Patch Dec 17th Feedback Thread

[9thHunt]

4 minutes ago, Swordsman422 said:

 

It may be working for others, but I even ran a repair and no dice. Here is a couple screenshots of the list with no VF-11 or VF-33.

And just for gits and shiggles, the F-14A coremod livery folder.

 

just to be sure, you're looking in the Open Beta folder, right?

[Swordsman422]

That's the only install I have. I'm going around this corner one more time.

[IronMike]

weird Swordsman. might have something glitched up during the update...
 

32 minutes ago, eatthis said:

lol the direction cant be classified SURELY??

 

The thing is, it isn't necessary a direction. To put that in words would increase the patchlog length tenfold at times, it is a bunch of values in tables, functions etc that get adjusted, which doesn't always result in a visible directional change for one, for the other is often adjusted to make something feel more correctly, due to SME input, etc... And feel equally is hard to be described unless you use paragraphs full of words. Lastly, some things we do not want to disclose.

If the change describes a clear directional change of a felt value, then it is usually mentioned, like here:

"Slightly reduced transonic airframe drag"

Hope that makes sense.

Edited December 17, 2020 by IronMike

[Skysurfer]

Good stuff so far! The new liveries and LAU-7 corrections are much appreciated (although the latter haven't been applied to all liveries yet some high viz -B's included). Would love to see the TCS internals be textured and the A having proper pilot and helmet textures for each livery (you can mostly copy over some of them from the B since they are the same squadrons). Haven't tested it too much but glad seing these updates and hopefully early next year we'll se the rest of the -A models, various art and ground physics improvements and the long awaited Forrestal! 

Edited December 17, 2020 by Skysurfer

[Ramsay]

31 minutes ago, Swordsman422 said:

 

It may be working for others, but I even ran a repair and no dice. Here is a couple screenshots of the list with no VF-11 or VF-33.

And just for gits and shiggles, the F-14A coremod livery folder.

 

 

Just finished downloading, no issue here.

 

 

[Raven (Elysian Angel)]

So far it seems that Phoenix terminal guidance is still a problem: I have witnessed most of my launched Phoenixes simply flying straight, completely ignoring their target.
I'll continue testing: all I've done so far is run the BVR Instant Action missions a few times.

 

Hit rate in the SoH IA mission for both the -B and -A version is about 50%, not a single Phoenix that I launched in the Syria one further than 12 nm connected. I accelerated to M1.1 each time before launching.

[IronMike]

Just now, Raven (Elysian Angel) said:

So far it seems that Phoenix terminal guidance is still a problem: I have witnessed most of my launched Phoenixes simply flying straight, completely ignoring their target.
I'll continue testing: all I've done so far is run the BVR Instant Action missions a few times.

 

Hit rate in the SoH IA mission for both the -B and -A version is about 50%, not a single Phoenix that I launched in the Syria one further than 12 nm connected. I accelerated to M1.1 each time before launching.

Thank you, but it's hard to tell anything from that, when not seeing the setup, what the bandit is doing, knowing more about your config and initial attack parameters, etc etc.. This could be buggy, or just a natural consequence of the situation or a mix of both.. tacview, video, etc. helps greatly here.

[Calinho]

My F-14A can't pass mach 1.0

Am i doing something wrong?

 

41K feet

F-14A lebanon free flight quick mission

zone 5 burner

droped all weapows and fuel tanks

 

After 3 minutes of full burner, engines blow up

 

Image attached below

 

 

Edited December 18, 2020 by Calinho

[Swordsman422]

I rolled back and reupdated. I dunno what happened first time around. My network could have hiccupped. It's fine now.

[diditopgun]

32 minutes ago, Calinho said:

My F-14A can't pass mach 1.0

Am i doing something wrong?

 

41K feet

F-14A lebanon free flight quick mission

zone 5 burner

droped all weapows and fuel tanks

 

After 3 minutes of full burner, engines blow up

 

Image attached below

 

 

 

 

After today's patch, F-14A no weapons (but with underwing and underbelly pylons), 2 fuel tanks, at about 36000ft.

 

With 2 fuel tanks I can't go over mach 1.2

 

After jettison fuel tanks I reach mach 2.2

 

Going through mach 0.9-1.2 zone with the F-14A is a real pain...

 

[wess24m]

47 minutes ago, Raven (Elysian Angel) said:

So far it seems that Phoenix terminal guidance is still a problem: I have witnessed most of my launched Phoenixes simply flying straight, completely ignoring their target.
I'll continue testing: all I've done so far is run the BVR Instant Action missions a few times.

 

Hit rate in the SoH IA mission for both the -B and -A version is about 50%, not a single Phoenix that I launched in the Syria one further than 12 nm connected. I accelerated to M1.1 each time before launching.

I agree, flew about an hour and a half on MP.  Maintained lock with all the engagements with both STT as well as TWS.  Fired 8 54's and no hits, none even attempted.  As you said they will guide to the target then within visual range (missile to target) they just go dumb and fly straight.  These engagements were between 40-25 miles while at between 25k-35k.  Tried both the A and C versions.  

 

Only a few of the targets were evading, most of the time the missiles just sail over the targets by a 1000-2000 feet without even turning hot.

[Flash_111]

You can get the F-14A supersonic by zoom climbing up to altitude (I have been using 35K+), then unloading (zero G) and holding it there until you are through mach 1.2. Once you are through that transonic regime recover with something like 4G to get back to level. It is pretty happy to stay fast as long as you don't let it drop back below mach 1.2 by maneuvering or climbing too aggressively. If you are clean, it will continue to accelerate from there up to mach 2.3. If you have a combat load it will top out around mach 1.3. I don't know if this behavior is 100% accurate, but it works. In my experience trying to go through that mach 1.1 range, the engine temps spike. Clean jet will get through that transonic regime fast enough that the heat doesn't cause damage. A combat load will take too long and destroy the engines- so I use the dive technique described above.

 

Subsonic performance seems much better though.

[IronMike]

2 minutes ago, Flash_111 said:

You can get the F-14A supersonic by zoom climbing up to altitude (I have been using 35K+), then unloading (zero G) and holding it there until you are through mach 1.2. Once you are through that transonic regime recover with something like 4G to get back to level. It is pretty happy to stay fast as long as you don't let it drop back below mach 1.2 by maneuvering or climbing too aggressively. If you are clean, it will continue to accelerate from there up to mach 2.3. If you have a combat load it will top out around mach 1.3. I don't know if this behavior is 100% accurate, but it works. In my experience trying to go through that mach 1.1 range, the engine temps spike. Clean jet will get through that transonic regime fast enough that the heat doesn't cause damage. A combat load will take too long and destroy the engines- so I use the dive technique described above.

 

Subsonic performance seems much better though.

Very well put. Creason fixed also the random explosion that was happening before, so it shouldnt come from that anymore. We will still take a look that the overheating/ etc works as it should.

[Skysurfer]

28 minutes ago, Flash_111 said:

You can get the F-14A supersonic by zoom climbing up to altitude (I have been using 35K+), then unloading (zero G) and holding it there until you are through mach 1.2. Once you are through that transonic regime recover with something like 4G to get back to level. It is pretty happy to stay fast as long as you don't let it drop back below mach 1.2 by maneuvering or climbing too aggressively. If you are clean, it will continue to accelerate from there up to mach 2.3. If you have a combat load it will top out around mach 1.3. I don't know if this behavior is 100% accurate, but it works. In my experience trying to go through that mach 1.1 range, the engine temps spike. Clean jet will get through that transonic regime fast enough that the heat doesn't cause damage. A combat load will take too long and destroy the engines- so I use the dive technique described above.

 

Subsonic performance seems much better though.

 

Still wonder why transsonic drag would be this high? I thought this was confirmed a bug and supposed to be fixed in this patch? 

[Northstar98]

4 hours ago, IronMike said:

- iirc: IRL it would, but not in DCS, as active is kind of hard-modeled, means a missile can be either or, but not both. iirc, and Naquaii can correct me here if I am wrong, IRL it could also be both active and SARH at the same time, something which isn't possible in DCS.

 

Hmm, I wonder if ED could factor this into the missile API to allow this to work. 

[monacoBMW]

I've had some odd Phoenix behavior too after today's update. I've had multiple shots run out of energy from a target within 20 miles or so, which I've never had happen before unless I'm chasing a target - in these instances I was either head on or they were flanking. When I F6 them I can see them maneuver way more than the target is and thus bleed off a ton of speed in the process.

 

And then in two scenarios I've had the first Phoenix shot track while the second goes straight off into the nether even though it appears that Jester has both targets queued up correctly. They're either never tracking to begin with or lose lock by the time they go pitbull. I'm not exactly an expert on this but I've engaged two ships with Phoenixes numerous times and never had this happen before. I'll see if I can get a track of this. And yes, it's definitely possible that I'm just doing something wrong lol

 

edit: of course now I can't reproduce

Edited December 18, 2020 by monacoBMW

[Swordsman422]

Successfully guided a cow bomb into a bunker for the first time. Nice to have the GBU-24 working now and ecstatic that my first successful drop with it was from HB's F-14A. I'm so glad we got Bombcats!

[NeedzWD40]

I've noticed inconsistent performance from all AIM-7s launched in the F-14; the M model works the best but still has some teething reliability issues, while the MH and F models flat out miss in perfect conditions. The F/A-18C has none of these issues with any of the same models. This is related to this bug report from October, which I've appended my recent tracks to.

[near_blind]

4 hours ago, NeedzWD40 said:

I've noticed inconsistent performance from all AIM-7s launched in the F-14; the M model works the best but still has some teething reliability issues, while the MH and F models flat out miss in perfect conditions. The F/A-18C has none of these issues with any of the same models. This is related to this bug report from October, which I've appended my recent tracks to.

 

Concurring with everything here. The M still seems to the most reliable, but seems to exhibiting the problematic behavior more than I've seen in the last two patches. The MH is still extremely prone to the issue. Haven't tried the F yet. 

[MBot]

Trans-sonic performance of the F-14A still seems to be the same. Armed, the jet struggles to go supersonic in level flight.

 

I thought that has been fixed. Very disappointing to have to see this for another month.

 

  

8 hours ago, IronMike said:

8 hours ago, Flash_111 said:

You can get the F-14A supersonic by zoom climbing up to altitude (I have been using 35K+), then unloading (zero G) and holding it there until you are through mach 1.2. Once you are through that transonic regime recover with something like 4G to get back to level. It is pretty happy to stay fast as long as you don't let it drop back below mach 1.2 by maneuvering or climbing too aggressively. If you are clean, it will continue to accelerate from there up to mach 2.3. If you have a combat load it will top out around mach 1.3.[...]

Very well put.

 

Are you suggesting that this is the behaviour we should expect from the F-14A?

Edited December 18, 2020 by MBot

[*Aquila*]

It will be a short feedback. Due to the persistent failure in simulating its BVR armament, the F-14 is a rewarding ground attack aircraft in DCS, as soon as there's no air opponents or Hornet guys shot them down. It's also a pleasant toy to buzz all around the place and have some 1v1 ACM fun with a buddy. But it's not a BVR fighter, which is a problem as we're talking about the legendary F-14 Tomcat.

 

I've been one of the most enthusiastic guys about this module but sorry guys : the story is starting to look like the one of some of the most frustrating modules around here. When the Tomcat was released, anger was red hot against ED about the Hornet's development, and everybody who got their hand on the Cat felt reconciled with DCS and modern jet sims. As of today, that feeling is back in the Hornet's seat but fled far away from the Tomcat's ones.

[Lurker]

Can someone point where the F14 BVR instant action mission is located as I can't seem to find it under the "Instant Action" tab in the game? (Id like to do some testing)

[*Aquila*]

5 minutes ago, Lurker said:

Can someone point where the F14 BVR instant action mission is located as I can't seem to find it under the "Instant Action" tab in the game? (Id like to do some testing)

Try this: \Eagle Dynamics\DCS World OpenBeta\Mods\aircraft\F14\Missions\QuickStart

[jojo]

23 minutes ago, MBot said:

Trans-sonic performance of the F-14A still seems to be the same. Armed, the jet struggles to go supersonic in level flight.

 

I thought that has been fixed. Very disappointing to have to see this for another month.

 

  

 

Are you suggesting that this is the behaviour we should expect from the F-14A?

 

I’m not a Tomcat expert, but unloading at high altitude to go through transonic speed is quite common practice.

Watch this fun story, the pilot describes the same acceleration procedure.

 

[Lurker]

Thanks Aquila