waiting for resolution RAZBAM Situation Post Archive (will be deleted)

[Rainmaker]

24 minutes ago, NineLine said:

I stand by what I said already. It's not for us to debate but for the management teams to solve, and nothing here is as easy as it seems.

That’s fine. Those were rhetorical questions anyway. Or maybe ones for the consumer to be asking themselves. 

As for me….don’t worry….I’m looking right past ya.

[BigBorner]

54 minutes ago, NineLine said:

I stand by what I said already. It's not for us to debate but for the management teams to solve, and nothing here is as easy as it seems.

Understandable. 
 

But would it be possible to make a statement that if one  „waits it out“ and only request a refund once a official statement is made that, indeed, the F-15E will be abandoned by razbam and not being taken over by ED - that this refund request will be accepted and thus a refund will be made? Idc if it’s store credits or not. 

[NineLine]

6 minutes ago, BigBorner said:

Understandable. 
 

But would it be possible to make a statement that if one  „waits it out“ and only request a refund once a official statement is made that, indeed, the F-15E will be abandoned by razbam and not being taken over by ED - that this refund request will be accepted and thus a refund will be made? Idc if it’s store credits or not. 

Sadly the negotiations are at a point we cannot comment on, our goal remains to get everything back to normal or as close to it as possible. 

[Oban]

4 minutes ago, BigBorner said:

Understandable. 
 

But would it be possible to make a statement that if one  „waits it out“ and only request a refund once a official statement is made that, indeed, the F-15E will be abandoned by razbam and not being taken over by ED - that this refund request will be accepted and thus a refund will be made? Idc if it’s store credits or not. 

I think you're looking at the wrong person for making such statements, any sort of refunds would need to be authorised through Eagle Dynamics management, more than likely from Nick Grey himself, and I honestly don't think he would make such a statement whilst negotiations are allegedly still ongoing.

I believe there's nothing stopping you from requesting a refund through the support page as it is, as quite a few people have had their request for refund granted according tp several facebook groups

[Citizen]

I cannot express how important the next week, days, and hours are to the brand.

[falcon_120]

I cannot express how important the next week, days, and hours are to the brand.

Enviado desde mi ELE-L29 mediante Tapatalk

[Focha]

Good afternoon,

Seeing that there are no news or updates related to Razbam products, that ED commercializes, I would like to know what my options are as a client, regarding the last product "DCS: F-15E by RAZBAM".

I purchased the product on 17/02/2023, which is still in the minimum 2-year protection guarantee under EU law, for any digital content or digital services turn out to be defective, do not appear as advertised or do not work as expected.

If the provider cannot repair the content or services within a reasonable time, free of charge and without inconvenience to us the client, we may request at least a price reduction.

Until when it is expected that we know, within a reasonable time, what ED will do about this situation?

Thank you for your understanding.

Kind regards.

[Maduce]

1 hour ago, PhantomHans said:

Honestly I am just disappointed with this whole thing.

I have had regrets about buying into DCS since doing it, and this latest flap has certainly only added to that.

 

Personally I'd like to see a few guarantees from Eagle Dynamics:

1. A guarantee that any and all modules, 3rd party or not, will continue to be developed until the core functions of the aircraft are usable.

2. A guarantee that no module will be left, now or in the future, without bug fix support until the end of DCS.

3. Finally, a guarantee that DCS will never become an unplayable, unusable, abandoned game.

 

 

Eagle Dynamics should be able to guarantee us those three things.  No module will be left half functional as it's finished state, no module will ever just stop working because it isn't being patched, and lastly, that when they say "Were done, the authentication servers go offline forever on January 31st, 2068.  Thanks guys it's been a great time!  Adios!" that their last patch makes sure that nothing is broken and we can all make backups and keep playing for as long as we like, revisit for nostalgia, whatever our reason may be, the software that we paid for.

This

[Mike Force Team]

Part of managing customer expectations is providing regular updates.  The lack of "official" updates from either ED or Razbam is frustrating.  We enjoy Razbam's products but will miss their jets should they be removed from ED's website.  The goal should be mutual resolution and a way to move forward together so everyone can enjoy their jets.

Mike Force Team

[AJaromir]

Well, I would like to see in terms of service more rights to own product.

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/legal/terms_of_service.php

Edited June 7, 2024 by AJaromir

[Beirut]

Spudtato seems to have an opinion.

 

 

[IceyJones]

the damage is already done.

ED managed to seed distrust in the viability of the current business concept. when for what reason at all, be it business-related, developer-related, or even disliking between individuals can lead to a product dying before your very eyes, the question is, if buying any module from 3rd parties can be trusted at all..........

and this is not necessary because of that 3rd party.....

there are ONLY losers in this process

- 3rd parties will abandon DCS as a platform (already happening) because of outstanding payments, for whatever reason.

- single, very knowledgeable developers leave DCS totally (already happening)

- ED, because their product becomes less attractive and ppl question the reliability and longevity of the whole product

- Customers, that lose money and products they love

its a dire situation

and that ED keeps selling this now unsupported products, and is not even placing a BIG FAT disclaimer on them, is telling......

[ColinM9991]

9 minutes ago, Beirut said:

Spudtato seems to have an opinion.

 

 

Ah excellent, sensationalism and clickbait headlines. Just what this situation needs.

 

Personally, I think ED should absolutely stop selling the F-15E until both ED and RAZBAM can come to an agreement and when both parties are ready to make a public statement that addresses the future support model for the RAZBAM suite.

If the conclusion is negative and the RAZBAM suite won't be actively supported for breaking changes then all products should be pulled, ultimately, as it's deceiving and disloyal to the customers to continue to charge for products that will inevitably break.

Continuing to sell these, at this point before an agreement has been reached, is only clawing at people's wallets. Additionally, opting for the approach taken with the Hawk where players had to download a specific version of DCS would definitely be clawing at people's wallets no matter what spin is put on it.

Edited June 7, 2024 by ColinM9991

[Beirut]

4 minutes ago, ColinM9991 said:

Ah excellent, sensationalism and clickbait headlines. Just what this situation needs.

 

You noticed the weepy music, did you? 

[salling772]

My thoughts on razbam.

Razbam did something that Breached their 3rd party contract = stop payment

Razbam response stopping support = another breached of contract

Razban publicly airs a narrative = doubles down

Ed put out a statement and stands the line = this is our platform

Razbam devs continue to post their not talking = Ed has decided to show razbam the door

Ed continues to sale razbam modules under contract with razbam = if they pull it it would be a breach in the contract on ed side. Making legal liability to Razbam they will not do that. 

Razbam 3rd party contracts has an abandoned module clause in it. Yes they sign it to get the f-15e out. = ed waiting for that time to expire to implement the clause. 

Razbam statement saying they are working with ed = Razbam is calling but ED not picking up.

If razbam was true where the other 3rd third-party developers support. = we are not going to jeopardize Revenue stream by your actions. By the way thanks by name dropping and jeopardize a new module release.

Conclusion Razbam has shot it own tail off.

Will they land it.

My opinion using my 30 years In runing my own company

Razban is done as a 3rd party developer on the dcs platform. As more 3rd party developers come in and a number of independent moder have a roadmap on becoming official developers ED can let razbam go.

In the early days of dcs when ED needed 3rd party developers and they put up with Razbam behavior.

2017-2018 ED put their foot down and said no new modules until you fix the bugs. Aka the bug website on razbam webpage.

ED will stay Silent as their lawyers are telling them that. Any additional statements will hurt their position. 

Why keep a 3rd party developer that will be an agitator and not a partner. 

What will we see as the end user?

Unfortunately most if not all of razbam modules will break in some form or other on the coming updates. Until Razbam come back ( I think this will not happen) or we will have to wait until ED takes them in house per the abandoned Module clause. That could take years. The ball is in Razbam Court and I see only two options.

1. Razbam start updates (25% change because ego is involved)

2. Razbam Makes the agreement to Separate from dcs and hands their dcs Module development and upkeep to ED. (The dcs module are ED Property as it was made with dcs development software or sdk)

[ColinM9991]

2 minutes ago, Beirut said:

 

You noticed the weepy music, did you? 

I haven't stopped crying since

[afnav130]

1 hour ago, NineLine said:

I stand by what I said already. It's not for us to debate but for the management teams to solve, and nothing here is as easy as it seems.

It literally cannot be more complicated than that. You take a percentage of profit make off of each sale and you send it to the party that made it. Thats pretty f-ing simple. If some issue arose with IP stuff for another module that gets litigated on its own. The payment that is due needs to come in. Now, if they payment has been made then ED is in the clear. 

Again, if it is an IP issue with the A29 for instance, that has zero to do with RB being paid for a module that is licensed, sold and currently in the sim.

A lot of people seem to be doing things to make themselves feel better, vs doing what is best for both companies and the player base. We all get left in the dust. 

This possibly cannot be that hard. We aren't sitting at the table negotiating nukes with rocket man. 

[Beirut]

We need Elon to buy RB. 

[5ephir0th]

Open a ticket and ask for refund, many of us have done it

[AJaromir]

27 minutes ago, IceyJones said:

and that ED keeps selling this now unsupported products, and is not even placing a BIG FAT disclaimer on them, is telling......

RB must withdraw the product. They are the ones who own it and thus decide whether or not it will be sold.

[MAXsenna]

Spudtato seems to have an opinion.
 
 

His own? (Aaand he's an airline pilot now...)

Sent from my SM-A536B using Tapatalk

[BigBorner]

1 hour ago, NineLine said:

Sadly the negotiations are at a point we cannot comment on, our goal remains to get everything back to normal or as close to it as possible. 

Thank you for the answer. 
but, I didn’t want to know about the state of the negotiation. You stated many times that you can’t comment on that, and that’s perfectly fine. 
Considering you stated earlier that ED would prefer that we wait it out until there is a general announcement, I wanted to know if ED will refund me in case the announcement is negativ. I am a bit lost, because appearantly some get refunded, some don’t and I am a bit scared that I will not get refunded because, well, I followed the request that you made - representing ED. 

Sorry for being unclear before. 

[MAXsenna]

We need Elon to buy RB. 

Best suggestion ever!

Xbam

Sent from my SM-A536B using Tapatalk

[Czar66]

40 minutes ago, Beirut said:

Spudtato seems to have an opinion.

 

 

Abhorrent and careless video title.

[AJaromir]

18 minutes ago, Beirut said:

We need Elon to buy RB. 

Really? Should Ponzi really buy ED?