WIP shots of the FRS1 SEA harrier

[Johnny Dioxin]

12 hours ago, westr said:

I just think surely they should have researched this more to ensure they could develop it before creating this map

That would bring me to a line of thinking that may be unpopular (especially with Razbam) but: Go back to the initial announcement of a Harrier being made for DCS by Razbam. There was a possibility of either a GR.7 or an AV-8B. Now I was pretty sure from square 1 what was coming (AV-8B), but was gobsmacked when they put up a poll to see what people wanted. I was amazed (but pleased) when the GR.7 came out on top. But we got the AV-8B anyway.

I was sure the AV-8B would be made from the start (before the poll) because, well it's a US aircraft and they probably make up the larger amount of customers (plus those who always go US etc) and when the poll came up, I thought we'd get that as the result.

I know Razbam came up with some reasoning for making the AV-8B instead, but I've got to say I don't really buy it. Surely, any half-competent developer (which they must be) would have checked on these things before making any kind of announcement of intent or even a poll to ask if customers wanted it?

I think they were expecting the AV-8B to win, hands-down, too, and so it didn't matter. Why do the poll in the first place, then? Dunno - maybe they thought there would be some backlash about it being an original British thing, really don't know. I must confess that after the GR.7 was chosen in the poll and the news came out they weren't doing it I lost interest in reading any more about it - just waited until the module was available - still day 1 buy, cos it's a Harrier!

Point I'm trying to make is that a) they don't have a record of making sound "roadmap" decisions, and b) their products as a group, don't seem to follow any kind of logic. Seems to be what they want to build, rather than any kind of "let's do scenario A and build the things involved in that scenario". So pretty much what Mr Smith is saying about DCS as a whole.

Now I'm heading for my bunker...

Edited December 4, 2023 by Johnny Dioxin

[captain_dalan]

On 12/1/2023 at 5:10 AM, Harlikwin said:

 

Well... Its lame, but they don't have much to work with for the SHAR. However, neither the Gr.1 and Gr.3 had a radar, and Razbam has hinted the Gr.3 might be possible. And as I recall the sooper snoot did serve in the falklands. 

But, per their roadmap...
1. There is still a plenty of work to do on the F15E for all ze weaponz and all ze datalinkz, and all ze new TGPs (god I hope ED actually models FLIR/IR someday that isn't terrible). 

2. The Mig23 is next in the pipeline and I'm hoping its consuming lots of resources. 

3. They have heavily hinted they will do the AV8B+, which would be logical since they can heavily leverage their F15 radar model for that. (ironically so could ED, but for reasons of pride IMO, they are doubling down on FC3 2.0 level radar for their modules which is a shame).

4. The Pucara, Super Taco thing, are also gonna be done at some point. 

Yeah, these all sound like good things to have, but for someone who has no nationalistic/patriotic reasons to feel any attachment to this conflict (i'm neither a Brit nor an Argentinian) i always dreamed of having the chance to fly both the Mirage III and FRS1 over this part of the world. I mean, all these 3 together, meant to me as much as the F-14 and Miramar combined, which says a lot  

[captain_dalan]

On 12/3/2023 at 3:03 PM, WWSmith said:

I've considered that possibility, too, which makes the South Atlantic Map's development even more of a head-scratcher for me.

Yep, absolutely pointless for me now. Which i why i didn't get it, even though it used to be one of the major items on my original wish list in my old signature  

[BIGNEWY]

Hi all, 

a reminder, please keep the discussion about DCS, not other sims. Our forum rules can be found at the top of the forum. 

thank you

[Silver_Dragon]

On 12/4/2023 at 10:49 AM, Johnny Dioxin said:

That would bring me to a line of thinking that may be unpopular (especially with Razbam) but: Go back to the initial announcement of a Harrier being made for DCS by Razbam. There was a possibility of either a GR.7 or an AV-8B. Now I was pretty sure from square 1 what was coming (AV-8B), but was gobsmacked when they put up a poll to see what people wanted. I was amazed (but pleased) when the GR.7 came out on top. But we got the AV-8B anyway.

The RAZBAM "legacy" products was a AV-8B+ and a GR.7, on fact, initialy RAZBAM start to develop other of your legacy as initial module, a T-2 buckeye, but was scraped and move to the M2000C and AV-8B, I think your initial plans was move your old product to DCS but the "license / available info" problems block them. On fact, the RAZBAM AV-8B first news appears on July, 2 2015, the claims about a Gr.7 apears on december, 2015, and the famous poll on january 2016. On february 2016, Prowler put a post over the problems to get info about the GR.7/9, a "Brick Wall". On April 2016 RAZBAM was follow betatesters to test the AV-8B EFM.

 

[SOLIDKREATE]

F

[Top Jockey]

Is this still going ?

[Harlikwin]

On 4/6/2024 at 5:26 AM, Top Jockey said:

Is this still going ?

Well, given the current "situation" between Raz and ED Its not looking great.

 

[LuseKofte]

10 minutes ago, Harlikwin said:

Well, given the current "situation" between Raz and ED Its not looking great.

 

capture from Reddit. It seems things might have cooled down a bit. 
and there is a interest of getting things sorted

[Top Jockey]

39 minutes ago, Harlikwin said:

Well, given the current "situation" between Raz and ED Its not looking great.

 

 

I hope the disagreement (whichever it might be) between both parties gets solved in an honest an effective fashion then.

[AvgeekJoe]

I would like someone to explain to me why having a FRS.1 Sea Harrier is not here yet please.  We have a Falklands Map, a Mirage 2000 if need be, and a freeware A-4 plus Mirages.  Plus the proper ships.

Edited April 28, 2024 by AvgeekJoe

[Mig Fulcrum]

5 ore fa, AvgeekJoe ha scritto:

I would like someone to explain to me why having a FRS.1 Sea Harrier is not here yet please.  We have a Falklands Map, a Mirage 2000 if need be, and a freeware A-4 plus Mirages.  Plus the proper ships.

 

Well, Mirage 2000 doesn't really fit

[Top Jockey]

2 hours ago, Mig Fulcrum said:

Well, Mirage 2000 doesn't really fit

 

The same here.

I might eventually buy the Falklands scenario, but only when we have the Sea Harrier FRS.1 and the Mirage IIIEA.

Edited April 28, 2024 by Top Jockey

[AvgeekJoe]

I know the Mirage 2000 doesn't fit, but it could be a facsimile of the Mirage IIIEA if need be.

[sirrah]

2 hours ago, AvgeekJoe said:

I know the Mirage 2000 doesn't fit, but it could be a facsimile of the Mirage IIIEA if need be.

Well, if you look at it like that, so can the AV8B

 

[Mig Fulcrum]

Falkland 2.0 The Revenge (c.a 1992) 

[Toga10]

another project to add to the razbam grave yard 

[lee1hy]

bring back f-15e first 

[AvgeekJoe]

Heartbreaking.

DCS World desperately needs a FRS.1.

[rkk01]

Ahhh well - all is now resolved…

we can’t have a Sea Harrier FRS.1 to fly from HMS Invincible, because the 1970s era Blue Fox radar is STILL CLASSIFIED

 

 

 

… but we can look forward to flying an F-35 from HMS Queen Elizabeth, because that’s OK…  

 

BONKERS

 

 

[AvgeekJoe]

11 hours ago, rkk01 said:

Ahhh well - all is now resolved…

we can’t have a Sea Harrier FRS.1 to fly from HMS Invincible, because the 1970s era Blue Fox radar is STILL CLASSIFIED

 

 

 

… but we can look forward to flying an F-35 from HMS Queen Elizabeth, because that’s OK…  

 

BONKERS

 

 

I share your frustation.  The 1982 Falklands War would be a fun sim to play out.

[jafa]

Frs1 for the Falkland's and a Gr3 for the up and coming cold war map ... yes please . 

[Harlikwin]

On 1/18/2025 at 9:16 PM, rkk01 said:

Ahhh well - all is now resolved…

we can’t have a Sea Harrier FRS.1 to fly from HMS Invincible, because the 1970s era Blue Fox radar is STILL CLASSIFIED

 

 

 

… but we can look forward to flying an F-35 from HMS Queen Elizabeth, because that’s OK…  

 

BONKERS

 

 

Yeah unfortunately some the later Blue Fox ECCM tech made it into captor and other radars and thats still classed. So there are no docs on the radar at all (destroyed in fact from what I heard). 

Ron mentioned they could do the Gr3 and there were enough docs for that. But well, given the current state of things thats unlikely too. 

 

On 1/19/2025 at 9:15 AM, AvgeekJoe said:

I share your frustation.  The 1982 Falklands War would be a fun sim to play out.

I mean, we don't have the 82 version of the map. (probably the easiest thing to fix, given its just using the "delete" tool)

We don't have a FRS.1 or GR.3 and likely never will. We don't have a mirage III of any sort or even one in the pipeline. 
The state of DCS ships/radars/sams is well in a word "grim" from a modeling/realism standpoint. 

So well... it is what it is unfortunately. 

[AvgeekJoe]

16 hours ago, Harlikwin said:

Yeah unfortunately some the later Blue Fox ECCM tech made it into captor and other radars and thats still classed. So there are no docs on the radar at all (destroyed in fact from what I heard). 

Ron mentioned they could do the Gr3 and there were enough docs for that. But well, given the current state of things thats unlikely too. 

 

I mean, we don't have the 82 version of the map. (probably the easiest thing to fix, given its just using the "delete" tool)

We don't have a FRS.1 or GR.3 and likely never will. We don't have a mirage III of any sort or even one in the pipeline. 
The state of DCS ships/radars/sams is well in a word "grim" from a modeling/realism standpoint. 

So well... it is what it is unfortunately. 

Thanks for this. I checked and the Blue Fox radar mk 1 DID go to the Falklands. Shoot, so whoever develops the Sea Harrier is going to have to INFER radar performance. Sea Harrier radars weren't all that useful over the 1982 Falklands skies though...

[Harlikwin]

9 hours ago, AvgeekJoe said:

Thanks for this. I checked and the Blue Fox radar mk 1 DID go to the Falklands. Shoot, so whoever develops the Sea Harrier is going to have to INFER radar performance. Sea Harrier radars weren't all that useful over the 1982 Falklands skies though...

Still no docs for the MK1 tho. The Anderwave stuff came later but from what I heard all the known manuals are/were for the later radars.

It's not even performance really, it's literally the buttonology/modes that aren't known. Other than that it was a fairly simple pulse radar for the mk1.