Doughguy

gonna suck big time if you only have a joystick.... and pretty crappy if you play online and start in the air. on the ground yeah well fine.. one can hassle with assigning axis and modifiers on the fly... but whats the point of that... its not a trait of the stang... its a known bug that spoils alot.

yup. and if the modded lua doesnt make it past the integrity check no wonder no one flies the mustang online... its not competative as its bugged.. the stang does have a slight edge over the k4 in level speed or turnfights if flown fast. but hows that gonna work if its crippled by default... in regards of the oil cooler. i open them mainly if i know im about to engage in excessive turnfights or down on the deck. the drag is neglegible in a turnfight. its a mere 2 -3 knots really. more noticable if you want to run....

is this in the beta? i have ww2 assets pack and am on stable but cant find the c47?

you cant please everyone. if you get a gustav others would moan about xyz.... irs been discussed to death really.. and im not on here for too long... the k4 is a late war powerhorse... but it does have its quirks and thus not unbeatable... in 90% of the time its how you fly against it. to come full circle, op said developement happens in increments. that is correct. and most planes of each timeframe (ww2 timeframes bein rather narrow) have similiar performance but usually exceed at only one. its same today... you cant have an allrounder. people simply dont get it. its the same with the mustang.. boohoo it cant fight the k9 boohhoo. yes you can youre just doing it wrong. same with the spit. use its advantages to press the k4 into your fighting corner and not vice versa. it wont be an easy fight yes but thats how you get better anyway.

Sorry thats just an obvious contradiction... you make a correct statement and then negate it in the next sentence. But he didnt. And then there was the P51H and other variants and Planes like F8 in the pipeline. ED can do what they want. Thats how it is. The Spit can be paired with the A8. Dora, K4, Mustang and 47 are rather late war models, whereas there were enough antons flying as cannonfodder iirc. It is not off.

that topic has been done to death on the last few pages. to be blunt it gives more power. especially in greater heights. one reason people complain the mustang is crap because this is not fixed. theres a .lua fix on around here. works like a charm.

i usually set up a simple mission. have a flight of mustangs vs a flight of 109 or 190s. i mix up things by setting up heading and height to an advantage and disadvantage etc. keep in mind the mustang is a high altitude escort fighter. itll perform best in 18k ft plus. below 7k ft the germans especially the 109 will tear you apart. good way to test things and try stuff out.

i use auto cooling aswell. only down low i tend to open it manuall. especially if i engage in some turn fights as youve stated: down low and slow at around 200mph the temp easily hits the red mark. hence rather disengage and fly rather larger circles to let the engine cool or quick turns and straight flight. the temp wont rise abruptly but gradually. more if you fly 10+ mins in tight turns on the deck. yes the performance in high alts over the germans is very close but the stang has the edge there as far as ive experienced. yes you can only do wide circles at slow speed up there but thats really all it takes. the anton and dora cant really keep up with your turns. the dora is slightly slower than you. k4 is close in both aspects but can be outrun. no need to worry about cooling up there. i leave the coolant flaps on auto. @m1combat no hard feelings there. the stangs getting too much beating around here for my taste. but thats just my opinion. but since you and i for sure arent vets i cant comment other what i read/hear/see. otherwise its guessing or simply having opinions. the spit and pony might have the same or at least similar engine but what about the rest? theres more to the system than just the engine. more over, the spit had its own quirks etc and the yanks surly had their fair share of do's n donts before engaging combat. also keep in mind that not every pilot actually had the chance to go full speed in the stang and engage in dogfights especially in the later stages of war when opposition was rather meak. but as i said im no ww2 pilot and cant say nothing about the authenticity. i can only go by what vets say and that is that the stang had aforementioned problems. if that was known, and it was for sure, then tactics and schooling included this... after all you dont have continues in rl... so you are less prone to doing stupid things in your plane.

US gunnery school used chalk rounds on 50 cals. forerunners of todays simmunition.

it was tho. listen to or read some accounts of mustang veterans. if you screw the cooling in any way, eg overheating or damage, youre out. same veterans also comment that the mustang wasnt a good climber. but i guess veterans are wrong eh.... if i fight with the stang the way it was intended i havent really got much trouble with the axis fighters unless i do something stupid... e.g. climb contest or turn fight going up at low speeds with an axis fighter. if you cross that out of your equasion you rule out half of your probs in the stang. each plane has its quirks. keep that in mind. the mustang was no miracle plane. stay high. always. supercharger lamp indicates your playground area. stay above your enemy at any height regardless. do not engage in extended climbs, make wide circles while shallow climbing instead. this way you can catch the oppo loosing momentum on its peak on the climb back after your turn or you dive down onto him if he runs for the deck. if you fight above 20k you can out run and out turn the axis fighters. so if one is hanging on your ass extend in a straight line. dont climb dont dive. if hes to close make sure you have enough speed and turn into him with high g turns and extend eventually give it a burst on head on. even from far away to plow the road. one rule of dicta boelcke. up high the axis fighters arent as manouverable at given speeds. use that. watch your cooling temp. down on the deck or generally below 7k ft its where the axis fighters rule. open your oil and coolant flaps. the axis fighters will turn alot at low speed. if you engage in a deck dog fight make sure to pull up a bit when in a turn. youll most likely never place a good hit with the stang if in a high g turn with a 109 or 190. but if you add a shallow climb instead you can dive down on him or circle and wait for a better shot. think of it as a flat yo yo motion. feel free to correct me since im flying only since september and its been a steep learning curve but once i started to fly the stang with its quirks in the back of my head i generally had much less problems. especially with the engine. and ive been running it on full power (cept wep) more than 15 mins on many occassions.

i got no real probs with bouncing aswell unless i screw up the approach an descend too fast. but i stick to the manual really. i pass the runway with about 200 mph and 1k ft. rpm set to full, coolers all wide open and flaps down gradually and full down when on final approach. on turn onto runway im at about 150 mph lower gear. at this point im about 400 ft high and keep a steady 120 130 mph. aiming for the center of the first third of the runway. the right before touch down pull back the stick gently to flare out. the height indicator isnt really good at that height so it takes a bit of experience to judge that. if you hit the sweet spot itll touch down gently. if you flare bit to high youll bounce a tad but thats no big deal? only if you flare out too high youll stall and land like a piano and break wheels. but yeah practice practice practice.... same applies for the 2 wheel landings. you gotta get a feel for them. i regularly do some training flights where i make like 5 or 6 starts landings and taxiing sessions. if you dont train and lack experience you cant blame others....but its the most easy part.... yes... with other games this might be easier.... but bear in mind how.old they are and tech advances. ive been playing ms cfs 1 2 and 3 and those are nothing compared to dcs. also if you got real stick time flying a sim is a completally different matter. you cant feel the plane and the inputs are totally different in that respect. you basically have to re learn flying. even if youd fly the same plane in rl and dcs. watch the video of erich brunotte. same thing. the fm was right the joystick was the problem.

well thats all good with me. hard to keep track of whats coming and whats not. just raised some eyebrows as it sounded like cherry picking on what to have and what not in a "historical accurate timeframe" for one of these birds. personally i can hold my own against the k4 in the mustang as most simply fly it the wrong way to be blunt. but as its been rightfully acknowledged the late war mustang uses early war ammo belts.. hence wrong as noted in this thread. gotta take everything in account then. guess bit of miscommunication causing grief here and there.

its unusual that your engine would die if you spawn in mid air if you do not make any adjustments and just fly straight level. the system starts with a default setting and takes a few seconds to read your inputs (eg throttle axis etc) and adjust to these unless you make adjustments on your own. make a quick editor mission for simple flight, check, and save a track so we can see. anything else is pure guessing.

boom and zoom aswell as turnfighting is relative in most fighters. with the mustang its the height and speed that dictates how to fight. up high the stang can outrun and out manouver all axis fighters down low not so much. it can turn well. at high speeds itll outmanouver the k4 but it has problems at low speeds. thats what ive observed at least. the pony is more stable in high speed flight. in low speeds its rather prone to tumbling and weasling around. so gotta apply flaps a bit. but that drains your energy. flying high and fast is rather a cake walk. imagine flying the stang as driving a big fat cadilac. you dont throw yourself into turns but rather go smooth left and right shallow yoyo and then run over the granny that happens to cross your path. similar is my tactic against ai up high. loiter around and turn into a fighter in a shallow dive. if he turns hard disengage and climb to your original height and observe. if hes doing a flat turn or opportunity is good in general descend on him. ai often starts to spiral downward as a defensive manouver and then climb back to stall you out. watch your height. stay in lagg pursuit above him. if you get too low pull up gain speed and the descend again if possible. imagine the ai doing steep yoyos whilest youre doing very flat ones to stay on height. often the ai just continues its yoyo manouver and turns up on your 12 o clock on its stall point or you have a little bit of climbing to do but not so much that youd stall out. ive not really managed to figure out good defensive manouvers on the deck. up high is rather easy as the axis fighters can be shaken of by either some simple turning and extending fast or some high speed g turns turning into them. but down on the deck... different story. you cant out run the d9 and k4. and all 3 axis fighters climb and turn as hell below 7k ft. so either you get shot up in a turn or whilest running away. and if its a 1on1 situation youre toast in most cases. especially when flying against more skilled ai. the stall/hammerhead manouver is kinda risky. engine is cooked way too fast in the stang. sort of last resort but if it fails... well... youre as good as dead. ive managed to survive a few turns agains a k4 on the deck but if hes close and you rarely managed to turn into him and extend quickly and climb..... the mustang isnt the best climber and if youre at 1k ft and your playground is above 18k..... thats a lot manouvering to do... so yeah id be most interested in defensive manouvers in the stang. you cant stay up high all the time and inevetabely you have to descend at a point. mustang pilots also strafed airfields during ww2. and they certainly didnt snipe 109s from 20k ft. granted you have your wingmen and that helps alot. if they are around.... so saying "dont be in the defensive in the first place" doesnt cut it for me.

yes the main problem is the ai. if you pepper one of the axis fighters they often disengage and run away. quite often they make a belly landing. a human player might have more problems handling a damaged plane but ai is somewhat skynet driven lol. but it was stated enough that the ai used a simplified flight model. they only eject if they receive a catastrophic failure but not because of some holes in the wings. and only if you get the aircraft destroyed message its really done even if the plane is damaged as hell but somehow limps around. hence people think its still in combat worthy condition. and as nineline said, the damage textures arent a representative display of actual damage. ever wondered why damage looks the same after some pot shots? ive experienced greater success engaging slightly from below. at great heights thatll make the fuel tanks burst. resulting in a huge fireball and most of the time a catastrophic fire if not just a huge fuel leak and the bogey fleeing.

I´m not sure itll work with a axis command since the flaps are set in incremets of 5. so dcs simply cant read the middle steps, only 1 (full up) and 5 (full down).

they are different beasts. they werent as powerful as jets hence they stall quicker. be gentle with the stick. the 51 can do tight turns but dont yank the stick. gradually pull tighter. youll get shaking as a response if you pull too much. its not the best climber. if you have enough speed itll skyrocket if not youll fry the engine. dont go below 200 mph during combat and if in the vertical abort the climb and throttle back if youre going below that speed cause at about 100mph the engine will cook itself. otherwise the mustang is rather easy to fly. it performes best incl turns at high speeds.

yes i understand how this works. example: the typical ai will lure you into a turnfight spiraling down. guess we've all been there. you follow in a lag pursuit gaining until the pipper is on the target where its supposed to be with correct settings etc. of course its hard to maintain a clnstant path in the pony as its quite a weasel at times but id expect a good hits whereas most bursts seem to come too short of the opponents tail. on other occassions its dead center and down it goes. so i kinda try to figure out whats going on and what in can do to remedy this in order to make more consistent shots.

Cheers Art-J. I´ve not noticed that the diamonds move in arches dcs... one can only notice the arch when the wingspan is set to min/max all the way.. the distance adjustment just shifts them in/out. my bad. That clears out the initial question about the different sight pictures. Video is also interesting regarding the effect of lag / turnspeed during combat. kinda deals with my second question but my head was being messed with today to much and i dont fully understand that part. gonna rewatch it. but as said in my first post, the gyro kinda "lags" behind, even tho set up right. Wingspan and distance set right. The first fighter is shot down bullseye but with the next one after some high aoa turns seems to be off even tho i fight the same type and engage at the same distance. I guess the video kinda explains this, but i cant really get my head around it, as in how to counter act this, or "what not to do".

This. if aimed right, at the 1100ft convergence , a 1 - 2 second burst right up the fockes wulf will messer any schmitt. fast.

Hm, i cannot observe that the diamonds move in a curve in dcs. they just slide in / out to the center dot. I understand that each diamond would move along a curve but relative to a path towards the center of the dot, however those paths dont seem to be consistent in the axis aligment if i hit google. at the highest peek of the diamonds curve, youd have a slightly skewed sightpicture but not totally shifted in axis like in my drawing. that what kinda makes me wonder what is right? That does make sense however that would mean you dont really follow the bogey would it? Cause usually youd match pitch, roll etc of the bogey in a pursuit. This might rather apply for deflection shots? but then, why design a sight for pure deflection shots? wouldnt a sight, set up for "pursuit" style shoot be more "natural"? i mean, the target breaks to the left at 50 deg, i copy that and follow. i dont fly straight and use the rudder only so i can adjust my sight picture. thats kinda counter intuitive. in both sight pictures youd have diagonal aligments but only either a vertical ( 6/12 o clock) or horizontal (3 / 9 o clock). I hope this makes it clearer. It does show that the diamond traverses on a curve but that curve (roughly) follows a path on eg 3 o clock. itll never alligned that its on the 4 o clock. And that sight picture is also show in the stangs manual. Ingame we have this tho: Same thing just tilted slightly. The odd thing is that i keep finding pictures of both sight patterns, which is rather confusing... However: Shows the dots with the 3/9 o clock allignmet. Yes i know its not the yank one, but its basically a clone as stated. The gyro is set to its shortest range (see handle indicator). now if youd set it to its max range, each dot/diamond would shift towards the center on a curve but as stated relative to a path. theyd never end up on a different alligned path tho.

sorry i wasnt clear enough. what i mean is that the sight picture differs from what you see in the dcs stang vs what is shown in the manual. in your video and in the dcs stang you have the diamonds of the sightpicture on the 12 2 4 6 8 and 10 o clock position means no diamonds on 3 and 9 ( respectively shifted for the others) as shown in the mustangs manual and various other sources. see attachment. the blue indicated "diamonds" are what we have in dcs vs what is pictured in the manual. even in the target pattern picture the diamonds are placed differently ( with 2 diamonds on 3 and 9 o clock) makin it easy to dial in the wingspan. with the sight we have in dcs there is a gap on the 3 and 9 and you have to estimate or roll few degrees to be able to match the wingspan... seems inconvenient of the target is manouvering.. i wonder what is correct as adjusting wingspan with the sightpicture as shown in the manual would be far more easy and natural. if its correct the way it is then im fine but i find different sightpictures for that gyro all over the net. i do understand how to use the gyro and how to set it up.

hi there, im still learning to fly the pony but came across some things that got my head boggled with its gyrosight. 1) the positioning of the diamonds seems to vary? or in other words is this correct? right now the diamonds are formed so that we do not have 2 diamonds that are alligned in horizontal manner making it rather difficult to dial in the distance on the fly and rendering the process a bit of a guess work especially if you dont have distance labels enabled. it puts me off as in the stangs manual (see page 61) and other pics on the web 2 diamonds are alligned in horizontal manner, which would be the more intuitive and more logical approach to have? especially if you follow the target you allining direction, roll etc. so what is correct ? 2) can it be that the sight gets wonky after too many acrobatics? if dialed in correcty and shooting from the correct convergence distance,even during turns, the first few engagements produce good hit results and the bogey goes down fast but i feel like after a while its getting way off? is it just me or anyone else experienced this? is this a "feature"?

yes. nineline said this few time iirc. however i dont think it will change characteristics entirely. so in the end youll still have to fly the pony like now but with a bit more leeway.

pitch doesnt matter as much as airspeed. yes you can climb past 60°. no probs. but you have to watch your speed. as said those old machines no matter what model cant climb at high pitches infinately no mater what model it is. and some do better than others. its a technical evolution. the stang needs the airspeed to cool its engine. if that fails (cause of stalls) the engine is fried. happens to the axis fighters aswell. just not as fast due to different construction and strange ai settings. the ai flys basically flawless in higher settings and alternative physics. is it modelled right? idk. but we gotta trust ed on that theyve modelled it along the existing data. if that fits it should be right. but then again... how do you want to model correct ultra realistic avionics of a modern jet with all the secrecy around it? you cant. its an approximation. ww2 fighters arent really shrouded by secrecy anymore, only lost/limited data available. so yeah untill the new cooling sytem is implemented you gotta play along current rules.