correct as-is Data link info

[oldpop]

as seen in the att'ed I am getting a "full diamond" on SA and radar page with my radar in "sil" mode

[BIGNEWY]

Looks correct, that is a SURV track. 

[Harker]

What BN said. You'll notice that this is not a full-size HAFU, but a smaller one. This means that it's a SURV-only track.

It goes:
Ownship only: Full size, top part only
Donated + Ownship: Full size, top + bottom parts
F/F donated: Full size, bottom part only
SURV donated: small size, top + bottom parts (although SURV-only tracks are just one thing, they don't have top or bottom parts, it's just the small symbol)

[Tholozor]

Additionally, if it's a full HAFU that your radar has picked up, the track file will be ranked.

[AvroLanc]

SURV is 'Surveillance' i.e AWACS. 'Not Surface'

 

Your screenshot shows two overlapping small diamonds, with nothing in the middle. There are a few issues with the HAFU's / SA page etc, but this is normal.

[Foka]

As always - RTFM - Read The Frindly  Manual

 

[Top Jockey]

Hello everyone,

I'm experimenting with creating custom missions, for Datalink employment, though I have some doubts :

- receiving the datalink enemy aircraft contacts from E-2 Hawkeye, is it possible to see those contacts on the HUD ?

- is it all it takes when creating a basic mission, to just activate the EPLRS task for the E-2 Hawkeye ?

 

Thank you.

[Tholozor]

Datalink information is not presented in the HUD.

Second point, yes, just plop an E-2 or E-3 down with the AWACS task, and it should donate to the network what it sees.

[Top Jockey]

1 hour ago, Tholozor said:

Datalink information is not presented in the HUD.

Second point, yes, just plop an E-2 or E-3 down with the AWACS task, and it should donate to the network what it sees.

Thank you @Tholozor,

Everything seems to be working ok from my experiments - only thing is, I thought the E-2 could detect enemy aircraft sooner.

 

Is there a way to keep the SA page cursor automatically centered at the enemy contact, or select it in some sort ?

(So, one doesn't have to be always trying to keep follow it with the TDC ? )

 

[Harker]

1 hour ago, Top Jockey said:

Thank you @Tholozor,

Everything seems to be working ok from my experiments - only thing is, I thought the E-2 could detect enemy aircraft sooner.

 

Is there a way to keep the SA page cursor automatically centered at the enemy contact, or select it in some sort ?

(So, one doesn't have to be always trying to keep follow it with the TDC ? )

 

You can place the TDC over the desired contact and press STEP. This will remove the TDC and place a box around the contact. You can also use STEP without the TDC and it should step the box through contacts, in order of rank (in DCS it's kinda random sometimes). Or if you have an L&S, it should always be stepped on first.

Be aware that STEP can exit by itself on occasion. But in principle, it should allow you to have info on a contact, hands-free.

Edited April 3, 2022 by Harker

[Tholozor]

You can either use the STEP option on the SA page to highlight a trackfile, or if you cursor over it, you can either press the EXP option or Recce button on the stick to enter expand mode, which centers on the track and sets the scale to 5nm.

Edit: Sniped, nice shot @Harker!

Edited April 3, 2022 by Tholozor

[Top Jockey]

10 hours ago, Harker said:

You can place the TDC over the desired contact and press STEP. This will remove the TDC and place a box around the contact. You can also use STEP without the TDC and it should step the box through contacts, in order of rank (in DCS it's kinda random sometimes). Or if you have an L&S, it should always be stepped on first.

Be aware that STEP can exit by itself on occasion. But in principle, it should allow you to have info on a contact, hands-free.

 

 

10 hours ago, Tholozor said:

You can either use the STEP option on the SA page to highlight a trackfile, or if you cursor over it, you can either press the EXP option or Recce button on the stick to enter expand mode, which centers on the track and sets the scale to 5nm.

Edit: Sniped, nice shot @Harker!

 

 

Thank you guys, I'll try it soon.

Being yet a noob regarding the AWACS / Datalink utility in Air-Air warfare, I would appreciate your insight:

 

1 - at first sight I can only recal its usefullness to: silently gain advantageous positioning on the enemy aircraft and launch an AIM-9 ?

(or even an AIM-120 in 'pitbull' mode?)

2 - it's a pitty that AWACS / Datalink contacts aren't portrayed to the HUD;

3 - the only way to engage the enemy aircraft in my previous point 1. would be:

> sneak aproach him and get to his 6 o'clock, by navigating with the help of the Datalink info at the SA page > visually locate him with the JHMCS > aim your missiles accordingly and shoot when in range

Is this it ?

Thank you.

[Harker]

 
Thank you guys, I'll try it soon.
Being yet a noob regarding the AWACS / Datalink utility in Air-Air warfare, I would appreciate your insight:
 
1 - at first sight I can only recal its usefullness to: silently gain advantageous positioning on the enemy aircraft and launch an AIM-9 ?
(or even an AIM-120 in 'pitbull' mode?)
2 - it's a pitty that AWACS / Datalink contacts aren't portrayed to the HUD;
3 - the only way to engage the enemy aircraft in my previous point 1. would be:
> sneak aproach him and get to his 6 o'clock, by navigating with the help of the Datalink info at the SA page > visually locate him with the JHMCS > aim your missiles accordingly and shoot when in range
Is this it ?
Thank you.

Well, the main point is that you get to have situational awareness of your surroundings, regardless of what you see with your radar. What you do with that info, is up to you.

I personally use the SA to make tactical decisions, on when to commit, when to re-attack etc. Just keep in mind that DL-only info has a 12 second update rate, in DCS.

You can indeed use it to silently hunt for targets and either go for AIM-9s or enable your radar for just one sweep with ACTIVE, find them and launch an AMRAAM (I'd still recommend that over MADDOG launches). You can set up your radar's azimuth and elevation before going Active, based on the datalink info.

You can also use it to help you quickly lock targets with LHAQ. You can see the target's DL info with the JHMCS and use LHAQ to get a lock from further out. You can do this straight out of SIL, as entering an ACM mode will automatically exit SIL.

Also, in the future, once/if MSI is properly implemented, you'll be able to designate DL-only trackfiles with your radar, in the same way as you can do now, with radar trackfiles, allowing you to, for example, receive targeting and intercept cues on them from further out or from within SIL. And they can also be included in the ranking order and designated for TWS AUTO. But this is all functionality that's not implemented right now, so we'll have to wait until it is.

[Top Jockey]

9 hours ago, Harker said:

 

 

Well, the main point is that you get to have situational awareness of your surroundings, regardless of what you see with your radar. What you do with that info, is up to you.

I personally use the SA to make tactical decisions, on when to commit, when to re-attack etc. Just keep in mind that DL-only info has a 12 second update rate, in DCS.

You can indeed use it to silently hunt for targets and either go for AIM-9s or enable your radar for just one sweep with ACTIVE, find them and launch an AMRAAM (I'd still recommend that over MADDOG launches). You can set up your radar's azimuth and elevation before going Active, based on the datalink info.

You can also use it to help you quickly lock targets with LHAQ. You can see the target's DL info with the JHMCS and use LHAQ to get a lock from further out. You can do this straight out of SIL, as entering an ACM mode will automatically exit SIL.

Also, in the future, once/if MSI is properly implemented, you'll be able to designate DL-only trackfiles with your radar, in the same way as you can do now, with radar trackfiles, allowing you to, for example, receive targeting and intercept cues on them from further out or from within SIL. And they can also be included in the ranking order and designated for TWS AUTO. But this is all functionality that's not implemented right now, so we'll have to wait until it is.

 

Thank you Harker.

Yep, my bad, mentioned 'Pitbul', when it is 'Maddog'.

All that is interesting - I would really enjoy to see that implemented.

 

What I would find really interesting, is what I imagine as kind of an AIM-120 'silent shot': something like guiding the missile via Datalink from AWACS (until the missile goes active by itself) with the Hornet's radar on SIL, is something like this possible ?

[Dragon1-1]

Not with the version we have, although perhaps this capability had been added to one of the more recent versions. 

[Top Jockey]

9 minutes ago, Dragon1-1 said:

Not with the version we have, although perhaps this capability had been added to one of the more recent versions. 

Interesting indeed - basically a "radio controlled" missile.

Edited April 4, 2022 by Top Jockey

[Hulkbust44]

Not with the version we have, although perhaps this capability had been added to one of the more recent versions. 

Not entirely true. You should absolutely be able to guide the missile with data from an off-board donor. It's just that it's your radar antenna that's used to send commands to the missiles so you don't need to see them on radar, but the nose needs to be pointed in that direction.

[Top Jockey]

6 minutes ago, Hulkbust44 said:

Not entirely true. You should absolutely be able to guide the missile with data from an off-board donor. It's just that it's your radar antenna that's used to send commands to the missiles so you don't need to see them on radar, but the nose needs to be pointed in that direction.

 

Is that feature present in the last open beta DCS F/A-18C ?

Edited April 5, 2022 by Top Jockey

[Dragon1-1]

No, I meant the real missile, or the real aircraft of the model that we have, do not support that functionality. It's nothing particularly fancy these days, so there's a chance a later model AMRAAM, working with later model jets, has it.

36 minutes ago, Hulkbust44 said:

Not entirely true. You should absolutely be able to guide the missile with data from an off-board donor. It's just that it's your radar antenna that's used to send commands to the missiles so you don't need to see them on radar, but the nose needs to be pointed in that direction.

AFAIK, the software in the jets we have doesn't allow that. You can't use DL to cue a shot, at the time our aircraft were made, it wasn't quite reliable enough. Nowadays, it's probably a thing.

[Hulkbust44]

No, I meant the real missile, or the real aircraft of the model that we have, do not support that functionality. It's nothing particularly fancy these days, so there's a chance a later model AMRAAM, working with later model jets, has it.
AFAIK, the software in the jets we have doesn't allow that. You can't use DL to cue a shot, at the time our aircraft were made, it wasn't quite reliable enough. Nowadays, it's probably a thing.

It absolutely can. It's a tack file the jet created from a donor.

[Top Jockey]

35 minutes ago, Hulkbust44 said:

It absolutely can. It's a tack file the jet created from a donor.

 

 

But is it featured in DCS ?

[Hulkbust44]

 
But is it featured in DCS ?

Oh no not at all, ED barely knows what MSI is.

[Dragon1-1]

5 hours ago, Hulkbust44 said:

It absolutely can. It's a tack file the jet created from a donor.

 

It's not a normal track, it's a datalink track. Unless you can provide an unclassified document stating that it's possible to designate a DL track for weapons employment, knock it off. I certainly didn't see anything like that in docs that the other Viper sim comes with (not sure if they're OK to post or not, but they're sure easy to find). At least in the F-16, DL tracks are treated differently, you can't bug them in either TWS or RWS, because they're not detected by radar. Only ownship tracks can be designated and launched at. Not sure how it works in the Hornet, but it's the same generation, so probably not much difference.

[Tholozor]

I believe there's also a distinction between a SURV track from AWACS versus a donor track from another aircraft. You can see this on occasion where a track is only displayed by the lower half of a full-size HAFU versus the full HAFU at 75% size of the SURV track.

[Swift.]

1 hour ago, Dragon1-1 said:

It's not a normal track, it's a datalink track. Unless you can provide an unclassified document stating that it's possible to designate a DL track for weapons employment, knock it off. I certainly didn't see anything like that in docs that the other Viper sim comes with (not sure if they're OK to post or not, but they're sure easy to find). At least in the F-16, DL tracks are treated differently, you can't bug them in either TWS or RWS, because they're not detected by radar. Only ownship tracks can be designated and launched at. Not sure how it works in the Hornet, but it's the same generation, so probably not much difference.

Hold on are you trying to tell me that a set of viper documents might not comprehensively describe the hornet? That is simply preposterous.

As we all well know viper and hornet are basically the same jet, and that the capabilities of one (or lack of capabilities for that matter) carry over directly the other.

I see also that you've identified that if an unclass document doesn't describe a feature then that feature doesn't exist. That's why JDAMs don't exist yeah?