How different is the Huey to fly now?

[Gunfreak]

I haven't actually flown the Huey since the big engine change.

I'm no Huey expert. I fly it on semi regular basis and haven't done deep dives into anything. I just fly it and can do the basics.

I've made myself a new Huey mission. But is it now so different I should relearn to fly it?

[UncleStains]

Personally, the only big thing I noticed when the engine model changed is I no longer have to babysit the exhaust gas temperature. With the new model, a lot of people have had trouble popping the rotor off when exceeding the torque limit. Keeping torque (mostly) below the redline and avoiding violent control inputs when near the line have made that a non-issue for me.

I am not a real pilot so I have no idea if the old or new engine model is more realistic, but it's definitely still fun to fly.

[DishDoggie]

As you I am no Expert. Some people here have added Very good Facts backed up with data. As for me a long time Huey flying Fan I think and feel the Tail Rotor Pedals input needs more work. and the only other thing I can add is something seams to be wrong at the point of forward movement transition to a zero forward movement hover. I feel the lift or ballooning effect at this point is wrong and then the other problem of total loss of all lift at this point as you fall in a flat spin to the ground but get no crash but go into a hover on ground effect. It is a strange and unique event others admitted having and I honestly do not know how or what will trigger this problem. It is almost like a Downdraft altitude loss I experienced in the USAF riding in cargo planes going TDY from place to place.The last fix came out and has the Collective and throttle dialed in better.

[Grievo]

On 7/6/2023 at 4:20 PM, DishDoggie said:

I feel the lift or ballooning effect at this point is wrong and then the other problem of total loss of all lift at this point as you fall in a flat spin to the ground but get no crash but go into a hover on ground effect.

Hey DishDoggie.

I've not tried the new Huey yet, and I've not flown a real one, but have flown Bell 47's, 206's etc.

Forgive me if I'm teaching you to suck eggs, but when transitioning from the hover to forward flight, there is a distinct phase of the transition called "flapback" which could be the ballooning you describe. This is a real thing and will happen in any machine to my knowledge, and it requires a very positive forward push on the cyclic. It's caused by the change of airflow through the disc as you start moving forward.

Also, during the transition, particularly at heavy weights, or on uneven surfaces, you can sort of "fall off" the cushion that is the ground effect, usually though you're either into or just about to hit translational lift, and that reduces the power required and you can climb away.

I hope that sheds some light anyway.

[DishDoggie]

7 hours ago, Grievo said:

Hey DishDoggie.

I've not tried the new Huey yet, and I've not flown a real one, but have flown Bell 47's, 206's etc.

Forgive me if I'm teaching you to suck eggs, but when transitioning from the hover to forward flight, there is a distinct phase of the transition called "flapback" which could be the ballooning you describe. This is a real thing and will happen in any machine to my knowledge, and it requires a very positive forward push on the cyclic. It's caused by the change of airflow through the disc as you start moving forward.

Also, during the transition, particularly at heavy weights, or on uneven surfaces, you can sort of "fall off" the cushion that is the ground effect, usually though you're either into or just about to hit translational lift, and that reduces the power required and you can climb away.

I hope that sheds some light anyway.

LOL I'm 67 years old and I can't remember the last time I Sucked Eggs but I know I have done it in my long life time. Thank you for the Fetchins Up. Try the New Huey to see what I am trying to Communicate with the Balloon effect. The only point I was trying to make was it feels over the top as in to much effect but I am like you and Have never Piloted a real Huey. Thank You for the Help and advice.

[Gunfreak]

Well tried it today, and I had a very hard time controlling it, either it plummeted or it shot into the air.

[Dogmanbird]

I found the huey can now cruise about 15 knots faster, lifts more easily, but as dishdoggie mentioned, the tail rotor has less influence. I'd imagine folk flying with a regular length joystick would now find flying a bit harder

I haven't seen any report of how accurate the new model is. If it is more accurate, I'm happy to keep it as is, but if it's introduced unrealistic behavior's then I hope it gets fixed

Edited August 6, 2023 by Dogmanbird

[Nealius]

A lot more power but a lot more torque. My left foot gets worn out a lot quicker now.

[scorpion80]

Now Huey is a Vietnam'copter with the F18 engine... and the consumption too..

 

Thanks to ED for ruining one of the few good modules done from' em (ah, no.. Bellsim did it)

Edited August 7, 2023 by scorpion80

[CHPL]

The Cyclic control feels more realistic, but the paddles are totally off-limits.
In DCS, there is also a general tendency to overstretch things like settling with power or vortex ring state, which leads to several unexpected crashes during the landing, even with forward speed. 
More power is also not noticeable in any flight conditions.
So when it comes to power settings, there is still a lot of work to do. Torque has strange indications, TOT as well.
Also, many things are broken now. Engine start, for example. You need to hold the starter button only to about 15%, then the engine is running by itself, which is not correct.
There is still no needle split when you close the throttle during flight to ground idle. 
Even if you switch off the fuel pump, RPM remains until you lower collective, and after 2 or 3 seconds, you get the needle split. 
If something breaks during flight, the chances to bring the aircraft to the ground safely are now close to zero.

So the possibility to use the old flight model is very appreciated. For me personally, it is hard to understand why the new flight model, with all its obvious flaws, is even in the beta for testing. But the fact that it is the Beta needs to be reminded, and there may be a reason we do not know.

[Lasko]

On 8/14/2023 at 6:57 AM, CHPL said:

So the possibility to use the old flight model is very appreciated. For me personally, it is hard to understand why the new flight model, with all its obvious flaws, is even in the beta for testing. But the fact that it is the Beta needs to be reminded, and there may be a reason we do not know.

I too am grateful that the old engine model is still in the game by editing the FMOptions file.  After the last update I forgot to change it, and decided to try it out again for a while.  It seems awful compared to the old model, lurching about like a drunk on Bourbon Street.  Lift off, then use aggressive right pedal, jam the collective down or you shoot up 300 feet.  Slowing down get ready to go full left pedal and yank the collective back up.  It just seems terrible.  I hope the real Huey doesn't fly like this and eventually it will get straightened out.  

[CHPL]

Am 13.4.2024 um 06:32 schrieb Lasko:

I too am grateful that the old engine model is still in the game by editing the FMOptions file.  After the last update I forgot to change it, and decided to try it out again for a while.  It seems awful compared to the old model, lurching about like a drunk on Bourbon Street.  Lift off, then use aggressive right pedal, jam the collective down or you shoot up 300 feet.  Slowing down get ready to go full left pedal and yank the collective back up.  It just seems terrible.  I hope the real Huey doesn't fly like this and eventually it will get straightened out.  

Unfortunately, because it is a helicopter, we need to be patient. Don't expect any change soon or in 2024.  

[sorcer3r]

is the EGT still modeled?

I see Uh-1 clients in MP flying with crazy speeds.

[jpuk]

2 hours ago, sorcer3r said:

is the EGT still modeled?

I see Uh-1 clients in MP flying with crazy speeds.

Not sure about EGT, but the new FM is unfortunately out of reality regarding maximum flight speed.

[CLM]

I wanted to address earlier, but nevertheless here is my question: 

Since a year or maybe 2, the flight characteristics have changed to -in my opinion- a less realistic controllability. When I started to fly the DCS huey, it sure felt accurate. That was around the end of the year 2021. My non-virtual background is a helo pilot and also a couple of hours in the actual UH-1

Are there any fellow DCS Huey pilots who are experiencing the same? Or is it just me?

[DishDoggie]

4 hours ago, CLM said:

I wanted to address earlier, but nevertheless here is my question: 

Since a year or maybe 2, the flight characteristics have changed to -in my opinion- a less realistic controllability. When I started to fly the DCS huey, it sure felt accurate. That was around the end of the year 2021. My non-virtual background is a helo pilot and also a couple of hours in the actual UH-1

Are there any fellow DCS Huey pilots who are experiencing the same? Or is it just me?

I am not a Pilot I fly the Uh-1h all the time from my start in DCS to me all the changes are in the Tail rotor and Engine and Vortex ring state. To me the Cyclic feels the same but because of the Engine changes the Collective is affected. I might be wrong but Ground effect use to be different too but for some reason I keep telling myself I don't know what I'm talking about because All my gear has changed through the years to way better gear and that is the reason I think it was different. But in the back of my head when first entering into ground effect in landing was different. The same could be said about takeoff in a rolling moving forward low to the tarmac as you first go into the lift state(can not remember the official name for it sorry) in the past didn't it take longer to get the lift? Not sure how much is right or wrong with my thinking but you asked a Good Question.

[TonyRS]

On 4/13/2024 at 5:32 AM, Lasko said:

I too am grateful that the old engine model is still in the game by editing the FMOptions file.  After the last update I forgot to change it, and decided to try it out again for a while.  It seems awful compared to the old model, lurching about like a drunk on Bourbon Street.  Lift off, then use aggressive right pedal, jam the collective down or you shoot up 300 feet.  Slowing down get ready to go full left pedal and yank the collective back up.  It just seems terrible.  I hope the real Huey doesn't fly like this and eventually it will get straightened out.  

Wow! Thanks for the tip Back to the old FM & enjoying flying my Huey again
 

[Yurgon]

9 hours ago, CLM said:

Since a year or maybe 2, the flight characteristics have changed to -in my opinion- a less realistic controllability.

With a purely virtual flying background, I can only compare the old and the current Huey flight models and contrast both of them to the other DCS helicopters. The currently required power pedal on takeoff seems excessive compared to the old Huey FM and also compared to all other DCS helicopters. The Huey will now gladly fly quite a bit faster than it used to, which may or may not be a correct representation of the real helicopter.

From what I read here on the forum it sounds like there was an update to the engine model which was in itself a good update, but fails to take some other factors into account, meaning that the overall feel of the current Huey FM is at least as unrealistic as the old one was, just in another way. Best I can tell, the current FM is stuck between half-implemented features.

I can get used to it, it just feels odd having to put in so much left pedal on takeoff.

[Volator]

Yes, too much left pedal required with the new FM, plus speed is now excessively high (according to a German Army Huey pilot they used to cruise around 90 kts in the Huey) and the torque behaves in a strange way. Somebody with obviously a lot of knowledge showed that the old FM was underpowered and that the new FM was more spot on but didn't take some factors for the rotor blades into account IIRC. I tend to take the old FM as the significantly better one and consider my Huey as if it was carrying some payload (which it actually doesn't according to the loadout screen), which then corresponds to what we have right now with the old FM and what feels more plausible. First action for me after a DCS update is always to go back to the old Huey FM.

[Dogmanbird]

Has there been a change to the flight model in just the last week? I seem to need even more left pedal with the newer FM than before, particularly at take off (have checked controller inputs etc)

[Daemoc]

On 5/11/2024 at 11:20 AM, Dogmanbird said:

Has there been a change to the flight model in just the last week? I seem to need even more left pedal with the newer FM than before, particularly at take off (have checked controller inputs etc)

I don't think there have been any recent changes. I have been using the new flight model since it was implemented and I have not noticed anything new.

One thing to note, you have a lot more power available with the new engine. If you are heavy, the main rotor torque will overpower the available tail rotor. Especially if you do not baby the collective.

I should also note, I am not saying there is nothing wrong with the flight model, just my experience with it.

[Richard Dastardly]

Flew it yesterday for the first time in a long time, at full load it does need a hefty amount of boot to stay straight on liftoff but I've not tried a lesser load yet. Seems ridiculously fast, though - I don't know what the precise Vne for this model is but I'm quite sure I was constantly above it with torque to spare ( very heavy, too ). It does at least feel heavier than I remember, that's a good thing.