Do you think we will see VATSIM move in?

[drack]

Hi Folks,

 

As you can see from my 'join date' I've been following the development of 'flanker' for quite some time now.

 

This is not a fly on rails combat game any more this is a complex flight simulator.

 

The great modules that are being produced are as complex and realistic as anything being produced for fsx/x plane.

 

Do you think we will see the vatsim people moving into DCS World?

 

Could we accommodate them software wise?

 

I think its a bit of a neglected aspect that could really draw in more of the flight sim community and sell more modules. The more modules sold the more cash for development.

 

Who is the big wig/big cheese/ main man as far as online flying is concerned in DCS World?

Could we ask someone to officially approach the vatsim people on behalf of the DCS community?

 

Would there be enough interest in the DCS community to ask them if they would set something up here?

 

What do you think?

 

Any ideas?

[159th_Viper]

A few FSX Devs have tried to get to grips with DCS. After the initial honeymoon period they evaporated..........Maybe it's just too hot in this particular kitchen, who knows?

[Darkwolf]

DCS Allows import Export of a lot of data, which could easily be usedby the VATSIM client.

 

Unfortunately, the showstopper is the map. The current map, and Nevada will be a way too small to "handle" VATSIM players. I did some airline flight in FSX, and the current map size is only ok for General Aviation.

 

What would be needed is :

 

1/ Civilian Aircraft. That the basis :music_whistling:

 

Unless some big guys hop in there, they is no hope. Guys won't drop their PMDG 747 for a "FC style" airliner. An airliner such 737 / 747 and others, are at least, the same amount of work than a A10C / F18C.

 

2/ World map. Or at least, a good amount of it.

 

The only way in, would be to create a world "placeholder". A World scaled map rendered at a very low detail level, where DCS level of map would "fit in".

So guys would for example take of from a nice and detailled Nevada, and land in a nice and detailled georgia, but still have something to look (and mainly, nav aids) all along their path.

 

3/ Complete civilian ATC.

To attract VATSIM Players, you need a "SP" playerbase. People won't buy everything "again" if they can play both VATSIM and single player mode when VATSIM controller are low.

 

 

And a lot of other details, but starting with this will be a good start.

 

 

 

Personnally, I can't start FSX anymore, and Xplane is the worst pile of shit i ever saw. Despite being mainly "ground pounder" style of virtual pilot, I am actually more interrested in DCS taking a civilian path, than getting the F18. :smartass:

I'm sick of jumping from FSX to DCS to FSX to DCS everytime i want to fly civilian. FSX brass more cash than DCS, a way way more. I'm sure at some point, ED or third party will jump in it.

If at least i had the SDK, i would already be working on the map, since I'm only part time and have a lot of time to give. My brain is f*** up for aircraft modeling but i had some time on OFP SDK back in the time. (when you learned industrial 3D, it is hard to revert to artistic 3D, completly not the same).

 

 

EDIT : And even more, i am WAY MORE interrested by a basic Cessna 172 than the F18, which would allow to drive more player into DCS.

[leafer]

A few FSX Devs have tried to get to grips with DCS. After the initial honeymoon period they evaporated..........Maybe it's just too hot in this particular kitchen, who knows?

 

I like what you did there. LOL

[WRAITH]

DCS ATC / VATSIM + Weather Engine

 

 

Do you think we will see the vatsim people moving into DCS World?

 

 

Hi bud,

 

I hope so!

 

Also this would be kool.......... http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2159247&postcount=10 :smilewink::thumbup:

 

Heaps to do.............................

 

 

 

Take care :thumbup:

[Abburo]

I think it will be a great adding to DCS as World.

For now communities as VATSIM or IVAO are oriented to non-combat simmulations. Their purposes are a bit different that the ones in DCS, meaning they are oriented to practice real world procedures, tower communications and aircraft operations but in a non-combat world.

 

From my point of view, it will be an enormous step forward for all of us that they could migrate to DCS, but this will not happened without an proper infrastructure. When DCS will can provide them a proper in-game ATC, some popular airliners and most of all proper scenery, then I think this migration may start. Untill then, there are two separate worlds. More than that there are intense discussion about meaning of DCS, having that "combat" word inside... which should not be read ad literam.

 

Maybe will not be a bad idea fo Eagle Dynamics to try to rebrand their simulation to a name more comprehensive like DWS (Digital World Simulation) :D

 

I would love very much that DCS and it's fidelity level to unify the most important simulations and their developers.

 

 

Edit: A Cessna and an 747 will double for sure the number of DCS players.

Edited September 8, 2014 by Abburo

[WRAITH]

I think it will be a great adding to DCS as World.

For now communities as VATSIM or IVAO are oriented to non-combat simmulations. Their purposes are a bit different that the ones in DCS, meaning they are oriented to practice real world procedures, tower communications and aircraft operations but in a non-combat world.

 

From my point of view, it will be an enormous step forward for all of us that they could migrate to DCS, but this will not happened without an proper infrastructure. When DCS will can provide them a proper in-game ATC, some popular airliners and most of all proper scenery, then I think this migration may start. Untill then, there are two separate worlds. More than that there are intense discussion about meaning of DCS, having that "combat" word inside... which should not be read ad literam.

 

Maybe will not be a bad idea fo Eagle Dynamics to try to rebrand their simulation to a name more comprehensive like DWS (Digital World Simulation) :D

 

I would love very much that DCS and it's fidelity level to unify the most important simulations and their developers.

 

 

Edit: A Cessna and an 747 will double for sure the number of DCS players.

 

Abburro,

 

I am glad you support us on this good to see that you are getting the gist of what some of us are painfully sharing and saying on this Forum and the potential the DCS sim could have.

 

Its so hard sometimes to communicate in Forums in general yet alone even get developers to cooperate and build an awesome sim or even more sims for all likes and wishes for that matter.

 

Cheers,

 

:beer:

 

Cheers

[BeachAV8R]

A DCS level Cessna Caravan would be a huge leap forward toward cracking that civil market. The map sizes are a concern, of course, but starting small with light GA stuff would help things along. Expanding the user base is a great idea..

 

BeachAV8R

[Abburo]

Abburro,

 

I am glad you support us on this good[...]

 

 

"us", who? Are you part of which entity?

[Teapot]

Nice discussion!

I'm a long-time Flanker/DCS player... in fact I've been a Flanker player since version 1.1, but I've been away for a little bit.

Coming from the world of X-Plane (as my civvie sim of choice) I agree with most of what's being said here (I have my own ideas about which civ sim qualifies as sh!te ... but that's grist for another debate :huh:).

 

DCS definitely 'feels' (flight dynamics wise) like it has the edge over all the current crop of civvie sims out there (XP, P3D & FSX ... I have all three). There is definitely a fluid feeling when I interact with the DCS world environment that is missing in the aforementioned civvie sims, in that DCS is consistently good/sophisticated across all flight regimes.

If DCS decided to include General Aviation I'd drop all my current civvie sims in a heart beat .. no contest .. build me an Cessna 185 bush plane with floats and tundra tires or even better, a DH6 Twin Otter with the sea/bush kit and I'll fly nothing else.

 

As was previously stated, the size of the usable map, the need for some GA airplanes and the lack AIRAC data are the main impediments ... currently. But things change, you never know .. this fine digital combat flight simulation could very well become the greatest digital combat & GA flight sim ever ... in fact DCS is multi dimensional because it covers different era's of flight as well (we're already heading towards the greatest WWII and possibly Korea & SEA DCS of all time).

 

DCS ~ GACFS (General Aviation & Combat Flight Sim) :D

Edited September 8, 2014 by Teapot

[cichlidfan]

"us", who? Are you part of which entity?

 

:megalol:

[BitMaster]

Cessna Pilots of the future BEWARE !

 

Whenever you leave the corridor you will be brought up and escorted back to corridor or forced to land ;)

 

Wouldn't that be a nice screenshot ? drack in his Cesnna 172 escorted by two F/A-18's on approach HAHA

 

Bring them on, it can only add fun !

 

Bit

[agrasyuk]

For what is worth,

I'm not going to buy any more WWII prop birds (stang and Dora covers that era 200% for me),

But c172 would be insta buy as it will be an awesome training aid.

Not worried of f18 since I am mostly offline.

[Exorcet]

Not worried of f18 since I am mostly offline.

There's nothing to worry about even if you fly exclusively online.

[USSInchon]

There's nothing to worry about even if you fly exclusively online.

 

Why, because he'll never see it coming?

[PFunk1606688187]

The problem with DCS is that its fundamentally unequipped to satisfy the needs of civilian simmers. FSX out of the box even before addons of any kind offers you the opportunity to fly into pretty much any airport on the planet from anywhere else on the planet non stop. Updating the map is so easy that you can just download freeware airport files to make it so you can fly into a popular airport on VATSIM.

 

DCS however has a relatively small map and whats more its "broken" from the perspective of realistic civilian flight. The map is as I understand it rendered on a flat plane so it doesn't match up properly to real life. You just can't fly on Vatsim if your game doesn't show you what it shows the controllers or other pilots. How can the controllers vector you to a runway if its on a different heading to what theirs is or give you magnetic headings to establish separation from other traffic if that sends you somewhere other than where he intends you to go?

 

DCS is a sim that has always been designed to work inside its own bubble. FSX by the grace of its design is more flexible, as is Xplane. For DCS to become as flexible as the other options used by people on VATSIM would require more work than anyone can possibly consider reasonable, at least in the short to medium term.

[drack]

Hi Folks,

 

Some interesting stuff being generated here.

 

As such I've posted this on the VATSIM forum:-

 

Hi Folks,

 

Just popped in to post an invitation for you to have some input on a thread that has started on DCS World website.

 

The question has been asked if we will start to see VATSIM finding a home in DCS World?

 

I'm sure there are many people that would appreciate your input/comments/suggestions and to hear things from your perspective.

 

On behalf of the DCS World community may I extend this invitation to you.

 

Many thanks and looking forward to your input.

 

Link:

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?s ... 9&t=129818

 

 

I'm sure a lot of people would be interested to hear some input from their perspective.

 

Lets wait and see if they pop over.......

[WRAITH]

Hi Folks,

 

Many thanks and looking forward to your input.

 

Link:

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?s ... 9&t=129818

 

 

I'm sure a lot of people would be interested to hear some input from their perspective.

 

Lets wait and see if they pop over.......

 

 

Hi drack,

 

I hope so I really dont see why not, but then you know this thread was moved from the DCS World TAB :( So yeah mmm dont count on it. But I like your track of thought it would make things really good.

 

Again keeping it positive I hope a group of developers gather together and work with ED-DCS for implementation, so I am a supporter of this with you guys!

 

Cheers,

 

:beer:

Edited September 9, 2014 by WRAITH

[aeliusg]

I don't think it's advisable for civilian aircraft to fly in war zones. ATC or not.

[Random]

Edge will allow maps with a curved surface IIRC. Theres already a couple of radar, radio and ATC plugins so a VATSIM type setup is definately doable! Someone just needs to model the whole of earth.. Should only take a couple of decades right?

[Darkwolf]

Get me a SDK and tommorow that'll already be 19 years and 363 days left :)

[drack]

I have more of an immediate vision of being able to go on-line and have three or four Terminal Control areas operating around airfields and the rest of the map being uncontrolled airspace.

I'm sure if VATSIM were to set up a server like this it would be a big step forward and a very popular addition to what is for the general user a very limited on-line experience at present.

 

I was very disheartened to see this thread moved to 'chit-chat'.

If it was felt that it was not appropriate where it was then why not 'Multiplayer'?

How can we ask an Organisation like VATSIM if they would consider taking a serious look at DCS World when the first thing we tell them is that the service they provide and the time they give is considered to be of little significance?

[sobek]

Have you heard of LotAtc for DCS?

[WRAITH]

ANTICIPATION IS WORSE THAN DEATH ITSELF! LoL

 

Have you heard of LotAtc for DCS?

 

Hi Sobek,

 

First how are ya?

 

Okay great to know, can we know more about this please this should be in Silver-Dragons Road Map Thread ....... http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=116893

 

If it has any weight in development.

 

Because reading the Forum as is now makes no sense as to what is promised and what is actually in development and will be delivered with all respect, love and kindness. How else do I say this and be honest in my opinion.

 

Sobek you know what we want as a Falcon 4.0 fan will we ever see it in DCS label.

 

I hope so coming from another Falcon fan and general "Air War Combat Simulation" wanting all the treats that would fit with a "Modern Air War Combat Sim" in "Concept and Design"!

 

I just see people posting and almost the same things in different ways month by month and the same responses and replies its sadly difficult and frustrating for many and myself.

 

I guess we just hold on and wait longer after Update 2.0.0 + EDGE...........

 

Well take care.

 

Cheers,

 

WRAITH.........tagnight...LoL

Edited September 10, 2014 by WRAITH

[drack]

Sobek - maybe thats the sort of software that we could see being employed.

 

Heres an update on the feedback I have had so far on the VATSIM forum:-

 

'That depends far more on the DCS devs than on VATSIM. If the sim works well in our world, which from the forum it doesn't seem like its quite ready for that yet, and a dev builds a client to hook into VATSIM, then there is a good possibility. Contrary to some of the posts I read over there, VATSIM has a good mil flying community.'

 

 

'Yes, and no doubt would expand!'

 

 

'some of the SIMAF squadrons already use DCS for combat ops there were plans to see how we could hook in AMC flights in as well. pretty sure its the same across the other virtual military groups on the network

 

'would be interesting to see how that would tie into a live VATSIM connection. wouldnt that require the globe to be simulated in DCS? or would it be restricted to a specific section of the world? then there is the whole ATC aspect.'

 

 

'This is what I disliked about some of the MIL VSOAs, they were stating that combat was conducted on another server away from VATSIM. My belief is VATSIM is the priority, why promote going elsewhere?'

 

 

'VATSIM is always the priority for daily ops, some have simply moved certain types of operations off the network on to other platforms that allow them to go beyond what our current simulators limit us to, especially operations which on VATSIM even they arent allowed to simulate (real world conflicts and multi role ops for example that may include ground and air assets)'

 

My latest addition:-

 

'Thanks very much for your replies.

 

The initial scenario that I envision for DCS World would be the setting up of a general server where pilots could join to enjoy controlled airspace at airports.

I'm sure that a server where there were 3 or 4 Terminal control areas with maybe a live fire range would be a very popular and much visited asset. The rest of the 'sandbox' airspace being 'free fly'.

 

The level of aircraft sophistication that DCS World is now able to offer certainly rivals anything available anywhere else. As such it is defiantly drawing in the 'pure flight simmer' user.

For example, I rarely drop bombs or shoot aircraft down. I've recently taken the time to learn how to properly start an A10C, navigate and execute an ILS approach.

A very challenging and satisfying experience and I'm sure there are a growing number of 'Pure flight simmers' enjoying the same thing.

 

Being able to contact a controller to enter a Terminal control area would be a huge and much valued addition. One that would add so much more immersion.

 

If such a thing could be set up do you think that VATSIM would be interested in staffing it?

 

It would probably even be called 'The VATSIM server'.

 

NOTE: They very respectfully moved my post from 'General discussion' to 'Pilot talk' and didn't dump it in 'Chit-Chat'. (Not that I have a stick up my ar*e about anything of course).

Edited September 10, 2014 by drack