Pilot body: remove head

[Apache 64]

If you turn your head far right or left, you can see your own helmet from outside.

Own helmet/head should be disabled in first person view. (like in screen 3 and 5)

Problem appears in both seats.

Edited December 17, 2022 by Apache 64

[Nealius]

The pilot body looks amazing, but has one small QoL issue in VR: the head is rendered and blocks your view when looking out the rear quarter, particularly with NVGs mounted to the helmet. This is most evident when looking over your right shoulder to your 4~5 o'clock, where the edge of the pilot's head and the NVGs will appear, blocking one's view of the 4~5 o'clock. 

[poochies]

how did you remove the head ?

 

[corbu1]

vor 20 Stunden schrieb Nealius:

The pilot body looks amazing, but has one small QoL issue in VR: the head is rendered and blocks your view when looking out the rear quarter, particularly with NVGs mounted to the helmet. This is most evident when looking over your right shoulder to your 4~5 o'clock, where the edge of the pilot's head and the NVGs will appear, blocking one's view of the 4~5 o'clock. 

confirm….same for me in VR.

[Apache 64]

vor 14 Stunden schrieb poochies:

how did you remove the head ?

 

Thats the bug. You cannot. ED must remove the first person head like in all other modules too.

Actually the head appears in some angles and in some more "normal" angles it disappears.

[ataribaby]

Yeah please remove head as in all other modules, it is very disturbing in VR.

[poochies]

yes it is annoying and weird 

[Flappie]

On 12/18/2022 at 3:16 PM, Apache 64 said:

Thats the bug. You cannot. ED must remove the first person head like in all other modules too.

Actually the head appears in some angles and in some more "normal" angles it disappears.

Devs answered: it's not a bug, but a feature. The head appears when the point of view is outside of reasonable body limits.

[corbu1]

Hm, what does this mean?

I‘m used to in VR looking sometimes right or left back of the cockpit, visually checking my wingman is still in formation…..I shouldn‘t do that anymore?

[Baldrick33]

38 minutes ago, corbu1 said:

Hm, what does this mean?

I‘m used to in VR looking sometimes right or left back of the cockpit, visually checking my wingman is still in formation…..I shouldn‘t do that anymore?

You still can but constrained to the limits of being strapped into a seat like the real pilot & CPG. You can turn your head as far as you can what you can't do is lean forward and swivel your body around without the helmet popping in to view.

I had to move quite a bit to see the helmet - before this thread I didn't know it existed in VR in cockpit.

That said many of us aren't quite as mobile as a real Apache pilot so it maybe what is considered as "reasonable body limits" is up for debate!

[Apache 64]

vor 1 Stunde schrieb Flappie:

Devs answered: it's not a bug, but a feature. The head appears when the point of view is outside of reasonable body limits.

Not funny! No other DCS module with first person pilot body does this. You can see your head in mirrors there but you cannot "leave" your own body and see your own head from the outside. Thats a no go. Can´t belive this as works as designed. Please check again. It should always look as in this screenshot, like it does in all other DCS planes as well.

Edited January 3, 2023 by Apache 64

[Baldrick33]

3 minutes ago, Apache 64 said:

Not funny! No other DCS module with first person pilot body does this. You can see your head in mirrors there but you cannot "leave" your own body and see your own head from the outside. Thats a no go. Can´t belive this as works as designed. Please check again.

It is a bit like sticking your head through the canopy though. In VR having hard limits for some (myself included) is not a nice solution (the world moves when you hit the limit akin to positional tracking stopping working)

It seems a similar approach is applied here, you can move your head beyond reasonable limits away from you strapped in body but the downside is the head appears. It acts as a disincentive to do it (much like the whooshing noise as you stick your head through the canopy without introducing nausea inducing hard limits.

I personally don't have an issue with it but YMMV

[Flappie]

11 minutes ago, Apache 64 said:

Not funny! No other DCS module with first person pilot body does this. You can see your head in mirrors there but you cannot "leave" your own body and see your own head from the outside. Thats a no go. Can´t belive this as works as designed. Please check again. It should always look as in this screenshot, like it does in all other DCS planes as well.

I agree with you. Devs don't. I can't help, sorry.

[Apache 64]

 

vor 19 Minuten schrieb Baldrick33:

It seems a similar approach is applied here, you can move your head beyond reasonable limits away from you strapped in body but the downside is the head appears. It acts as a disincentive to do it (much like the whooshing noise as you stick your head through the canopy without introducing nausea inducing hard limits.

Thats not the problem. In other modules you can move your head too outside real live limits. 360° if you want. No prob. Should go, it´s only a sim, but never you see your own head. They should not limit the head movement, they should leave the head disabled, like in most of the viewing angles too. And like in other planes. 

Edited January 3, 2023 by Apache 64
screens added mirage huey harrier viggen

[Baldrick33]

4 minutes ago, Apache 64 said:

Thats not the problem. In other modules you can move your head too outside real live limits. 360° if you want. No prob. Should go, it´s only a sim, but never you see your own head. They should not limit the head movement, they should leave the head disabled, like in most of the viewing angles too. And like in other planes. 

You are probably right. I don't recall ever seeing my headless neck in the other models though in normal flying other than when first resetting the VR position.

[Apache 64]

vor 50 Minuten schrieb Flappie:

I agree with you. Devs don't. I can't help, sorry.

This should not be a DEV decision, this is a design decision. Someone has decided that the own head is hidden in the F1 view. In all aircraft.
And in Apache it is already like that, except for a few specific viewing angles. the head "flickers" on and off.

Imagine you were in a dogfight in one of the jets and looking over your shoulder and your own helmet would constantly pop into view.

In my opinion, this is not a "wish list" item but a bug (inconsistent).

Someone from the design team should please take another look at this. That would be fatal if it happened the same way in the F-16 and F-18 when they get their first person bodies.

I really love the pilots bodies but this kills the immersion.

Edited January 3, 2023 by Apache 64

[Nealius]

On 1/4/2023 at 3:34 AM, Flappie said:

I agree with you. Devs don't. I can't help, sorry.

Dev's should probably have consideration for their customers.

Edited January 6, 2023 by Nealius

[ataribaby]

It is extremely annoying in VR. It should be in line with other modules pilot bodies please.

[Shadok]

At first I thought it was a bug, and I was waiting for it to be removed. Reading this topic, I learn that it is a "feature". I think that developers should leave the choice to make the head appear or not rather than make "innovations" that remains very subjective.

[Voodooflies]

+1 to this.

[hannibal]

i agree as well. no head should be visible when in VR using cockpit body...

its annoying to have any obstructions or artifacting in your view during VR when looking anywhere, even if 180, 360

[Schlomo1933]

+1 remove the head in 1st person view. It’s ridiculous to get blocked by a 2nd hmd…

[Tepnox]

Late to the party but I also +1 that the head gets removed and gets in line with the other DCS modules.

It is kind of annoying that every DCS module has it's own inconsistency or "design decisions" - there should be a baseline and standard for each module, especially the Eagle Dynamics modules!

Please make it happen and possibly give more power to the users itself via a separate option in the specials tab!

[aaronwhite]

This is usually why I fly without the pilot body.

The little bit of realism isn't worth the moments where you get removed from it, since the pilot's body can't really move like your real body would.

In real life, you aren't easily checking over your shoulder to the degree that you can in game without first bending at the waist, or at at least pivoting your back a bit. Real pilots are reaching to pull themselves around to look behind them often, but in game, your pilot body stays anchored to the seat in the casual seated position.

Makes sense, since that would be a lot of animation work to get a pilot that realistically moves the upper body around, but the ability to float outside of my head just has me turning it off to avoid it.

[zaelu]

Probably this is rather known or observed but I think it should be fixed sooner or acknowledged.

Currently when pilot body is enabled in 1st person view especially in VR when the view translates a little off center by means of 6DoF movements the head of the pilot/CPG re-appears and creates either a disturbing situation or simply blocks view and breaks immersion.

I think the problem is caused by the existence of either a 3d invisible sphere that sets a boundary or a distance from center value of camera position that when passed over makes the head reappear. The purpose of this effect is probably to ensure the head is visible from external view but I think this distance or boundary is set to be way way to small and creates this undesirable effect.

On Top of that because of how the CPG body position in relation with default camera (body to the right camera in dead center of his cockpit) this effect is more pronounced in CPG station appearing almost continuously even after joining the cockpit due to some (rather nice) animation of the CPG finding a little his place in the seat.