Jump to content

Sound Tech Neglect


mytai01
 Share

Recommended Posts

Sound is the one area that is no where near where the video is. Awesome sound is MORE immersive than video. Everyone has seen awesome movies that have unbelievable video, but for some reason it's still boring. That's because our emotions are more influenced by what we hear than what we see. For example, we all know how creepy it is to hear strange noises in the dark. Jump scare videos would be nothing without a scream with the video. We are programmed from an early age to respond to sound more than sight. Loud noises frighten us. Like THUNDER! This game really needs THUNDER!!! Watch the Royal Malaysian Air Force Su-30MKM video I posted in the video section for an example of noise. It's inspiring and at the same time if makes me hope it'll happen in DCS World one day...Bring on the Noise!!!

 

I guess I should mention that I'm not merely writing about volume as much as I mean complexity. The change in frequency, tone and pitch in the engines from idle to full power. The air rushing and changing pitch as you maneuver. The air conditioner changing the airflow as the engine power is changed and other systems reacting to the engine power state. It would be awesome if that could be done.


Edited by mytai01

MS Win7 Pro x64, Intel i7-6700K 4.0Ghz, Corsair RAM 16Gb,EVGA GeForce GTX 1080 FTW GAMING ACX 3.0, w/ Adjustable RGB LED Graphics Card 08G-P4-6286-KR, Creative Labs SB X-FI Titanium Fatal1ty Champ PCIe Sound Card, Corsair Neutron XTI 1TB SSD, TM Warthog Throttle & Stick, TM TPR Pedels, Oculus Rift VR Headset CV1, Klipsch Promedia 4.1 Speakers...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sounds for most aircraft in DCS are (and it's no secret) inaccurate. I recommend sound mods in the meantime. Keep an eye out for more though.

There is a thread called "G" by Jafa, who is working on a sound mod that is amazing. Until that's done, Diveplane has pretty good engine sounds.


Edited by Magic Zach

Hardware: T-16000M Pack, Saitek 3 Throttle Quadrant, Homemade 32-function Leo Bodnar Button Box, MFG Crosswind Pedals Oculus Rift S

System Specs: MSI MPG X570 GAMING PLUS, GTX 1070 SC2, AMD RX3700, 32GB DDR4-3200, Samsung 860 EVO, Samsung 970 EVO 250GB

Modules: Ka-50, Mi-8MTV2, FC3, F/A-18C, F-14B, F-5E, P-51D, Spitfire Mk LF Mk. IXc, Bf-109K-4, Fw-190A-8

Maps: Normandy, Nevada

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sounds for most aircraft in DCS are (and it's no secret) inaccurate. I recommend sound mods in the meantime. Keep an eye out for more though.

There is a thread called "G" by Jafa, who is working on a sound mod that is amazing. Until that's done, Diveplane has pretty good engine sounds.

 

As far as I know the game code takes an engine sound file and increases frequency, pitch, and volume of the same file. All DCS seems to do is change which file one hears most from different directions from the plane. Perhaps more than one file needs to be used per direction. As throttle, the noise from one file needs to give way to another file that takes over.

MS Win7 Pro x64, Intel i7-6700K 4.0Ghz, Corsair RAM 16Gb,EVGA GeForce GTX 1080 FTW GAMING ACX 3.0, w/ Adjustable RGB LED Graphics Card 08G-P4-6286-KR, Creative Labs SB X-FI Titanium Fatal1ty Champ PCIe Sound Card, Corsair Neutron XTI 1TB SSD, TM Warthog Throttle & Stick, TM TPR Pedels, Oculus Rift VR Headset CV1, Klipsch Promedia 4.1 Speakers...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No, I just mean the audio samples are far from what the real deal sounds. That's it.

Hopefully we get better sounds in the future, though.


Edited by Magic Zach

Hardware: T-16000M Pack, Saitek 3 Throttle Quadrant, Homemade 32-function Leo Bodnar Button Box, MFG Crosswind Pedals Oculus Rift S

System Specs: MSI MPG X570 GAMING PLUS, GTX 1070 SC2, AMD RX3700, 32GB DDR4-3200, Samsung 860 EVO, Samsung 970 EVO 250GB

Modules: Ka-50, Mi-8MTV2, FC3, F/A-18C, F-14B, F-5E, P-51D, Spitfire Mk LF Mk. IXc, Bf-109K-4, Fw-190A-8

Maps: Normandy, Nevada

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 months later...

I noticed sound improvements in DCS 1.5.8, but there only noticeable when heard from a certain distance outside - it's not a game changer, but a step in the right direction.

Modules I own: F-14A/B, Mi-24P, AV-8B N/A, AJS 37, F-5E-3, MiG-21bis, F-16CM, F/A-18C, Supercarrier, Mi-8MTV-2, UH-1H, Mirage 2000C, FC3, MiG-15bis, Ka-50, A-10C (+ A-10C II), P-47D, P-51D, C-101, Yak-52, WWII Assets, CA, NS430, Hawk

Terrains I own: South Atlantic, Syria, The Channel, SoH/PG, Marianas

System (RIP my old PC): Dell XPS 15 9570 w/ Intel i7-8750H, NVIDIA GTX 1050Ti Max-Q, 16GB DDR4, 500GB Samsung PM871 SSD (upgraded with 1TB Samsung 970 EVO Plus SSD)

VKB Gunfighter Mk.II w. MCG Pro, MFG Crosswind V3 Graphite

Dreams: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/bG9bBc

Link to comment
Share on other sites

One of the main problems is that in real life we have massive dynamic range which games tend to NOT do, (because mean sounds pressure levels (i.e normal volume) would end up being too quiet to "enjoy" for the player.)

 

Example, a jet engine at full noise, immediately next to the observer is around 140 to 150Db sound pressure. So if you calibrate your audio files so that the "peak" (-0db gain / digital peak level) occurs in this scenario, then everything else has to be quieter.

From 100m away, that same engine might only register as 90 to 100 dB sound pressure... becasue sound measurement is logarythmic, this would be so far below the peak level that many of us simply would not be able to hear it, becasue our headsets etc. do not have the dynamic range available to give us this.

Inside the cabin/ cockpit of an aircraft (esp with a helmet on) the peak sound pressure level from the engine might be around 60 to 70 dBA.

Sound is measured logarythmically, so this is not half of the original sound pressure, it's far, far less.

 

 

Our headsets/ speakers etc. don't have that kind of dynamic range at all. Headsets might limit at 100 to 110 dBA sound pressure. So by the time the game is trying to simluate something that in real-life would be 60 to 70 dBA, its game volume would end up being inaudible.

 

So.. what to the game makers do? (largely out of necessity)

They normalise the "normal" sounds of the game (i.e. cruise engine sound) to be near the peak. We can get a nice lound cruise engine sound, but then when we switch to a fly-by sound, our audio output is already nearly at peak, so there's no headroom left for the additional gain of the louder engine sound... the result is that everything that should be "SUPER LOUD!" is actually only a few dB above everything else.


Edited by philstyle

On YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/philstylenz

Storm of War WW2 server website: https://stormofwar.net/

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • ED Team
I agree totally, especially the engine sounds of the WWII birds. Maybe someone can hijack Tiger33's stuff:

 

I know for all the WWII stuff, they are recorded from the actual aircraft for DCS (ie 109G for the K-4 I believe).

 

As well, this is BST on the job...

yQY4TtjK0qk


Edited by NineLine

64Sig.png
Forum RulesMy YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug**

1146563203_makefg(6).png.82dab0a01be3a361522f3fff75916ba4.png  80141746_makefg(1).png.6fa028f2fe35222644e87c786da1fabb.png  28661714_makefg(2).png.b3816386a8f83b0cceab6cb43ae2477e.png  389390805_makefg(3).png.bca83a238dd2aaf235ea3ce2873b55bc.png  216757889_makefg(4).png.35cb826069cdae5c1a164a94deaff377.png  1359338181_makefg(5).png.e6135dea01fa097e5d841ee5fb3c2dc5.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

It sure doesn't seem like they recorded actual engine sounds. The flyby sounds in the teaser videos for the spitfire are amazing, but in game it's totally different. I know there are a few mods out there that are improvements, but this would really make DCS stand out from its competitors because nobody does it well. Most are recording lawnmowers or air boats it seems.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sound is the one area that is no where near where the video is. Awesome sound is MORE immersive than video. Everyone has seen awesome movies that have unbelievable video, but for some reason it's still boring. That's because our emotions are more influenced by what we hear than what we see. For example, we all know how creepy it is to hear strange noises in the dark. Jump scare videos would be nothing without a scream with the video. We are programmed from an early age to respond to sound more than sight. Loud noises frighten us. Like THUNDER! This game really needs THUNDER!!! Watch the Royal Malaysian Air Force Su-30MKM video I posted in the video section for an example of noise. It's inspiring and at the same time if makes me hope it'll happen in DCS World one day...Bring on the Noise!!!

 

I guess I should mention that I'm not merely writing about volume as much as I mean complexity. The change in frequency, tone and pitch in the engines from idle to full power. The air rushing and changing pitch as you maneuver. The air conditioner changing the airflow as the engine power is changed and other systems reacting to the engine power state. It would be awesome if that could be done.

 

Well, what can I say...I totally agree with you :thumbup:...sound is much more "realistic" in terms of what we can reproduce with actual equipment than the image and makes such a HUGE difference...I love how you described what we want also :)...

 

anyway, ED is recently making some nice improvements in the sound department but as you said, we need much more "grunt" and air "cracking" as well as variety for the EXTERNAL sounds...sound, due to its nature, is hard to describe with words.

 

I dont know how deep the sound engine is for DCS, but I would love if they develop a true SIMULATION of the sound, I mean, record many high quality samples, and somewhat mix them in a DYNAMIC way so that the CPU (which has PLENTY of power for this) can then use a simulation algorithm to modify them (SPL, frequencies, attenuation, distortion, etc.) on the go just like the wind, temp, etc. would do in real life...on top of that add as many variables as possible to take into account: wind speed, wind direction, distances from listeners to sources, source speed, relative source speed with respect to listener, air temperature, air density, ground plane effect, isolated emitters (instead of recording already mixed sounds, record them separatedly so that each sound source is treated as individual "emitter" inside the sound simulation engine so that an "infinite" amount of them can be added independently and will have its own "computed output" in the sound simulation which could open a new world in terms of detail and complexity) , sound barrier, randomization to introduce changes in the output given by the simulation algorithm, etc...it might sound too complex, but I think its not that hard if you have a sound engineer and a soft engineer right? :P

Take a look at my MODS here

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sound is the one area that is no where near where the video is. Awesome sound is MORE immersive than video. Everyone has seen awesome movies that have unbelievable video, but for some reason it's still boring. That's because our emotions are more influenced by what we hear than what we see. For example, we all know how creepy it is to hear strange noises in the dark. Jump scare videos would be nothing without a scream with the video. We are programmed from an early age to respond to sound more than sight. Loud noises frighten us. Like THUNDER! This game really needs THUNDER!!! Watch the Royal Malaysian Air Force Su-30MKM video I posted in the video section for an example of noise. It's inspiring and at the same time if makes me hope it'll happen in DCS World one day...Bring on the Noise!!!

 

I guess I should mention that I'm not merely writing about volume as much as I mean complexity. The change in frequency, tone and pitch in the engines from idle to full power. The air rushing and changing pitch as you maneuver. The air conditioner changing the airflow as the engine power is changed and other systems reacting to the engine power state. It would be awesome if that could be done.

 

Ahhh, I guess I'm not alone out there.

 

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::robot:

:worthy::worthy::worthy:

 

 

Add great audio/soundtrack ontop of great gameplay and you have a masterpiece http://www.metacritic.com/game/gamecube/metroid-prime

 

 

Audio!!!, people! A lot more important than you think because it works on more subtle level, easily forgotten or distracted if not paying attention.

 

Just to be clear, I'm not actually implying that DCS is really neglecting it, first there's not much of a competition, second it's just not something focused on across the board, third is that they aren't neglecting it from a feature richness in my view, you have most of the things making sounds, buttons, clicks, landing gear, cockpit canopy, not like something very obvious is missing.

 

It's a lot more complicated:

 

 

 

  1. One is the sound producing quality (using real things vs all in software)
  2. One is audio recording hardware and mic quality
  3. One is the audio recording bitrate and samplerate quality
  4. One is the studio audio equipment quality (keeping original quality throughout)
  5. One is the audio blend quality, so you don't get repeating patterns (this is neglected I agree, unless that's how it is for real :shocking:)
  6. One is output audio bitrate and samplerate quality included in the game
  7. One is in-game mix quality (volume distribution, 3D-positioning)
  8. One is effects quality/accuracy (doppler effect, etc)
  9. One is the sound producing element richness in a game (quantity here)
  10. One is those elements having different variations of sounds (quantity here)

 

 

So I agree man, but in some of these points the term neglect would be too harsh.


Edited by Worrazen

Modules: A-10C I/II, F/A-18C, Mig-21Bis, M-2000C, AJS-37, Spitfire LF Mk. IX, P-47, FC3, SC, CA, WW2AP, CE2. Terrains: NTTR, Normandy, Persian Gulf, Syria

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

Engine repeating patterns sound really exists like that?

 

I do usually forget about it quick when focusing on core gameplay, so it's to be fair not really a problem, but thinking about audio for a second brings it up immediately.

 

I did experience only an F-16 flying by my head on a local airshow, that's about it, I don't think I remember hearing any patterns.


Edited by Worrazen

Modules: A-10C I/II, F/A-18C, Mig-21Bis, M-2000C, AJS-37, Spitfire LF Mk. IX, P-47, FC3, SC, CA, WW2AP, CE2. Terrains: NTTR, Normandy, Persian Gulf, Syria

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@skate

Well, that sounds a big step in the right direction, anyway!

 

The real issue, is that, like so much else in the game right now, and the purpose of the 2.5 engine overhaul in the first place... is that a lot of the assets and tech in the game is very dated. That's why all this is being done! Improving sound, I'm sure is on the list, too.

 

Hopefully, we can get some deep, throaty roars on all our aircraft :) I know the ground vehicles sound pretty good, most of them, anyway. First time I drove a tank in CA I was really impressed how much rumbly base it had, like, I had my volume up too high and it was making my eyeballs wobble.

 

 

 

 

Note: If sound is making your eyeballs wobble, you should probably turn the volume down, as it is highly likely to be bad for you.

Новий рік, і Україна переможе! Слава Україні, героям слава!

5800x3d * 3090 * 64gb * Reverb G2

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If you are disappointed with some sounds for some aircraft, just use a sound mod. Skull's Huey Sounds are good, and Jafa's sounds for the P-51 and Spitfire are probably the highest quality sound mod you'll ever come across.

The sounds for the Hornet sound good. I don't think I'll need to mod that!

Hardware: T-16000M Pack, Saitek 3 Throttle Quadrant, Homemade 32-function Leo Bodnar Button Box, MFG Crosswind Pedals Oculus Rift S

System Specs: MSI MPG X570 GAMING PLUS, GTX 1070 SC2, AMD RX3700, 32GB DDR4-3200, Samsung 860 EVO, Samsung 970 EVO 250GB

Modules: Ka-50, Mi-8MTV2, FC3, F/A-18C, F-14B, F-5E, P-51D, Spitfire Mk LF Mk. IXc, Bf-109K-4, Fw-190A-8

Maps: Normandy, Nevada

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...