ED Team NineLine Posted January 16, 2015 ED Team Share Posted January 16, 2015 Hmmm, it seems that VEAO has indeed discussed the F-16 and mentioned BMS as a reason. Sounds like it is a very small part at that, and look at their road map, there are many aircraft that come close to others that are planned or released... the 109 is an example, I am sorry... I think its silly to limit yourself based on something done in some other game, and I certainly dont think it has any bearing on ED... Look at Pman's quote... before you get to even the BMS part, they already have enough reason why they wouldnt do it... Pman can correct me, if all other things were not an issue, I doubt they would let any other sim hold them back. Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 ... As a retail product developer, you gotta ask yourself: Why drop a ton of money and time into developing a mouse trap that someone else has been making for nigh on two decades now, well, that continues to be updated and improved upon? As a retail product developer I do it because I know I can do It better and to a higher standard than the other guy can. I also do it because I can see there is a large following for the aircraft just waiting in the wings. Plus I can charge for it whereas the other guy can't. And a company like ED could use it for ANG training contracts here in the US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rrohde Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 I am sorry... I think its silly to limit yourself based on something done in some other game, and I certainly dont think it has any bearing on ED... This. PC: AMD Ryzen 9 5950X | MSI Suprim GeForce 3090 TI | ASUS Prime X570-P | 128GB DDR4 3600 RAM | 2TB Samsung 870 EVO SSD | Win10 Pro 64bit Gear: HP Reverb G2 | JetPad FSE | VKB Gunfighter Pro Mk.III w/ MCG Ultimate VKBcontrollers.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Thanks for finding that cichlidfan. Not that VEAO is the best example because they don't have access to the aircraft in England and they have stated they need access to airframes. VEAO are doing a Typhoon..someone should tell them EF2000 already did it ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rrohde Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 As a retail product developer I do it because I know I can do It better and to a higher standard than the other guy can. I also do it because I can see there is a large following for the aircraft just waiting in the wings. Plus I can charge for it whereas the other guy can't. And a company like ED could use it for ANG training contracts here in the US. Well said. In addition, the F-16 would work well with the A-10 in NTTR scenarios, as one of the main roles of the F-16 these days is "Wild Weasel" (SEAD). PC: AMD Ryzen 9 5950X | MSI Suprim GeForce 3090 TI | ASUS Prime X570-P | 128GB DDR4 3600 RAM | 2TB Samsung 870 EVO SSD | Win10 Pro 64bit Gear: HP Reverb G2 | JetPad FSE | VKB Gunfighter Pro Mk.III w/ MCG Ultimate VKBcontrollers.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rrohde Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 VEAO are doing a Typhoon..someone should tell them EF2000 already did it ;) Perfect example of this strange mindset. ;) PC: AMD Ryzen 9 5950X | MSI Suprim GeForce 3090 TI | ASUS Prime X570-P | 128GB DDR4 3600 RAM | 2TB Samsung 870 EVO SSD | Win10 Pro 64bit Gear: HP Reverb G2 | JetPad FSE | VKB Gunfighter Pro Mk.III w/ MCG Ultimate VKBcontrollers.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kazereal Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 One problem with BMS is that it is in somewhat "grey area": on the other hand it has been rewritten to another simulator entirely, on the other hand it originates as mods and use of leaked sources. So it is something that people with business to handle don't want to risk with. Also the amount of variations in F-16 is a problem for any developer and it is not a simple aircraft to simulate. Having F-16 on DCS would really have many benefits like interacting with all the other modules, various network and hardware support and that it is actively developed and maintained so bugs get fixed and new hardware/software support are added. The cost of such module and potential customers is a question, also access to enough real data might be a problem since it is still being operated by many nations. These are just my opinions on the matter, nothing solid from any developer so take it with caution. "I would have written a shorter post, but I did not have the time." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Also the amount of variations in F-16 is a problem for any developer and it is not a simple aircraft to simulate.. This is true there are a lot of flavors. But as long as DCS picked one and stuck with it I'd be just fine with that. But even better would be they offer a pack of aircraft like the c101 release. That's beyond hoping though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invisibull Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Two weeks ago I installed BMS. I had been a huge fan of Falcon 4 for years, but once i ran it, the graphics just took my head out of it instantly. I have a very hard time believing that a DCS: F-16 running on EDGE would have any problem at all in making BMS instantly obsolete. i9 9900k - GTX 2080 Ti - MSI Z87 GD65 Mobo - 64GB HyperX Predator RGB DDR4 3200MHz - Win10 64 bit - TM Warthog w FSSB R3 mod - TrackIr 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Two weeks ago I installed BMS. I had been a huge fan of Falcon 4 for years, but once i ran it, the graphics just took my head out of it instantly. I have a very hard time believing that a DCS: F-16 running on EDGE would have any problem at all in making BMS instantly obsolete. 100% agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rrohde Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Two weeks ago I installed BMS. I had been a huge fan of Falcon 4 for years, but once i ran it, the graphics just took my head out of it instantly. I have a very hard time believing that a DCS: F-16 running on EDGE would have any problem at all in making BMS instantly obsolete. I agree. Yet some people would argue with you about the "Dynamic Campaign" that BMS offers -- and DCS doesn't. :) PC: AMD Ryzen 9 5950X | MSI Suprim GeForce 3090 TI | ASUS Prime X570-P | 128GB DDR4 3600 RAM | 2TB Samsung 870 EVO SSD | Win10 Pro 64bit Gear: HP Reverb G2 | JetPad FSE | VKB Gunfighter Pro Mk.III w/ MCG Ultimate VKBcontrollers.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted January 16, 2015 ED Team Share Posted January 16, 2015 I agree. Yet some people would argue with you about the "Dynamic Campaign" that BMS offers -- and DCS doesn't. :) I dont want this to turn into a DCS vs BMS thread, I am not saying DCS F-16 would kill off any other sim, I am only saying that DCS F-16 would sell regardless of what else is out there... Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 I dont want this to turn into a DCS vs BMS thread, I am not saying DCS F-16 would kill off any other sim, I am only saying that DCS F-16 would sell regardless of what else is out there... I think people would still play both sims. They would would offer two different experiences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erdem Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 I'd say that ED has a list of "not allowed for third parties" aircraft list somewhere. The popularity of such a module would be so much that it's probably a good idea to secure it for the company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlidfan Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 ... I am only saying that DCS F-16 would sell regardless of what else is out there... Yet ED chose to do an F-18. ASUS ROG Maximus VIII Hero, i7-6700K, Noctua NH-D14 Cooler, Crucial 32GB DDR4 2133, Samsung 950 Pro NVMe 256GB, Samsung EVO 250GB & 500GB SSD, 2TB Caviar Black, Zotac GTX 1080 AMP! Extreme 8GB, Corsair HX1000i, Phillips BDM4065UC 40" 4k monitor, VX2258 TouchScreen, TIR 5 w/ProClip, TM Warthog, VKB Gladiator Pro, Saitek X56, et. al., MFG Crosswind Pedals #1199, VolairSim Pit, Rift CV1 :thumbup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted January 16, 2015 ED Team Share Posted January 16, 2015 Yet ED chose to do an F-18. Which means nothing... F-18 is a proven seller as well. Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBlemmen Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 I would totally play DCS F16 becouse it would mean fully clickable cockpit wich bms doesnt have) , much better keybinding and better trackir.. but i also dont see it coming to DCS anytime soon , and as long as the F18 doesnt get canceled i'm totally fine with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcbak Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Has a poll ever been taken regarding this question? I can't imagine who wouldn't buy it. Falcon, as successful as it was/is, is graphically outdated. How many people fly the F15C only wishing that the sim had the same fidelity as the A10C or any of the other recent releases? A Western/NATO, SEAD capable aircraft is needed in this sim environment. It doesn't seem like the F18 release is near. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]WIN 10, i7 10700, 32GB DDR4, RTX 2080 Super, Crucial 1TB SSD, Samsung EVO 850 500GB SSD, TM Warthog with 10cm extension, TIR5, MFG Crosswind Pedals, Wheelstand Pro, LG 40" 4K TV, Razer Black Widow Ultimate KB[/size] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boberro Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 F-16 in DCS would bring BMS users too so it is not mouse trap. F-16 in DCS would be felt differently - cmon, BMS graphics SUCK BALLS as many other things in BMS which are important. Some 3rd party or ED should have enough big cojones to do the job. Reminder: Fighter pilots make movies. Bomber pilots make... HISTORY! :D | Also to be remembered: FRENCH TANKS HAVE ONE GEAR FORWARD AND FIVE BACKWARD :D ಠ_ಠ ツ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlidfan Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Has a poll ever been taken regarding this question? To what end? The forum is not a representative sample of the market. ASUS ROG Maximus VIII Hero, i7-6700K, Noctua NH-D14 Cooler, Crucial 32GB DDR4 2133, Samsung 950 Pro NVMe 256GB, Samsung EVO 250GB & 500GB SSD, 2TB Caviar Black, Zotac GTX 1080 AMP! Extreme 8GB, Corsair HX1000i, Phillips BDM4065UC 40" 4k monitor, VX2258 TouchScreen, TIR 5 w/ProClip, TM Warthog, VKB Gladiator Pro, Saitek X56, et. al., MFG Crosswind Pedals #1199, VolairSim Pit, Rift CV1 :thumbup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver_Dragon Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 chit-chat discussion..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sobek Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 (edited) Look at Pman's quote... before you get to even the BMS part, they already have enough reason why they wouldnt do it... Pman can correct me, if all other things were not an issue, I doubt they would let any other sim hold them back. It is simply a question of risk management. Why do something somebody else does well currently when there are other options that are equally attractive to customers? There's no good reason. Edit: It's not a question of getting held back. About equally as much ground has to be covered technology wise for the Hornet as for the Viper, but the Hornet isn't featured on any level comparable to what DCS currently does, so the chances on recouping on all the features that need to be developed is much higher. Doing the Hornet now lays some groundwork, so once that is done it may suddenly tip the scale for the feasibility of a Viper. ... why drop half a million dollars US into a simulation that's already been completely covered and well-built by another developer, and is still wildly popular in the sim community, and... enjoyed by the same people who also enjoy DCS? You think half a million dollars will give you a DCS F-16C-whatever? LOL. That's 5 man years for reasonably well trained engineers. Try tripple that and you may be approaching the ballpark. As for everything else you said, ACK. Edited January 16, 2015 by sobek Good, fast, cheap. Choose any two. Come let's eat grandpa! Use punctuation, save lives! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cichlidfan Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 It is simply a question of risk management. Why do something somebody else does well currently when there are other options that are equally attractive to customers? There's no good reason. Exactly. ASUS ROG Maximus VIII Hero, i7-6700K, Noctua NH-D14 Cooler, Crucial 32GB DDR4 2133, Samsung 950 Pro NVMe 256GB, Samsung EVO 250GB & 500GB SSD, 2TB Caviar Black, Zotac GTX 1080 AMP! Extreme 8GB, Corsair HX1000i, Phillips BDM4065UC 40" 4k monitor, VX2258 TouchScreen, TIR 5 w/ProClip, TM Warthog, VKB Gladiator Pro, Saitek X56, et. al., MFG Crosswind Pedals #1199, VolairSim Pit, Rift CV1 :thumbup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PLP Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 I'm not sure the F18 excludes the F16, on the contrary I would assume that making the second one would be much less effort. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sobek Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 I'm not sure the F18 excludes the F16, on the contrary I would assume that making the second one would be much less effort. Possibly, yes. But you gotta start somewhere. Good, fast, cheap. Choose any two. Come let's eat grandpa! Use punctuation, save lives! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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