Mig-29 FM

[flavnet]

Hello everyone! I believe the new Mig-29 flight model is absolutely unsuitable for the simulation. Obviously, I have never piloted a Mig-29, but I think the simulated airplane is impossible to manage, during take-off, flight and landing. The take-off is very difficult: the run-up reaches over 300 km/h and there is always the risk of touching the track with the engines when you pull the stick back! The engine in flight is very difficult to manage: when it is at 80% of the power the plane continues to accelerate! It seems that the super-cruise was invented by the Russians with the Mig-29 not by the Americans with the F-22! Landing is a nightmare: assuming that you can reduce the speed of the plane (at least at 350-400 km/h). However, you can touch the track at any speed between 300 and 400 km/h, at an angle between 2 and 7 degrees, and the plane will always bounce off the track in a catastrophic way (total destruction)!!! I beg the developers to review something to make the Mig-29 FM enjoyable as that of the Su-27 (which still has a perfect FM and I hope it will not be changed for the worse).

Thanks for the attention.

[Haukka81]

You gonna make lot of friends :P

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[munckmb]

After practicing landing like 30-40 times, I find it to be not really a problem. What helps is a curve of 15 in the control axes. At least for me. It's really an enjoyable plane to fly!

[Mars Exulte]

This thread is pointless. Your opinion or feels isn't going to change a FM. Only hard data, and it's been pretty well established the FM, while still working out kinks, is accurate. So, get better at, watch some videos of people more successful at flying it, or go fly something else. Pretty straightforward.

[Hunter Joker]

Uhmmm, Obviously I never fly on a 29 but.. Take off is not a problem, pull gently the stick at 240kph, wait to 260 and a magic happen, You are airborne...

For landing, You must keep a correct AoA (use NOC for the best glide path) and touch a 330kph under 2ms of descent ratio keeping the stick to flare a bit to dissipate some energy...

Not much of problems, it's a bit raw but could be tamed..

Only real problem I found is the near zero pitch authority above 900kph but I haven't real MiG29 flight's experience to state that it's wrong...

 

 

 

Inviato dal mio BLA-L09 utilizzando Tapatalk

[Esac_mirmidon]

Train more, read more, look more videos, and practice more.

[Auditor]

Uhmmm, Obviously I never fly on a 29 but.. Take off is not a problem, pull gently the stick at 240kph, wait to 260 and a magic happen, You are airborne...

For landing, You must keep a correct AoA (use NOC for the best glide path) and touch a 330kph under 2ms of descent ratio keeping the stick to flare a bit to dissipate some energy...

Not much of problems, it's a bit raw but could be tamed..

Only real problem I found is the near zero pitch authority above 900kph but I haven't real MiG29 flight's experience to state that it's wrong...

 

 

 

Inviato dal mio BLA-L09 utilizzando Tapatalk

The solution I've found to pitch authority: Trim more

[flavnet]

Really strange. I easily landed with all the simulated aircraft (including the so "feared" Mig-21), I landed on the aircraft carrier with SU-33 and F-18, yet they are five days I'm trying to land on large airports such as highways with a MIG -29 and I managed (badly) to land three times on dozens of disasters. Flying the the MIG-29 is more difficult than flying the MIG-21?!?!?!

[Mars Exulte]

Really strange. I easily landed with all the simulated aircraft (including the so "feared" Mig-21), I landed on the aircraft carrier with SU-33 and F-18, yet they are five days I'm trying to land on large airports such as highways with a MIG -29 and I managed (badly) to land three times on dozens of disasters. Flying the the MIG-29 is more difficult than flying the MIG-21?!?!?!

 

 

Possibly, and possibly you just have bad habits, considering the number of people NOT having issues with it. Most my time flying online I have observed the overwhelming majority of virpilots suck at landing, even if they do ok elsewhere, especially in combat sims where they focus on the shooty bits. I have not watched you, so I'm not saying YOU specifically do, but statistically the odds favor it lol

[Wizard_03]

I've Never had issues with tail strikes, never had bounce issues. Just be light with the controls and keep it trimmed at all times, avoid large power changes on landings and manage your descent rate better, also make sure your not too heavy on landing.

 

It's got a very good power to weight ratio so be careful with the throttle on take off and in general, if you ask for power, you'll get it right away with the 29.

 

 

 

 

That's my personal advise, maybe not actual MiG-29 Doctrine.

[rrohde]

Fixed that for you:

 

Hello everyone! I believe I am not good enough yet with new Mig-29 flight model, and thus generalize and have to make my opinion heard instead of practising some more, but I conclude that it is absolutely unsuitable for the simulation. Since it doesn't feel right, I qualify as armchair expert par excellence.

 

;)

 

Also, maybe ED should introduce an option to revert back to SFM for those who need it? :thumbup:

[Lao Fei Mao]

No problem for me on taking-off, constantly trimming during flight, and touch down. I just hate there isn't a NWS control, hard to keep straight on runway after landing. SU-27 and SU-33 have NWS control, how come Mig-29 doesn't have one?

[Lixma 06]

No problem for me on taking-off, constantly trimming during flight, and touch down. I just hate there isn't a NWS control, hard to keep straight on runway after landing. SU-27 and SU-33 have NWS control, how come Mig-29 doesn't have one?

 

?

 

Just use the rudder control (flaps up for increased turn-rate).

[flavnet]

OK! After having performed at least thirty landings (all disastrous), I finally managed to have five successes and one after the other! So, I can say that I learned how to land with the new Mig-29. As has been written by many people on the forum, the secret is to have high AOA (from 7 to 10 degrees) to the touchdown (at 140/150 kias = 260/280 kmh = 161/173 mph), then, very gently, start to lower the nose and immediately activate the parachute with full brakes. Do not touch the rudder at least until the plane is around 80 kmh (= 43 kias = 70 mph)!

What I could not understand (and perform) was just raising the nose so high because only the F-15 requires a similar maneuver to landing. Now I have to get used to the "strange" take-off and the management of engine power. In short, as many have advised me, it is only a matter of practice. With the hope that the developers do not decide to change the Mig-29 FM again!

[draconus]

Well, as you can see, there are a lot of people who appreciate the long awaited PFM. Too bad it reveals flaws in your handling. There is nothing strange in the take off, your fear of using the rudder is ridiculous and you keep forgetting to land slower with lower vertical speed (try 1-2m/s). When nose is high touchdown with just mains and keep the attitude for aerobraking. If you're running out of runway touch the nose and hit the brakes.

 

It looks like you have a general problem with sensitivity in your controls - use some more curves in axis' when needed. You can't master it in 5 days but you can land it decently enough to not crash at all.

[sylkhan]

Well, as you can see, there are a lot of people who appreciate the long awaited PFM.

And...?

I appreciate it too, but that doens't mean the FMs are correct.

Too bad it reveals flaws in your handling.

Hmmm, not cool...

 

There is nothing strange in the take off,

Sorry to disagree, The FMs have some flaws who need to be improve

 

It looks like you have a general problem with sensitivity in your controls - use some more curves in axis' when needed. You can't master it in 5 days but you can land it decently enough to not crash at all.

You need to know that afm/pfm, don't require curved axis, if you do that, you break the FMs.

Don't give bad advices.

[Ironhand]

OK! After having performed at least thirty landings (all disastrous), I finally managed to have five successes and one after the other! So, I can say that I learned how to land with the new Mig-29. As has been written by many people on the forum, the secret is to have high AOA (from 7 to 10 degrees) to the touchdown (at 140/150 kias = 260/280 kmh = 161/173 mph), then, very gently, start to lower the nose and immediately activate the parachute with full brakes. Do not touch the rudder at least until the plane is around 80 kmh (= 43 kias = 70 mph)!

What I could not understand (and perform) was just raising the nose so high because only the F-15 requires a similar maneuver to landing. Now I have to get used to the "strange" take-off and the management of engine power. In short, as many have advised me, it is only a matter of practice. With the hope that the developers do not decide to change the Mig-29 FM again!

Glad you finally got it sorted. Now you can enjoy this airframe even more. :)

 

Have you tried landing on roads again with your newly developed skill? Great fun. Ignore the turn around at the end. Not my finest moment. I was more worried about getting stuck than turning too quickly:

 

Edited November 3, 2018 by Ironhand

[Mars Exulte]

@Ironhand

I always fret about getting stuck, too. I was warning my dad about it, he said 'What, like this?' drove off into the ditch, drove in circles, popped a wheelie or two then moved back yo the runway and took off.

 

It never works that way for me. I get stuck virtually everytime.

 

@Flavnet

Congrats =) For more practice, try doing touch and goes where you never let the nose touch the ground. Requires a lot of finesse! When you can do it consistently, you know you're not just 'passing grade' but are actually 'good' =)

[draconus]

You need to know that afm/pfm, don't require curved axis, if you do that, you break the FMs.

Don't give bad advices.

No, FM is still the same, you don't break anything unless using FFB. Curve is just a tool for making our deficient hardware control setup more managable. It makes things easier and you gain more control. And while you comment on my advices I don't see yours.

I much prefer SMEs commenting on FM anyway.

 

 

@Ironhand: Nice mission setup there :)

[AeriaGloria]

Flavnet, glad to hear you stuck with it, I had my doubts from your first post if this was the best flying game for you but looks like it is, enjoy the endless amounts of satisfaction after hard work!

 

Iron hand, beautiful landing, need to try that myself

[flavnet]

Thanks folks! ... and incredible Ironhand! Congrats. I want to try it myself (maybe to succeed I will take a little more than five days)

[Stealth29U.K]

Hello everyone! I believe the new Mig-29 flight model is absolutely unsuitable for the simulation. Obviously, I have never piloted a Mig-29, but I think the simulated airplane is impossible to manage, during take-off, flight and landing. The take-off is very difficult: the run-up reaches over 300 km/h and there is always the risk of touching the track with the engines when you pull the stick back! The engine in flight is very difficult to manage: when it is at 80% of the power the plane continues to accelerate! It seems that the super-cruise was invented by the Russians with the Mig-29 not by the Americans with the F-22! Landing is a nightmare: assuming that you can reduce the speed of the plane (at least at 350-400 km/h). However, you can touch the track at any speed between 300 and 400 km/h, at an angle between 2 and 7 degrees, and the plane will always bounce off the track in a catastrophic way (total destruction)!!! I beg the developers to review something to make the Mig-29 FM enjoyable as that of the Su-27 (which still has a perfect FM and I hope it will not be changed for the worse).

Thanks for the attention.

 

Obviously I've never flown a real MiG29 either but yeah they have basically killed it for me me now too,I can take off and land ok now so il stick with it , fc2/fc3 is/was the only sim ive played for years and I got on fine and enjoyed it but now after this update its way over the top imo, I only do aerobatics and formation flying ,but i mean try doing a tailslide now for example and you'll end up up facing the other way up side down at around 0 degrees pitch, the rudder is just obscene imo, I said it in a thread I started about how the slightest press of my ch pedals (ive had to put a 55% curve in to try and tame it)and it just tries to flip you over etc,how the hell a real pilot could use that is beyond me, knife edge is virtually impossible now im finding, its just all over the shop, the curvature of the y axis feels to me like its constantly changing at different speeds, I could go on but like another person said on this thread the option to go back to SFM please, it might not have been realistic and true to life enough for some but ive been into flying mig29 sims for about 15years(nova logic before this) and it was real enough for me in SFM, (lol my only real life flying experience so far is 2 hours in a Piper Cherokee)

so yes, Thanks for a great sim ED but please can we have the option to go back to SFM ?

Edited November 4, 2018 by Stealth29(U.K)

[draconus]

That's actually one of a key features of MAC - "Professional level flight models, but with option for forgiving flight dynamics".

[Mars Exulte]

They're probably referring to game mode avionics and mouse control virtual stick, not actually different FMs persay

[=37.Sqn= Mjugen]

I adore MIG-29 now, it is just better in any way. Thanks ED.

Edited November 4, 2018 by Mjugen