Goodbye VR... for now at least.

[Baldrick33]

I guess I'm fortunate enough that my computer runs the oculus rift efficiently enough that I never had any insurmountable resolution issues, but what are you VR users doing about controls that are not mapped to a HOTAS? It's cool to fly around and check out the scenery, but I wasn't able to come up with a viable method of clicking switches in the cockpit without pausing the game and going back to the handsets. And the handsets are a terrible substitute for HOTAS.

 

MY favorite module is the F-14. I like being able to switch between front and back seats. I'd love to hear what others have done to overcome this limitations between handset and HOTAS.

I have been experimenting with button boxes and more recently MFDs in VR. It is surprising how quickly you can develop muscle memory. That said I use DCS in VR for immersion rather than being a competitive multiplayer ace! For me using physical devices feels a bit more immersive than clicking buttons on screen but that works very well too.

 

My VR handsets remain unused.

[RustBelt]

A VR version would have to be about as simplistic looking as you see in VTOL. That level of graphics wouldn’t sell for the people who expect what you see in 2D so yeah it would likely have to be rewritten as a completely different version of the sim. I doubt there are enough VR users to support that yet.

 

Well, let's be honest. It ALREADY needs to be rewritten even for 2D. v2.6 VULKAN is just another bondo job on a pretty tired game engine.

 

But remember, DCS is free, so you get what you pay for.

[hansangb]

Everybody gets to read the forums, this isn’t a secret discussion site. And who says I’m not interested in VR? I might be if it performed and worked well enough.

 

 

I don't know. Reverb works incredibly well for me. I was going to make an through the lens video last weekend and realized that my GoPro only goes to 1440 resolution. Too low of a resolution to capture the 2160 vertical resolution.

 

I love my Reverb. love it.

[Fri13]

Well, let's be honest. It ALREADY needs to be rewritten even for 2D. v2.6 VULKAN is just another bondo job on a pretty tired game engine.

 

But remember, DCS is free, so you get what you pay for.

 

The DCS is receiving new graphics engine, not just Vulcan implementation. It is as well receiving a new terrain engine, not just graphics update.

 

Lots of things is going to change, as major overhaul for AI is coming. Lots of new functions and features like damage modeling and so on.

 

But anyone is free to be pessimistic and already feel that they don't get anything in future...

[Fri13]

A VR version would have to be about as simplistic looking as you see in VTOL. That level of graphics wouldn’t sell for the people who expect what you see in 2D so yeah it would likely have to be rewritten as a completely different version of the sim. I doubt there are enough VR users to support that yet.

 

Go and sit down in KA-50 or a A-10A and you see possibly even simpler cockpit than what VTOL VR has to offer, excluding the textures.

 

Already one can run DCS in VR at over 90fps, that ain't the problem.

 

Problem is that there ain't support for many of modern hardware capabilities like 12 cores and SLI for two eyes etc. Like how about dedicating one CPU core for player aircraft itself? One for all the missiles and their flight modeling. One for all AI aircrafts on blueside, one for red side, one for red ground and one for blue ground... That is already 6 cores.... Now one core just to calculate impact zones and damage modeling, one for sea simulation etc etc...

 

But if you want to experience VTOL VR graphics, set everything to low in DCS and be happy!

[Fri13]

Nothing you’ve said supports DCS being “tailored for VR” just that like many things it is capable of being run in VR.

 

Everything I said supports it, you just ignore everything as you don't want to see the truth...

[BigDuke6ixx]

I guess I'm fortunate enough that my computer runs the oculus rift efficiently enough that I never had any insurmountable resolution issues, but what are you VR users doing about controls that are not mapped to a HOTAS? It's cool to fly around and check out the scenery, but I wasn't able to come up with a viable method of clicking switches in the cockpit without pausing the game and going back to the handsets. And the handsets are a terrible substitute for HOTAS.

 

MY favorite module is the F-14. I like being able to switch between front and back seats. I'd love to hear what others have done to overcome this limitations between handset and HOTAS.

 

I use a combination of voice attack and the head controlled mouse. Every switch and dial can be voice controlled.

[Mking]

I m buy only vr for dcs world ! I can't imagine it without it

[martinistripes]

I have the Index and a RTX 2070 (laptop). The Index is a great headset but it will be several generations of GPU before I can squeeze the most out of it. That's great, because I see no reason to upgrade the headset for a few years now. I'll continue to enjoy it more as GPUs progress. Currently I can't add enough detail or SS to DCS World. For now, it works great with iRacing where the simulated world is much smaller and sharpness and detail aren't so paramount.

[Baldrick33]

I use a combination of voice attack and the head controlled mouse. Every switch and dial can be voice controlled.

I guess we all have our own views on what makes and breaks immersion. For me voice attack is great for comms but pilots don't use voice activated switches and somehow pressing a physical switch or clicking a physical button to flick a virtual switch on screen feels more real to me.

[BigDuke6ixx]

I guess we all have our own views on what makes and breaks immersion. For me voice attack is great for comms but pilots don't use voice activated switches and somehow pressing a physical switch or clicking a physical button to flick a virtual switch on screen feels more real to me.

 

I'm not here to press buttons. I look at those home cockpits all surrounded by button boxes and they all look ridiculous to me. Take the A-10C, pretty much everything I want is on the sticks anyway.

[martinistripes]

I'm not here to press buttons.

 

[TOYKILLA]

Yep, a HP Reverb and the PointCtrl Device, is the VR DCS Future Cockpit.

 

I also don't like Voice Attack.

 

@ micsmotionsimulator

[gcompc]

I have a different take on VR. I’m as happy as I’ve ever been with it since I’ve been flying in DCS. I run a pretty decent setup and have good general playability, smoothness, and visuals in the game I’m the average player who is happy with their VR set up.

 

Let me tell you where the real engine and developer problems are and that’s in “Real World”. I flew in civil aviation for a few years and looking back I now realize I didn’t enjoy it as much as I thought I did.

 

Flying a Cessna 152 or 172 I was always fighting updrafts and crazy turbulence changes on hot breezy days. Turning 360’s with my instructor never failed to cause nausea. Flying over populated areas on a hot summer day. I never saw the beauty of the scenery; I just saw a dense dirty haze.

 

Other great adventures like getting lost on a cross country, “Do you have runway in sight?” I don’t have the airport in sight! Crosswind landings oh what a joy.

 

In "Real World" none of the visuals are adjustable. The glare of the sun is always directly in your face and there is no gamma adjustment slider. You can’t adjust the wind speed or velocity and there are no turbulence settings. Clearly the developers have fallen short here. To top it off the real world has only one plane that I can afford to fly."

 

In VR I can run away from all those uncomfortable feelings. I can fly in perfect scenery; I control the weather and environment. I have some the world’s most realistic and complex aircraft at my fingertips. I’m not afraid of anything! I rest very comfortably in my flight chair, no G’s here. I guess you could call me the timid pilot but DCS in VR is the perfect escape for me. I enjoy keeping it real, but, let's say not 100 per cent real.

The point? Although probably irrelevant and not an in-depth opinion DCS in VR is better than the real thing for me even with all its perceived shortcomings. I’ll never give it up and I bet neither would most of us in this forum.

Edited January 22, 2020 by gcompc

[BigDuke6ixx]

I have a different take on VR. I’m as happy as I’ve ever been with it since I’ve been flying in DCS. I run a pretty decent setup and have good general playability, smoothness, and visuals in the game I’m the average player who is happy with their VR set up.

 

Let me tell you where the real engine and developer problems are and that’s in “Real World”. I flew in civil aviation for a few years and looking back I now realize I didn’t enjoy it as much as I thought I did.

 

Flying a Cessna 152 or 172 I was always fighting updrafts and crazy turbulence changes on hot breezy days. Turning 360’s with my instructor never failed to cause nausea. Flying over populated areas on a hot summer day. I never saw the beauty of the scenery; I just saw a dense dirty haze.

 

Other great adventures like getting lost on a cross country, “Do you have runway in sight?” I don’t have the airport in sight! Crosswind landings oh what a joy.

 

In "Real World" none of the visuals are adjustable. The glare of the sun is always directly in your face and there is no gamma adjustment slider. You can’t adjust the wind speed or velocity and there are no turbulence settings. Clearly the developers have fallen short here. To top it off the real world has only one plane that I can afford to fly."

 

In VR I can run away from all those uncomfortable feelings. I can fly in perfect scenery; I control the weather and environment. I have some the world’s most realistic and complex aircraft at my fingertips. I’m not afraid of anything! I rest very comfortably in my flight chair, no G’s here. I guess you could call me the timid pilot but DCS in VR is the perfect escape for me. I enjoy keeping it real, but, let's say not 100 per cent real.

The point? Although probably irrelevant and not an in-depth opinion DCS in VR is better than the real thing for me even with all its perceived shortcomings. I’ll never give it up and I bet neither would most of us in this forum.

 

Well said. And don't forget the cost and the value for money of DCS. You get to blow stuff up and in VR it looks good. Oh yeah, seeing a sam launch at you in VR - so cool.

[dburne]

I think the thread title should be changed to " How many ways I can say goodbye to VR"...

:megalol:

[GunSlingerAUS]

Heh. Too bad they don't have an emoji that puts the back of its hand up to its forehead and tips its head back like its letting out a dramatic sigh. Maybe the code for it would be :melodrama:. LOL

 

Actually, it was just me cutting through the rabid fanboyism displayed by some of the VR crew. There's a large percentage of DCS flyers who tried VR after hearing such gushing praise, only to find the experience ultimately disappointing and shallow after the initial spooge-fest wore off. The fact that those who espouse the benefits of VR are clearly lacking in PC and VR technical expertise makes it hard to simply stand by and see such rubbish spouted forth time and time again. The fact that such incorrect advice can cause others to lose sizeable investments in time and money is hard to stomach. It's even worse than those folks who give out archaic and mystical tech tips to get DCS running better, tips that have been proven to be utter placebo effect at best, and Windows-wrecking hacks at worst.

 

It's totally great that some people love DCS in VR. However, when they make ridiculous claims about the experience from a technical standpoint, such as the magical removal of side-effects of the technology that VR is actually built on (cough async reprojection cough), they need to be corrected.

[BigDuke6ixx]

Actually, it was just me cutting through the rabid fanboyism displayed by some of the VR crew. There's a large percentage of DCS flyers who tried VR after hearing such gushing praise, only to find the experience ultimately disappointing and shallow after the initial spooge-fest wore off. The fact that those who espouse the benefits of VR are clearly lacking in PC and VR technical expertise makes it hard to simply stand by and see such rubbish spouted forth time and time again. The fact that such incorrect advice can cause others to lose sizeable investments in time and money is hard to stomach. It's even worse than those folks who give out archaic and mystical tech tips to get DCS running better, tips that have been proven to be utter placebo effect at best, and Windows-wrecking hacks at worst.

 

It's totally great that some people love DCS in VR. However, when they make ridiculous claims about the experience from a technical standpoint, such as the magical removal of side-effects of the technology that VR is actually built on (cough async reprojection cough), they need to be corrected.

 

You know nothing. Your own opinions seem to be based upon your own lack of ability.

 

I can deploy an A-10C into the battle area, destroy things and egress out again totally without issue in VR. Doing the same in 2d is utterly unfulfilling. I'm not interested in flying drones from drone stations because its old hat and lame AF.

[Gman109]

I've had every VR headset, several of each in fact, except the XTAL. Still using VR, both the Rift S and Reverb.

 

 

That said, for doing PvP competitively online (particularly 1v1 dueling with SRM and especially guns), IMO you're at a massive disadvantage in VR versus TrackIR. Not so much because of the resolution, but because of how much more difficult and slower it is to look behind your 3-9 line. I've heard many in the VR forum say this is "nonsense". Anyone who wants to prove they can beat me, or say Growlingsidewinder/etc using TrackIR with their VR headset on, PM me and show me how.

 

 

VR is great, but for competitive online play, IMO it's a big disadvantage when you get into visual range fights. Swivel chairs and all the other "tricks" simply can't make up for the speed and ease TrackIR users can simulate looking back and tracking the threat. Peripheral vision, which in r/l allows the eyes to make up for that last 20 or 30 degrees the neck/head can't turn, isn't modeled in VR (yet) either.

 

 

I do 3/4 of my DCS flying in VR still - but when it comes time to fly online PvP, the Reverb gets parked, and the TiR goes on. For now. To each their own, but I agree with most in this thread, that VR is a must have - I only state the limitations it still has with regards to being competitive in online PVP duels IMO.

Edited January 31, 2020 by Gman109

[Mr. Big.Biggs]

And think of how much more superior our air forces would be if they could just turn their heads 20 degrees and see behind them? “serious sim”or game?

All jokes aside different strokes for different folks! I love the Sa in an airquake style server but on a server with a more “global” style conflict, I never even see who shoots me. Picking out aircraft at a distance without tags is an absolute sticking point. That said, if I want to watch wings on a monitor, ill boot up youtube! Agree to disagree and move forward.

Cheers

[dburne]

Yep I will tell ya for me, if a game can not be played in VR, then it is a game that will not reside on my PC.

And I certainly have not been

clearly lacking in PC and VR technical expertise

as I have been building PC's since the 90's.

 

VR is quite the experience, however it is not for everyone for sure. I will maintain though from what I have seen across the various forums most PC enthusiasts who try it stay with it.

 

No right or wrong, just very much dependent on the individual.

[Lange_666]

And think of how much more superior our air forces would be if they could just turn their heads 20 degrees and see behind them? “serious sim”or game?

You could turn that around and ask yourself how good your airforce will be when they have to turn their head with a keyboard or 4-way hatswitch. It's a trade-off for the use of a monitor as your world which ain't a 24" inch screen either. If you look behind you, you don't see your monitor at all. I still find it a very nice option to have to look around on a 24" monitor compared to the use of the keypad on your keyboard or hat switch on a stick.

[Mr. Big.Biggs]

Never tried track Ir to be honest. Got into this bc of vr and just staying with it. My last video system was Mrs Pacman so i find it amazing!!

[*Rage*]

You know nothing. Your own opinions seem to be based upon your own lack of ability.

 

I can deploy an A-10C into the battle area, destroy things and egress out again totally without issue in VR. Doing the same in 2d is utterly unfulfilling. I'm not interested in flying drones from drone stations because its old hat and lame AF.

 

Wow.

[speed-of-heat]

VR is a series of compromises, as is 2d. But that's the nature of not getting into a real jet...and staring at lcd/oled and pretending we are