 feet above ground, you must be 3 nautical miles from the runway.

2. Aim your velocity vector at the start of the runway. This is crucial.

3. Pitch the aircraft high enough for the AOA indexer to light green.

4. control the velocity vector position with throttle and AOA with pitch/trim.

5. Flare, if you're NOT flying the FA18.

 

The beauty of this method is that it works in every airplane, and with any weight, but I cannot use any less jargon.

I second that ^

 

But the distance to the runway itself can be confusing. I mean usually, the waypoint is center runway, not the edge. How to remedy?

[159th_Viper]

But the distance to the runway itself can be confusing. I mean usually, the waypoint is center runway, not the edge. How to remedy?

 

Why are you worried about a waypoint? As said, use the VV :)

[macedk]

1. For every 1000 feet above ground, you must be 3 nautical miles from the runway.

2. Aim your velocity vector at the start of the runway. This is crucial.

3. Pitch the aircraft high enough for the AOA indexer to light green.

4. control the velocity vector position with throttle and AOA with pitch/trim.

5. Flare, if you're NOT flying the FA18.

 

The beauty of this method is that it works in every airplane, and with any weight, but I cannot use any less jargon.

You said F-18 ;) :D

[Mohamengina]

The a10 is easy mode for landing a plane. You must be doing something fundamentally wrong.

 

Try landing the su25t and you'll know what I'm talking about.

[BRooDJeRo]

Or.... you take a 'space shuttle flying brick' aproach... :wacko:

 

- Go full speed to the airport @ 10000, drop weapons with red button, line up with runway.

- Wait untill you're close the the airport and dive down to 50 feet before the runway, cut off engines, apply full airbrakes.

- The speed can be at 300 +, apply flaps 1, gear down, this is the pre-brake stage.

- At the runway pull the stick just hard enough (nose up) to get the aircraft at the point of stall. Its will loose its speed fast and push the nose down again to make it touch softly for normal landing procedures.