Many servers, few players?

[Shadow86]

1 hour ago, SharpeXB said:

Except that other people are using it to taxi on  

The same real world reasons not to take off from the taxiway apply to a game. Again I’m not really sure how crashing into each other is “fun”

As MAXsenna said, ATC issue, and you can run into similar things on the runways proper. Whether it's someone landing on your face, taking off in the opposite direction, crossing the runway or simply entering it at a different point.

[SharpeXB]

12 minutes ago, Shadow86 said:

As MAXsenna said, ATC issue, and you can run into similar things on the runways proper. Whether it's someone landing on your face, taking off in the opposite direction, crossing the runway or simply entering it at a different point.

Yeah but we’re talking about people just blasting off down the taxiways. This type of player isn’t going to use ATC regardless of whether it’s improved or not. 

[Raisuli]

30 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

Just curious if there’s anyone who doesn’t know what a runway is….

Knowing what something is and knowing how to use it aren't quite the same thing, particularly in a game where the population density and consequences are greatly reduced.  There's a reason pilots (and drivers) need licenses 

Not saying you're wrong, but just because something is easy, and obvious, for one person doesn't make it easy or obvious. 

I'm not a pilot, and I keep learning things people take for granted around here...  I still remember having to do some trig to figure out what altitude I should be at what distance from the runway (and I'm still almost always high or low), and how to calculate TOD (because why not roll inverted, or just push, and go straight down?).  I kind-of understand departure and approach plates just from looking at them so much, but actually following one?  HA!

Case III?  You want me to what on which radial at who distance?  And be at some certain point on a map when?  HAHAHAhahahaha! 

[SharpeXB]

1 minute ago, Raisuli said:

Knowing what something is and knowing how to use it aren't quite the same thing, particularly in a game where the population density and consequences are greatly reduced.

Ok I’m sure there are people in the world who don’t even know what an airplane is but those people don’t own gaming PCs. “How” to use a runway is self explanatory. 
 

Honestly I don’t personally see this behavior go on much because I play on servers where it’s against the rules or where deterrents are in place like barriers on the taxiways. But it’s the need to even have these rules or barriers that makes me groan or laugh. And I still see wrecks all over the field where people are trying to take off and ignoring the barriers. 

[MAXsenna]

Anyone can make mistakes. Even Air France's best pilots. Just re-watched the Mayday episode.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_France_Flight_296Q

 

[Hotdognz]

8 hours ago, Rebel28 said:

There are times some may not want to stick to what’s real. At one time a server was up using the Nevada map. On this server the owner had placed a carrier near the Hoover dam. Was this realistic, NO. But it sure did lead to a lot of fun with friends to see who had the talent. The carrier was on a slight angle making the approach a real challenge. The takeoffs facing the dam and having to go under the bridge was also strange. This lead to having a fun time as we made many failed attempts.

Sometimes you just need to have fun. If not you are just getting old.

That sounds like a fun time, im going to recreate that mission for our pub crawl night on my server, Im going to even block the runways at Nellis so they players have to use the taxi way .

[dankmaster]

Yes, mistakes happen both in DCS and in real life.  Yes, you can land on a taxiway if the runways are destroyed and/or blocked and there's no other choice.

The discussion moving to trivial edge cases suggests we have consensus on what is a taxiway vs runway 

[Slippa]

On what runway and in which direction? Using a MP server earlier, with all of us making simple mistakes but while trying to be sensible we still ended up taking off or landing from opposing ends of the runway. Some heading off to another runway altogether. Thankfully, everyone was cool about it and we were chuckling away at most of our attempts at ‘training’. Had a blast, literally. Had my first blue on blue mistake with much apologising too. All good.

I’m not sure how to tell which way I should be heading out from, unless briefed? When I landed on a taxiway before I had to try and land as best I could, a wonder I didn’t snap it everywhere. Loads of servers empty still tonight.

Edited July 19, 2023 by Slippa
Typo

[MAXsenna]

10 minutes ago, Slippa said:

On what runway and in which direction? Using a MP server earlier, with all of us making simple mistakes but while trying to be sensible we still ended up taking off or landing from opposing ends of the runway. Some heading off to another runway altogether. Thankfully, everyone was cool about it and we we’re chuckling away at most of our attempts at ‘training’. Had a blast, literally. Had my first blue on blue mistake with much apologising too. All good.

I’m not sure how to tell which way I should be heading out from, unless briefed? When I landed on a taxiway before I had to try and land as best I could, a wonder I didn’t snap it everywhere. Loads of servers empty still tonight.

No one uses the in game ATC, even if it's quite basic? 

[Slippa]

7 minutes ago, MAXsenna said:

No one uses the in game ATC, even if it's quite basic? 

Oh, sorry. I meant by just looking. 

[[HOUNDS] CptTrips]

45 minutes ago, 4eyes said:

An Enigma type campaign server is badly needed for WWII.

 

I would love that.  There are a lot of roadblocks to WWII though. 

The plane-set has a lot of gaps.

The AI asset pack has a lot of gaps.

You not only have to buy a WWII map, but you must also buy the asset pack for an additional cost.  That made sense at one point, but at this point the WWII asset should have been folded into the base game or should come with any WWII map or plane purchase .  Having to buy airplanes and WWII maps is reasonable.

 

I really think WWII would be a productive genre for ED.  They dominate modern and helo.  WWII is still green fields for them.

The airplanes lack electronics so should be easier to develop.

There should be plenty of documentation available with little chance of security concerns unlike modern stuff.

ED dominates modern and helo.  Surly that market reaching saturation. They DO NOT yet dominate WWII market so there are a lot of players filling that need elsewhere.  Why not lure those to your ecosystem .  A still untapped market for ED.  Provide a better WWII product and you have an army of ready-made customers.

Once in your ecosystem for WWII, who knows what else they might decide to buy on a seasonal sale?

$0.02.

 

 

 

 

Edited August 12, 2023 by [16AGR] CptTrips

[SharpeXB]

6 hours ago, 4eyes said:

There are very few servers, some that have been around a long time, that include the A4-e Skyhawk? 

If people want more players, then why exempt one of the most popular aircraft from the available aircraft list?

Because you’d probably have to own this mod to join, I imagine that’s how it works. Many people do not want to mess around with mods. 

[SharpeXB]

18 minutes ago, 4eyes said:

 

It's free and a better aircraft than some of the payware!

Yeah but mods are a pain to deal with and can cause problems.

[SharpeXB]

1 hour ago, 4eyes said:

I agree.  Most are. Plus, too many times they are not updated. 

But I think the A4-e has proven itself.  

But the A-4 is still a mod and subject to the same concerns. It isn’t reasonable to expect all the players who frequent a server to install mods. 

[Hiob]

It is unreasonable to question any outfit and/or rules of a server, given that they are privatly operated by enthusiasts who can and will do as they please - and are entitled to, because they don’t charge you. Pretty simple concept actually.

[Cab]

1 hour ago, Hiob said:

It is unreasonable to question any outfit and/or rules of a server, given that they are privatly operated by enthusiasts who can and will do as they please - and are entitled to, because they don’t charge you. Pretty simple concept actually.

Exactly

Plus, server admins can set it up so that players do NOT have to install a mod in order to log into the server. In the case of the A-4E, a player without the mod will just see an Su-27 rather than an A-4E.

[Maverick87Shaka]

4 hours ago, Cab said:

Exactly

Plus, server admins can set it up so that players do NOT have to install a mod in order to log into the server. In the case of the A-4E, a player without the mod will just see an Su-27 rather than an A-4E.

That basically it's the worst choice that a server admin can make in my honest opinion.
It's a workaround for a current DCS mod limitation, but it will ruin everyone experience, and also open the door for potential IC tamping attempt.

[Cab]

2 minutes ago, Maverick87Shaka said:

That basically it's the worst choice that a server admin can make in my honest opinion.
It's a workaround for a current DCS mod limitation, but it will ruin everyone experience, and also open the door for potential IC tamping attempt.

Not really. Enigma’s Cold War server does exactly that and is one of the most popular servers

[Maverick87Shaka]

2 minutes ago, Cab said:

Not really. Enigma’s Cold War server does exactly that and is one of the most popular servers

It doesn't mean that doesn't face issue due to this decision, as well is not immune by IC tampering attempt.

[Cab]

18 minutes ago, Maverick87Shaka said:

It doesn't mean that doesn't face issue due to this decision, as well is not immune by IC tampering attempt.

Sure. But I was disagreeing with your comment about it being the worst choice. Obviously the players frequenting that server don’t think so. 

[Maverick87Shaka]

On 8/13/2023 at 5:32 PM, Cab said:

Sure. But I was disagreeing with your comment about it being the worst choice. Obviously the players frequenting that server don’t think so. 

Players most of the time are not really aware of what happens behind the scene, and they also are not supposed to be.
From my prospective it's responsibility of the server owner, especially in a PvP environment, try to guarantee a fair play on their own server.

Take the decision to use a MOD, using the workaround to editing .miz file to don't make it "required", simply kick in too many risk, at least for me, as I said.

BTW. A-4 is an amazing MOD and it's clear that people love it, I'm not making any critics to the A-4 mod itself that is brilliant, but the way that is "hosted" sometimes since may have some drawbacks.
 

Edited August 16, 2023 by Maverick87Shaka

[MAXsenna]

Because you’d probably have to own this mod to join, I imagine that’s how it works. Many people do not want to mess around with mods. 

Well, technically it's free, so have to have it, not own it.
Now, if the server operator/mission designer wants to, they can exclude that it's mandatory to have it installed to join the server. But it will look as an Su-27, if you don't.
To be honest, this is a free module everyone should have installed anyway, as they're missing out if you're into cold war anyway.
Mess around, reading this forum there are more difficult stuff with the core compared to download a single file and unzip it into Saved Games in any case.


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It's free and a better aircraft than some of the payware!

Amen!

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Yeah but mods are a pain to deal with and can cause problems.

It's not a mod.

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That basically it's the worst choice that a server admin can make in my honest opinion.
It's a workaround for a current DCS mod limitation, but it will ruin everyone experience, and also open the door for potential IC tamping attempt.

Not everyone. Only those that didn't put in the effort to install it. Which can be easier than installing DCS itself. Reading some posts today.

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[SharpeXB]

41 minutes ago, MAXsenna said:

if the server operator/mission designer wants to, they can exclude that it's mandatory to have it installed to join the server. But it will look as an Su-27, if you don't.

That’s a rather silly solution. These aircraft don’t have the same flight model or weapons. How does that make sense?

43 minutes ago, MAXsenna said:

To be honest, this is a free module everyone should have installed anyway

No because it’s an unofficial mod and any of these can cause stability problems and interfere with troubleshooting etc. Not worth dealing with. It’s easy to understand why many severs don’t have these. 

19 hours ago, 4eyes said:

 

It's free and a better aircraft than some of the payware!

It’s ridiculous that people put so much effort into creating this as an unofficial mod when they probably could have made it official DLC. Likely they just weren’t savvy enough to figure that out. 

[Baldrick33]

19 minutes ago, SharpeXB said:

No because it’s an unofficial mod and any of these can cause stability problems and interfere with troubleshooting etc. Not worth dealing with. It’s easy to understand why many severs don’t have these. 

The first thing we get asked when troubleshooting issues is to remove any unofficial mods. I prefer to keep DCS as vanilla as possible. Also mods easily get broken with updates as they don’t get tested by ED prior to release for obvious reasons.

[MAXsenna]

The first thing we get asked when troubleshooting issues is to remove any unofficial mods. I prefer to keep DCS as vanilla as possible. Also mods easily get broken with updates as they don’t get tested by ED prior to release for obvious reasons.

That's your prerogative. The assumption here is that the Enigma server is very popular and have incorporated this free community module. It's not a modification of any kind.
Use mod manager, and it can be applied/removed in seconds.
This particular one has never given me any grief.

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It’s ridiculous that people put so much effort into creating this as an unofficial mod when they probably could have made it official DLC. Likely they just weren’t savvy enough to figure that out. 

Too many persons involved, who will get paid what for what?
And the licence was too expensive IIRC.
There's another super excellent free community module. They tried to make ED incorporate it in the core. But for some reason, it couldn't be done.

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