I need to learn to fly...

[159th_Viper]

Well it wasn't supposed to be a wind up or tongue in cheek, I just can't get this product to work and I didn't really know anything about it. Ok so it's just me, I used to fly this aircraft in IL2 Sturmovik and thought that is was going to be the same. Alright I must have sounded very stupid but I thought it was broke because it was nothing like IL2...Oh well

 

Mizzy

 

I lost count how many times I argued with Yo-Yo in testing saying the plane is unflyable and broken.........

 

I lost every single one of them.

Edited September 30, 2013 by 159th_Viper
Bloody IPhone

[VH-Rock]

Well it wasn't supposed to be a wind up or tongue in cheek, I just can't get this product to work and I didn't really know anything about it. Ok so it's just me, I used to fly this aircraft in IL2 Sturmovik and thought that is was going to be the same. Alright I must have sounded very stupid but I thought it was broke because it was nothing like IL2...Oh well

 

Mizzy

 

Mizzy, if you fly online, head into the Virtual Aerobatics Server that myself and Pman run. If you join the server and join TS, there's normally someone around that will be willing to help you get started flying any aircraft in DCS. :)

[Tucano_uy]

Mizzy, if you're crashing on take off, you're most probably making the same mistakes that I (and probably many of us) did at the beginning. Those might be:

 

A) TRIM FOR TAKE OFF: If there's no wind, you should trim rudder about 5-6 degrees to the right to compensate for torque. That and smooth throttle increase is enough for an almost hands free take off.

If there's wind, factor it and compensate accordingly.

 

B) This was my biggest mistake and took me a while to realize and fix it. Don't get airborne as soon as the airplane starts to get lift, it may seem that it "wants" to fly but it's not ready yet. Lower your nose a LITTLE BIT and keep it running on the runway until you have enough speed (about 130mph) to get airborne safely. Chances are that you're stalling it as soon as you take off. A wing will drop. The controls are super sensitive and overcompensating at low altitudes will kill you.

 

Hope it helps.

 

 

I actually love posts like your thread opening one. If you really love flying and are persistent enough, surely in 15 days you'll post back with a completely different point of view.

 

We have all been there. In fact I found nowadays that ED did "something" to the Mustang, as it is very difficult for me to reproduce those disastrous take off attempts and engine blowns of my first days. (Are u sure ED you didn't do anything to the engine? mine use to blow up just after passing the upwind threshold if the radiators weren't set properly. Not anymore)

[Tengah]

Occulus Rift is a real neat bit of hardware... Only one problem... I cant see where my mug of tea is and Ooops... What keyboard button did I press? Wait..> Was that the keyboard? Wheres my keyboard... O.o

[element1108]

Occulus Rift is a real neat bit of hardware... Only one problem... I cant see where my mug of tea is and Ooops... What keyboard button did I press? Wait..> Was that the keyboard? Wheres my keyboard... O.o

 

Find your home keys and go by touch. The rift is so damn immersive you won't give a rats a$$ about your keyboard or it's functionality ;).

 

As for the pony...ya never consider all flight sims equal...but can't put you down for not knowing...enjoy the learning curve...it's the best part of flight sims...getting the little things down.

 

Try the Huey ;)

[andysim]

The Phrase "tail wagging the dog" comes to mind here, putting such a powerfull and heavy engine in an aircraft with no power assists or fly by wire is never going to be easy to take off or land =)

[cichlidfan]

Occulus Rift is a real neat bit of hardware... Only one problem... I cant see where my mug of tea is and Ooops... What keyboard button did I press? Wait..> Was that the keyboard? Wheres my keyboard... O.o

 

What has that got to do with the handling of the Mustang or anything else currently related to the sim?

[Mizzy]

Mizzy, if you fly online, head into the Virtual Aerobatics Server that myself and Pman run. If you join the server and join TS, there's normally someone around that will be willing to help you get started flying any aircraft in DCS. :)

 

Awh thank you for that info but I don't play any games online partly because I don't know how to and I like doing art and graphic stuff for flight simulations mainly. I use the AI a lot to watch traffic fly around a lot, I don't do any fighting or anything but then again I have said this many times on here so most people who know me already know I am useless when it comes to air combat and all that stuff.... I don't do any fighting in any of them btw, they are just flight simulations to me and that's all I have ever used them for. However, I may take your offer up as it sound quite exciting and I suppose it's better actually talking to a real person rather than typing everything.

 

Mizzy

[NineLine]

Mizzy, as an artist, then you should check out this thread on the P-51D and making it shiny :) Some stuff going on with the P-51D and skinning that might interest you....

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?p=1463148

 

As for the flight model, it has been one of the most rewarding aircraft to learn how to fly, its a beast when you start, but once you get the hang of it you will appreciate every aspect of its FM... IL2 and older sims helped develop a lot of bad habits when it comes to dealing with these more advanced FMs

[VH-Rock]

Awh thank you for that info but I don't play any games online partly because I don't know how to and I like doing art and graphic stuff for flight simulations mainly. I use the AI a lot to watch traffic fly around a lot, I don't do any fighting or anything but then again I have said this many times on here so most people who know me already know I am useless when it comes to air combat and all that stuff.... I don't do any fighting in any of them btw, they are just flight simulations to me and that's all I have ever used them for. However, I may take your offer up as it sound quite exciting and I suppose it's better actually talking to a real person rather than typing everything.

 

Mizzy

 

Hi Mizzy, I also never fly any form of combat ;) As you saw in the video, I spend pretty much 100% of my flying time formation aerobatics with my team mates and friends. We run the Virtual Aerobatics server to allow people to fly with others on line in a none combat environment :)

[Scarecrow]

Hold the stick back at the start of your take off roll to lock the tail wheel, once you get up a bit of speed move the stick to neutral elevator and give a bit of right aileron to take some of the torque induced loading off the left wheel and she should respond to rudder input correctly.

 

This tip helped me alot with my DCS P51 take off. I found it impossible to steer once the tail came up:)

[Mizzy]

Hi Mizzy, I also never fly any form of combat ;) As you saw in the video, I spend pretty much 100% of my flying time formation aerobatics with my team mates and friends. We run the Virtual Aerobatics server to allow people to fly with others on line in a none combat environment :)

 

I knew I wasn't the only one, so are you telling me that you and a friend were the pilots in that Youtube video ??

 

Btw, thank you to everyone helping me understand what this new aircraft is and why it's so complicated.

 

Mizzy

Edited September 30, 2013 by Mizzy

[Double_D]

VH-Rock is the man...:thumbup:

[DD_Fenrir]

Hi Mizzy

 

I just posted this in my squad forums for a fella who's been asking how I do it, so thought you might like to try it out too. Let me know how you get on.

 

Buttons wise the only thing I can think of that I have mapped that's important for start-up & takeoff is Open/Close Canopy (shift/ctrl-C IIRC) and you might wanna map rudder trim to an axis or pot or something. If you have the facility to map left & right wheel brakes to an axis, I would also recommend. But more of that later. Otherwise I am doing everything via clickable cockpit.

 

Most importantly though is your pitch axis - make sure you have a curve set. I find 22 a good compromise between sensitivity and controllability.

 

Start-up is quite prompt when you can remember it! The in game tutorials are always good for that.

 

Taxiing.

 

Very little power is required to keep the mustang rolling, so whilst you might need a bit of oomph to get her started you'll find she saunter along quite happily with the throttle only fractionally open.

 

Turning whilst taxiing is not quite as easy as Il-2; firstly even though your tail wheel is steerable, there are limits to it's range of motion, 6 degrees either side of centreline. This is quite sufficient for shallow bends, S-turns whilst taxiing and essential for takeoff. This steerable mode is engaged simply by holding the stick aft of centre.

 

In contrast to fully unlock the tail wheel and make it free castoring, hold the stick forward of centre. Useful for spot turns etc. The best way to get it going is, rather than to apply rudder. to lightly tap the brake in the direction you want to turn. The tail will quickly - and I mean quickly! - start coming round. It will also accelerate as the tail carries round and converts your forward momentum into a ground loop VERY quickly so be ready to catch her with a dab (or three!) of opposite brake as she comes round. Remember if you are bimbling along doing about 20mph without much throttle on you'll have bugger all in terms of rudder authority so just hoping the rudder is going to catch it is a fools hope. Be sparing with the brakes though, cos a nose over is not out of the question.

 

 

Take-off.

 

Get nicely lined up, and make sure that the tail wheel is locked in the steerable mode (stick aft of centre) and more importantly that it is centred. I have seen so many people get all nicely squared but their tail wheel is at almost right angles to the direction of travel where they've made a 90 degree turn to get into position on the runway. They wonder why the plane suddenly veers as they power up! So after you have pulled on to the runway just run her forward gently a few feet until you're sure the tail wheel is centred in the 6 degree steering mode.

 

Last checks -

 

1. Close canopy

2. Flaps UP

3. Dial in 6 degree of right rudder trim

4. Stick held slightly aft of centre - no need for it to be in your gut

5. Take a brave pill.

 

Power up smoothly to 45 inches Manifold Pressure (MP) - that's all you need for now. Cobb the engine and she'll get all gyroscopic and squirrelly on you the moment the tail lifts. Just ease up the power to this mark, it's plenty for takeoff and concentrate on keeping her straight on the rudder - I find tiny little darts and jabs of rudder far more effective than sitting on it. It's tricky and the visual cues are almost imperceptible but you have to be on top of them real quickly and preempt - I can't stress that word enough, PREEMPT! - any movements you think might be happening. If she starts to get away from you then by the time you've got enough control authority to pull her back things just start getting real unpleasant. Then providing you haven't ground looped already in a ball of incandescent avgas, your massive correction will turn into a massive over-correction (cos you didn't release the rudder fast enough) and you'll end up ground looped in a ball of incandescent avgas... only this time on the other side of the runway.

 

If you've kept her somewhere near straight during the initial power up then you'll sense she wants to lower her nose as the speed builds; just let her do it in her own time. Relax a little back pressure and be prepared for a little dance on the rudder as the precession takes, though if you let her do it in her own time it's barely noticeable. If you force the tail off in anything but a feather-light manner she'll ground loop and kill you in a heart beat.

 

Ok by now you should be roaring down the runway doing something approaching 100mph - TBH I don't even look at the ASI, I just let her get on with it. With the horizon now on the nose I ever so gently bring the stick gently back a fraction of a smidge and wait till she's ready to lift off - if you keep hauling back until she reacts you will either:

 

A - at best be wondering why nowts happening when she suddenly leaps into the air and scares the bejezus out of you - then you'll spend the next 10 seconds correcting and then over-correcting, porpoising around like a noob, or,

B - at worst she'll leave the ground too quickly and snap stall and roll on her back only a few feet off the runway. Cue the ground looped in a ball of incandescent avgas - again. (Though in truth, this is more of a full on air crash.)

 

Once airbourne that rudder trim you dialled in for Take-off will make itself painfully apparent so get on the trim and come back on the prop pitch to 2700rpm.

 

Voila you are flying the P-51!

Edited September 30, 2013 by DD_Fenrir

[Mizzy]

Hi Mizzy

 

I just posted this in my squad forums for a fella who's been asking how I do it, so thought you might like to try it out too. Let me know how you get on.

 

Buttons wise the only thing I can think of that I have mapped that's important for start-up & takeoff is Open/Close Canopy (shift/ctrl-C IIRC) and you might wanna map rudder trim to an axis or pot or something. If you have the facility to map left & right wheel brakes to an axis, I would also recommend. But more of that later. Otherwise I am doing everything via clickable cockpit.

 

Most importantly though is your pitch axis - make sure you have a curve set. I find 22 a good compromise between sensitivity and controllability.

 

Start-up is quite prompt when you can remember it! The in game tutorials are always good for that.

 

Taxiing.

 

Very little power is required to keep the mustang rolling, so whilst you might need a bit of oomph to get her started you'll find she saunter along quite happily with the throttle only fractionally open.

 

Turning whilst taxiing is not quite as easy as Il-2; firstly even though your tail wheel is steerable, there are limits to it's range of motion, 6 degrees either side of centreline. This is quite sufficient for shallow bends, S-turns whilst taxiing and essential for takeoff. This steerable mode is engaged simply by holding the stick aft of centre.

 

In contrast to fully unlock the tail wheel and make it free castoring, hold the stick forward of centre. Useful for spot turns etc. The best way to get it going is, rather than to apply rudder. to lightly tap the brake in the direction you want to turn. The tail will quickly - and I mean quickly! - start coming round. It will also accelerate as the tail carries round and converts your forward momentum into a ground loop VERY quickly so be ready to catch her with a dab (or three!) of opposite brake as she comes round. Remember if you are bimbling along doing about 20mph without much throttle on you'll have bugger all in terms of rudder authority so just hoping the rudder is going to catch it is a fools hope. Be sparing with the brakes though, cos a nose over is not out of the question.

 

 

Take-off.

 

Get nicely lined up, and make sure that the tail wheel is locked in the steerable mode (stick aft of centre) and more importantly that it is centred. I have seen so many people get all nicely squared but their tail wheel is at almost right angles to the direction of travel where they've made a 90 degree turn to get into position on the runway. They wonder why the plane suddenly veers as they power up! So after you have pulled on to the runway just run her forward gently a few feet until you're sure the tail wheel is centred in the 6 degree steering mode.

 

Last checks -

 

1. Close canopy

2. Flaps UP

3. Dial in 6 degree of right rudder trim

4. Stick held slightly aft of centre - no need for it to be in your gut

5. Take a brave pill.

 

Power up smoothly to 45 inches Manifold Pressure (MP) - that's all you need for now. Cobb the engine and she'll get all gyroscopic and squirrelly on you the moment the tail lifts. Just ease up the power to this mark, it's plenty for takeoff and concentrate on keeping her straight on the rudder - I find tiny little darts and jabs of rudder far more effective than sitting on it. It's tricky and the visual cues are almost imperceptible but you have to be on top of them real quickly and preempt - I can't stress that word enough, PREEMPT! - any movements you think might be happening. If she starts to get away from you then by the time you've got enough control authority to pull her back things just start getting real unpleasant. Then providing you haven't ground looped already in a ball of incandescent avgas, your massive correction will turn into a massive over-correction (cos you didn't release the rudder fast enough) and you'll end up ground looped in a ball of incandescent avgas... only this time on the other side of the runway.

 

If you've kept her somewhere near straight during the initial power up then you'll sense she wants to lower her nose as the speed builds; just let her do it in her own time. Relax a little back pressure and be prepared for a little dance on the rudder as the precession takes, though if you let her do it in her own time it's barely noticeable. If you force the tail off in anything but a feather-light manner she'll ground loop and kill you in a heart beat.

 

Ok by now you should be roaring down the runway doing something approaching 100mph - TBH I don't even look at the ASI, I just let her get on with it. With the horizon now on the nose I ever so gently bring the stick gently back a fraction of a smidge and wait till she's ready to lift off - if you keep hauling back until she reacts you will either:

 

A - at best be wondering why nowts happening when she suddenly leaps into the air and scares the bejezus out of you - then you'll spend the next 10 seconds correcting and then over-correcting, porpoising around like a noob, or,

B - at worst she'll leave the ground too quickly and snap stall and roll on her back only a few feet off the runway. Cue the ground looped in a ball of incandescent avgas - again. (Though in truth, this is more of a full on air crash.)

 

Once airbourne that rudder trim you dialled in for Take-off will make itself painfully apparent so get on the trim and come back on the prop pitch to 2700rpm.

 

Voila you are flying the P-51!

 

WOW, now that's what I call helping someone out !!! Thank you

 

Mizzy

[159th_Falcon]

That's what this community is all about Mizzy.

 

And don't forget, plenty of fun can be had on online servers without ever firing a single round.

 

On one server for example they have an air race set up, including personal lap times.

 

Much fun.!

[DD_Fenrir]

No problem Mizzy. :)

 

Oops! Just realised, I forgot one thing... don't forget to retract the gear once you've got air underneath them wheels!

 

Good luck with it, and don't get too disheartened if it takes a while; I too am a long time Il-2 flyer and my many ground loops on take-off with DCS: P-51D came as a rude surprise to me too. They finally seem undramatic now... until I don't give it all my concentration and then *CRUNCH*. LoL!

[joey45]

To make you feel better my take off success rate is around the 10% mark....

 

Had her since day 1 of release.

[Mizzy]

Well, due to all of this wonderful communities help (gives me faith in human nature you know ) I nearly took off several times, I will get there and when I do I am even going to try online, something I never have done. If this is a real simulation for desktop computers, it is very hard.

 

Mizzy

 

P.S. I crashed in all my attempts today ..ho hum :-(

[Mizzy]

Ahh ha...found it, you need to lock the tail wheel !! I think someone already told me that but didn't understand what that meant or how to do it. I still crashed but hey, nearly did it.

 

Also someone changed my post title, never mind the title now is much more appropriate. This AFM thing is very addictive!

 

Mizzy

[Charly_Owl]

Ahh ha...found it, you need to lock the tail wheel !! I think someone already told me that but didn't understand what that meant or how to do it. I still crashed but hey, nearly did it.

 

Also someone changed my post title, never mind the title now is much more appropriate. This AFM thing is very addictive!

 

Mizzy

 

Great to hear, Mizzy. You'll see that this community is very helpful towards newcomers. See you in the skies!

[streakeagle]

I love flying the DCS P-51D and the UH-1H.

The AFM are challenging and per some actual pilots are about as close to reality as you can get on a PC right now.

[159th_Falcon]

Another thing you may want to do is set an curvature on the rudder.

I find it to be VERY senstive, specially for the small but fast corrections required upon take-off.

[VincentLaw]

P.S. I crashed in all my attempts today ..ho hum :-(

 

If you upload one or more track files of your failed takeoff attempts, it might help us give you additional, more specific pointers, or tell you if you are doing anything obviously wrong.

[Pman]

We have all been there Mizzy.

 

I only flew the Stang for the first time in Feb this year and I think I spent more time in flames for those first few weeks then I did in complete aircraft.

 

I remember being quite adamant that the Stang was unlandable and I found that actually flying it online helped me as I was able to talk to people who do it alot and are very good at it.

 

Its really not that bad once you can predict what its going to do and catch slides et al before they get serious.

 

With some practice its a great plane to fly and I love doing the aerobatic thing with it.

 

As Rock mentioned earlier, if you want to come online and chat with either of us or one of the seasoned Mustang pilots on the VA server we will all be more then willing to help you get her under control.

 

Before you know it you will be doing touch and go's like a pro ;)

 

Pman