HARM POS Threat Selection via HOTAS?

[Nealius]

I can cycle through the Threat Tables with TMS-left, but I know there was a HOTAS command to cycle through the displayed threat list on the left column. I want to say it was TMS-right, but I tried all the TMS commands and DMS commands and nothing took. I'm probably forgetting the proper command, and I can't find it in any of my limited documentation; or tutorials. Anybody know all the HOTAS commands in the HARM modes? I'm fairly certain HAS and all POS modes can be manipulated completely from HOTAS. 

[Frederf]

TMS left for cycle table

TMS right for cycle threat within table

[_SteelFalcon_]

TMS right doesnt work for me when trying to select a threat. Is it not implemented yet?

TMS left works fine

[Moonshine]

while cycling between the threat tables does work with TMS left, TMS right doesnt seem to do anything. remapping the controls did nothing and using the default keybinds also didnt work out. what am I missing?

[Nealius]

Maybe not implemented yet? I also noticed the WPN page doesn't get boxed when SOI, but TMS-left doesn't work unless you DMS-down first. 

Edited July 17, 2021 by Nealius

[Raptor9]

TMS right will step through any other radars of the currently tracked type that are within the HAS field of view.

 

For example, let's say you are approaching an airfield being defended by two SA-15s and two SA-19s. As you approach you see two "15" symbols and two SA-"19" symbols. You cursor over a 15 and select TMS up to start tracking that emitter. When you do this, if the other "15" is within the HAS field of view, you can select TMS right to cycle between each SA-15 emitter for engagement with that missile. If you want to shoot an SA-19, you would have to use TMS up again to stop tracking the currently selected SA-15.

 

This is the DCS F-16 HOTAS behavior for HAS mode, but that is on the assumption you are already tracking an emitter before you launch the missile. With the other modes currently in game at the moment, the HARM is going to a steerpoint when it is launched, not necessarily a specifically-tracked emitter, so the functionality may not be there.

[Frederf]

POS

[Nealius]

To summarize so far, TMS-right works for cycling emitters in HAS but hasn't been implemented in POS modes yet? It seems odd that it's left out of the POS modes when it seems to work in HAS mode.

[_SteelFalcon_]

Doesnt seem to work in POS yet

[Nealius]

Guess I'll go back to the Hornet for SEAD until it's in. PB lofting on two targets is rough trying to deal with that asymmetric load with your weak hand while fumbling for the mouse with your dominant hand. 

[Furiz]

On 7/17/2021 at 12:14 PM, Nealius said:

Guess I'll go back to the Hornet for SEAD until it's in. PB lofting on two targets is rough trying to deal with that asymmetric load with your weak hand while fumbling for the mouse with your dominant hand. 

 

I don't think Hornet is any easier when engaging 2 different SAM types in PB mode. You have to manually punch in the SAM code while doing the same stick and mouse movement like in Viper.

[Nealius]

Hornet's TOO mode can be done totally hands-off. At the moment it looks like none of the Viper's HARM modes can be done hands-off. Unless the TMS-right does work on HAS mode. 

[SFJackBauer]

On 7/17/2021 at 7:14 AM, Nealius said:

 trying to deal with that asymmetric load

 

Autopilot, heading select or steerpoint

 

 

4 hours ago, Nealius said:

Hornet's TOO mode can be done totally hands-off

 

As the HAS in the Viper. I assume you mean hands-off = HOTAS.

 

I'd say even better in the Viper, because you can pre-select only one or two specific emitters to scan, allowing faster re-attack / ripple fire than the Hornet coarse class-based emitter selection.

Edited July 19, 2021 by SFJackBauer

[Nealius]

Autopilot isn't hands-off and preculdes lofting. 

 

I'll have to play with HAS mode for a change. I've always prefered PB mode due to the combination of loft cueing, steerpoint precision, and full HOTAS integration, but since the integration isn't complete it's not as efficient to use as it should be. At least not without some Cougar MFDs or something, which I'm looking into whenever they get restocked. 

[SFJackBauer]

But you are comparing Hornet's TOO to Viper PB / POS. The equivalent on Viper is indeed HAS.

 

Autopilot does not precludes lofting in PB as the missile itself lofts, but if you want, you can even pitch up to say 30 degrees and activate AP ATT HOLD.

Edited July 19, 2021 by SFJackBauer

[skywalker22]

Or you can simply click on OSBs, at least I do.

[Furiz]

5 hours ago, Nealius said:

Hornet's TOO mode can be done totally hands-off. At the moment it looks like none of the Viper's HARM modes can be done hands-off. Unless the TMS-right does work on HAS mode. 

 

Yea, but please read my post and the one I quoted again, you will notice that he is not talking about TOO mode, he is talking about Hornet PB mode. In which you have to enter the desired code to hit the desired radar emitter.

[Nealius]

The whole point of this discussion is to employ HARMs in POS modes without touching the mouse, which should be possible via TMS-right to select the emitters in the selected table. 

 

Barring that, the next point is employing HARMs in any mode without touching the mouse, as is possible in Hornet's TOO mode, which is why I brought it up: It can be done hands-off which is the point.

 

Can Viper's HAS be employed completely hands-off? 

Edited July 19, 2021 by Nealius

[Frederf]

Yes, enable to change modes (not implemented yet?), TMS left to cycle tables, pinky to change FOV, TMS up to handoff

[Nealius]

8 hours ago, Frederf said:

Yes, enable to change modes (not implemented yet?), TMS left to cycle tables, pinky to change FOV, TMS up to handoff

 

Cursor Enable to cycle HAS/POS? I vaguely recall that one from "the other sim." It seems ike the Viper is still missing a lot of the ergonomics that it needs despite having a lot of its core systems running now. 

[Frederf]

It's an older function that I assume continues forward to the 4.3/5.1 era of the DCS module. Enable cycles POS-HAS-DL.

 

For HAS you pick threat type by selecting one example of a threat with the TMS forward cursor which removes all emitters other than the selected type (other types stay in the box for a few sec). Each table can have threats deselected from the table to speed up the scan time. Then only the remaining emitters of that type or subtype remain if they aren't colocated. Depending what I read either TMS right or uncage (probably TMS right for this variant) cycles through these. "RDY" will be blanked while handoff changes. Colocated emitters of the same major type will just report as the programmed highest priority emitter of the group (e.g.  search, track, engagement radar will be replaced by a symbol for the whole SAM system). So for example if there are 3 SA-6s in front of you you pick one but you can still cycle through them after picking that type. If you lose view for too long before launch system returns to search. If the particular threat is lost (say it stops radiating) that highlighted threat will flash. The other threats of that type will remain. The other threat types will still be blanked.

 

Threats which have radiated but stopped will continue to show up on the display. Only when the threat is cycled to as the highlighted one will the system test if it's still active. It doesn't say what happens if it's not confirmed active. I assume symbol drops off display and previous threat remains primary (or back before designate if designating from search).

[Nealius]

Haven't had a chance to fly since the recent update and subsequent Hotfix. I'm guessing these HOTAS functions still aren't in yet?

[AlexCaboose]

They’re not in. Maybe this will come when we get the HTS pod.

[Nealius]

I hope so. Still weird to have POS HOTAS commands come with a completely different submode, though. 

[AlexCaboose]

I've stopped trying to make sense of why things are the way they are a long time ago. Hopefully when the HAD page is released, they'll do another pass.