The Legit Discussion for PTID on the F-14B and late F-14A

[kotor633]

Simply fuckin unbelievable ... HB has said it several times now why they can't implement it. And there are still those here who don't want to hear that, want to believe, can't come to terms with it ... whatever. We will get (soon) two more modifications of the A-Tomcat. Is not that enough?

[QuiGon]

3 hours ago, Bananabrai said:

Two different F-14 models, which will eventually be 3

 

*4

[LanceCriminal86]

The last A model tomcats produced, the Block 140s, were made in 1986-87 timeframe and the very last 4 of those went to VF-201 and VF-202. They even shipped with bullet fairings and didn't come with TCS installed and stayed that way for a few years it seems.

 

Well before PTID, LANTIRN, etc. Hell they were the first squadrons authorized to drop A2G ordnance apparently and were part of the early tests at Fallon (of course after the VX squadrons did their stuff).

 

Saying Block 135 as "late" doesn't necessarily imply that they were supposed to be As with PTID. Even by the time VF-201 finally went to Hornets in 1998 they did not get LANTIRN. I believe their allotted pods were redirected to VF-103? I think the general statements from Heatblur is that these Tomcats are supposed to represent the later 80s through the mid 90s or so, but prior to the PTID, DFCS, GPS, etc. upgrades that came with the 2000s. Some of those upgrades were only being signed off on, not heavily deployed to fleet jets by '96-'98.

 

 

 

I guess my question is, were As and Bs using LANTIRN during the period of time represented with the fishbowl TID? Because I know it has been questioned in the past stating that the BUS upgrades to even make LANTIRN work in a Tomcat also came with the PTID. You mentioned the D model Tomcats that still had fishbowls which I have heard many times, and we also saw plenty of D model LANTIRN usage through the GWOT, but is there anything specifically showing that our A and B Tomcats with LANTIRN and no PTID are not in themselves somewhat of an extreme rarity or "loophole" in order to say it did happen?

[Naquaii]

8 minutes ago, LanceCriminal86 said:

The last A model tomcats produced, the Block 140s, were made in 1986-87 timeframe and the very last 4 of those went to VF-201 and VF-202. They even shipped with bullet fairings and didn't come with TCS installed and stayed that way for a few years it seems.

 

Well before PTID, LANTIRN, etc. Hell they were the first squadrons authorized to drop A2G ordnance apparently and were part of the early tests at Fallon (of course after the VX squadrons did their stuff).

 

Saying Block 135 as "late" doesn't necessarily imply that they were supposed to be As with PTID. Even by the time VF-201 finally went to Hornets in 1998 they did not get LANTIRN. I believe their allotted pods were redirected to VF-103? I think the general statements from Heatblur is that these Tomcats are supposed to represent the later 80s through the mid 90s or so, but prior to the PTID, DFCS, GPS, etc. upgrades that came with the 2000s. Some of those upgrades were only being signed off on, not heavily deployed to fleet jets by '96-'98.

 

 

 

I guess my question is, were As and Bs using LANTIRN during the period of time represented with the fishbowl TID? Because I know it has been questioned in the past stating that the BUS upgrades to even make LANTIRN work in a Tomcat also came with the PTID. You mentioned the D model Tomcats that still had fishbowls which I have heard many times, and we also saw plenty of D model LANTIRN usage through the GWOT, but is there anything specifically showing that our A and B Tomcats with LANTIRN and no PTID are not in themselves somewhat of an extreme rarity or "loophole" in order to say it did happen?

 

Yes, this has been discussed at length before and the non PTID LANTIRN usage was indeed an oddity that was only used in the beginning, but it did exist afaik.

[LanceCriminal86]

I thought that was what I had read as well, but wanted to be clear in my question. I recall that being a point of contention for some because it was extrapolating a small circumstance vs the reality. BUT, it makes sense why PTID can't be done because as you said, you'd have to know what every menu option did, symbology, and any other rear cockpit changes that came along with it.

 

You guys could always just say hey, since you want "historically correct" and take LANTIRN away entirely and just say the cutoff is mid-90s pre-LANTIRN lol. Keep the GBUs but force everyone to have a buddy lase when the Intruder comes out...

 

 

And hey, that solves the JESTER LANTIRN problem! Two birds with one stone!

[RustBelt]

Some of us do that now, because really, there's always either a buddy or a JTAC to work the laser, so LANTRN is just a pylon pig. 

[TLTeo]

On a practical note, doing a fishbowl+LANTIRN (optionally) jet basically allows HB to have a Tomcat that suits pretty much any era for the aircraft's service life, so that's a nice touch.

[key_stroked]

29 minutes ago, LanceCriminal86 said:

I thought that was what I had read as well, but wanted to be clear in my question. I recall that being a point of contention for some because it was extrapolating a small circumstance vs the reality. BUT, it makes sense why PTID can't be done because as you said, you'd have to know what every menu option did, symbology, and any other rear cockpit changes that came along with it.

 

You guys could always just say hey, since you want "historically correct" and take LANTIRN away entirely and just say the cutoff is mid-90s pre-LANTIRN lol. Keep the GBUs but force everyone to have a buddy lase when the Intruder comes out...

 

 

And hey, that solves the JESTER LANTIRN problem! Two birds with one stone!

 

Taking away functionality already introduced is never a solution to anything.

[Swordsman422]

If I couldn't drop LGBs from it and guide them myself, I'm not sure I'd fly the F-14 as much. It's my favorite fighter, but I didn't really start to care about it until it was toting bombs. Since we can't get the PTID, keeping the LANTIRN and dealing with the "deficiencies" of the fishbowl display is an adequate compromise. Heck, F-14Ds were dropping bombs without PTID until nearly the very end.

[Nexus-6]

It would be great to have Tomcats of every variant and every feature in DCS.  But it isn't going to happen.  It just isn't.  Heatblur have made their reasons clear over and over again.

Edited December 18, 2020 by Nexus-6

[Southernbear]

I mean hey you now get to have a nice little history tid bit once RAZBAM releases their F-15E. Because its my understanding the squadron of F-14 dedicated to the land based F-15Es also had the fishbowl TID when they mention the reasoning behind why they tagged them onto the Eagle squadrons due to a larger display to use the LANTIRN system to buddy lase for the Strike Eagles. 

[Uxi]

On 12/18/2020 at 2:00 PM, Swordsman422 said:

If I couldn't drop LGBs from it and guide them myself, I'm not sure I'd fly the F-14 as much. It's my favorite fighter, but I didn't really start to care about it until it was toting bombs. Since we can't get the PTID, keeping the LANTIRN and dealing with the "deficiencies" of the fishbowl display is an adequate compromise. Heck, F-14Ds were dropping bombs without PTID until nearly the very end.

 

My understanding was the F-14D fishbowls (and probably the F-14A+/B) had a higher resolution than the older ones in the F-14A (which had to be replaced if they wanted to have the LANTIRN).  Initial models of F-14D had the (newer) round fishbowl with the new DDD while the PTID only became standard later.

 

Similarly, there did seem to be (many) F-14A since that never saw the new screens especially if they were TARPS planes, but hard to find an F-14B in the configuration we have with LANTIRN without a PTID (though they all had the old little square DDD).   

Honestly, I'd want the Sparrowhawk more than the PTID.  That never really seems to have existed either, but would be most useful. 

[viper2097]

Heatblur should deliver what they have promised.

Until yet, they made an awesome job.

Personaly, after that, I would welcome any kind of addition to the Tomcat. Simply because it would make it more awesome, and I know HB would deliver fair and with quality.

 

So lets see how things are going after the "sold" F-14 is finished. Probably there will be extra paid additions like that? Why not?
But I guess there should yet be no discussion about the project after two (or three) not yet finished projects...

[Kev2go]

 Unusual to have fishbowl Bomcats with lantirn, and disappointed it wasn't added in the end. But understandable form Heatblur.

 

Ah well guess maybe we can expect that say around a decade later when module 3d textures get aged enough, we can hope  heatblur opts for a DCS F14A/B tomcat II module update of which they will have the opportunity to include a updated PTID equipped bomcat.

 

 

Edited February 15, 2021 by Kev2go

[Dudikoff]

On 12/21/2020 at 6:43 AM, Uxi said:

 

My understanding was the F-14D fishbowls (and probably the F-14A+/B) had a higher resolution than the older ones in the F-14A (which had to be replaced if they wanted to have the LANTIRN).  Initial models of F-14D had the (newer) round fishbowl with the new DDD while the PTID only became standard later.

 

Unlike in the F-14A/B, the RIO in the F-14D had an extra MFD as well which was used to show the LTS picture AFAIK (and not the TID screen).

Edited February 16, 2021 by Dudikoff

[SkyhawkDriver]

[Southernbear]

You know, at this rate if they take any longer with the A Early and Iranian model the DOD will just declassify either the Sparrow Hawk SMS pages or the IRST For the F-14D and we can just get those instead lmao.

[Shrike88]

On 12/17/2020 at 9:54 AM, TLTeo said:

Not happening, stop asking for it

 

Looks like you should be eating your words along with a side of humble pie

[Stackup]

28 minutes ago, Shrike88 said:

Looks like you should be eating your words along with a side of humble pie

Why should he?  The B/U is not the same thing as the D.

[SkyhawkDriver]

I hope everyone who said they couldn't make the PTID, can suck a fat one. Respectfully.

[RustBelt]

On 1/17/2025 at 2:42 PM, SkyhawkDriver said:

I hope everyone who said they couldn't make the PTID, can suck a fat one. Respectfully.

Not couldn’t, they had gone on record saying they wouldn’t. 
 

And “Officially” according to HB themselves, they still haven’t said they WOULD make it. It was just sales puffery (actual legal term of art) in the Hype video. 

[Zabuzard]

On 1/27/2025 at 11:06 PM, RustBelt said:

And “Officially” according to HB themselves, they still haven’t said they WOULD make it.

Cobra said that he will share concrete news on whats the deal with the BU later this year. Until then we have to wait

[TLTeo]

Lovely posts. I guess my choice is to glimpse into the future to find out what HB will eventually gain acces to, or suck a fat one? Really insightful.

Edited February 18 by TLTeo

[DD_Fenrir]

37 minutes ago, TLTeo said:

Lovely posts. I guess my choice is to glimpse into the future to find out what HB will eventually gain acces to, or suck a fat one? Really insightful.

Your mistake is in assuming your entitlement to that knowledge.

Best get noshing old bean.

Edited February 18 by DD_Fenrir

[RustBelt]

Yea well, m

11 hours ago, TLTeo said:

Lovely posts. I guess my choice is to glimpse into the future to find out what HB will eventually gain acces to, or suck a fat one? Really insightful.

Hype video is hype. That’s all.