Virpil collective base plus - had to increase friction after 2 weeks use

[YoYo]

7 hours ago, HC_Official said:

Owned one of these for 3 months now, you will be adjusting this every 2 weeks or so with daily use

Thx, pity. The mechanism should probably be a bit different but I will have to live with it when Apache comes out  , maybe it would be a good idea to make a counterweight someday. I have one idea ...

Edited December 12, 2021 by YoYo

[Wychmaster]

Am 12.9.2021 um 12:14 schrieb 98abaile:

 Thankfully I have a 3D printer, so at some point I'll be looking to add a counter weight (probably a side plate replacement) to take some of the load off the clutch.

I am also thinking about that. But I don't think that i need a 3d printer for that. I will probably use the existing screws and add something in between

[HC_Official]

one of the guys I fly with has added a counter weight to his, only thing that would concern me about it is extra wear/force  on the mechanism

[Vakarian]

Would adding hydraulic damper help alleviate some of these issues? I think I've seen it done somewhere but failed to see any conclusion

[HC_Official]

On 12/17/2021 at 1:34 PM, Vakarian said:

Would adding hydraulic damper help alleviate some of these issues? I think I've seen it done somewhere but failed to see any conclusion

nope I dont think it will help

[k1ebe]

I mounted a hydraulic damper to it the day I got my collective. It stays where I put it and the damping gives the movement some nice heft to it. 

[YoYo]

Oh nice idea too!

[YoYo]

Yesterday I made an addon with a counterweight, maybe it's not as nice as yours, but it also works .

[Gizzy]

Simple solution, a small length of elastic cord set so that when lowered the tension is increased.  Set a very slight engagement of the clutch to balance your tension of the elastic and you have a complete stiction free hand off hold at any position... virtually zero effort required... perfect!

Eventually I'll replace the cord with a black one and tidy the knot.

[YoYo]

Finally I mounted (with counterweight)  :

[jabbabzh]

Hi, is there someone who sell counterweight "mod" for collectiv?

[sirrah]

On 3/27/2022 at 11:20 AM, jabbabzh said:

Hi, is there someone who sell counterweight "mod" for collectiv?

It's actually quite easy to make yourself, as @YoYo shows (and a lot cheaper than buying some mod, if there even is one)

 

After ±7months use, unfortunately I now can confirm that the friction adjustment on the Virpil collectives really are a serious weak point in design...

I have had to increase tension on the hex bolts several times now. Last weekend I had to fasten 'em again and yesterday, during my DCS session when I had my hand off the collective for a moment, the collective dropped yet again!

 

I'm getting at the point that I too realize that a counterweight or dampener is a must.. Really sad, for such an expensive product! 

[dburne]

9 hours ago, sirrah said:

It's actually quite easy to make yourself, as @YoYo shows (and a lot cheaper than buying some mod, if there even is one)

 

After ±7months use, unfortunately I now can confirm that the friction adjustment on the Virpil collectives really are a serious weak point in design...

I have had to increase tension on the hex bolts several times now. Last weekend I had to fasten 'em again and yesterday, during my DCS session when I had my hand off the collective for a moment, the collective dropped yet again!

 

I'm getting at the point that I too realize that a counterweight or dampener is a must.. Really sad, for such an expensive product! 

 

Hmm that is good info to know. I was seriously considering ordering a Virpil Collective now that I am learning the Apache but that really turns me off. I would not be too happy with that, I would expect a product from them to be better (as I have experienced in their stick and throttle). I was holding off to make sure I will be able to stick with the Apache through much of the learning curve, but maybe now I will wait also and see if Virpil addresses what would appear to be a defect in their product design.

I love Virpil products I really do, and have raved many times over the CM3 Throttle and helped sell a few as well. I would not want to spend the kind of money they ask for their Collective and experience an issue such as this. I don't want a home remedy to get it to operate as it should. In the meantime I will just let my CM3 Throttle handle the Apache. And I have already ordered and received a Monster Tech Mount for my chair for the collective. 

Edited April 5, 2022 by dburne

[sirrah]

4 minutes ago, dburne said:

 

Hmm that is good info to know. I was seriously considering ordering a Virpil Collective now that I am learning the Apache but that really turns me off. I would not be too happy with that, I would expect a product from them to be better (as I have experienced in their stick and throttle). I was holding off to make sure I will be able to stick with the Apache through much of the learning curve, but maybe now I will wait also and see if Virpil addresses what would appear to be a defect in their product design.

I love Virpil products I really do, and have raved many times over the CM3 Throttle and helped sell a few as well. I would not want to spend the kind of money they ask for their Collective and experience an issue such as this. I don't want a home remedy to get it to operate as it should. In the meantime I will just let my CM3 Throttle handle the Apache. And I have already ordered and received a Monster Tech Mount for my chair for the collective. 

 

Well, note that I'm sharing my personal experience here.

Perhaps mine is just "bad" (although responses in this thread probably proof that I'm not the only one)

 

Also, apart from the friction issue, I must say that I really love using the collective. The Alpha-L grip I use on it, is perfect for the Apache. So it's not all bad

 

[dburne]

27 minutes ago, sirrah said:

Well, note that I'm sharing my personal experience here.

Perhaps mine is just "bad" (although responses in this thread probably proof that I'm not the only one)

 

Also, apart from the friction issue, I must say that I really love using the collective. The Alpha-L grip I use on it, is perfect for the Apache. So it's not all bad

 

 

I would think if one had to keep tightening, they would eventually run out of threads for tightening? Still sounds like a design flaw to me. Anyway thanks for the tip on the Apha-L grip, I will keep in mind for if/when I pull the trigger on the collective.

 

Edited April 5, 2022 by dburne

[dburne]

2 hours ago, sirrah said:

Well, note that I'm sharing my personal experience here.

Perhaps mine is just "bad" (although responses in this thread probably proof that I'm not the only one)

 

Also, apart from the friction issue, I must say that I really love using the collective. The Alpha-L grip I use on it, is perfect for the Apache. So it's not all bad

 

I am looking at the Virpil Webstore and do not see an Alpha-L Grip listed. I only see a Sharka-50 and a Hawk-60?

[zcaa0g]

6 minutes ago, dburne said:

I am looking at the Virpil Webstore and do not see an Alpha-L Grip listed. I only see a Sharka-50 and a Hawk-60?

It's just a standard flightstick grip classification like their F-14 grip, so it won't show up as a collective grip, just a regular flightstick grip as linked below:

https://virpil-controls.eu/shop/flightsticks/grips.html

[dburne]

Also curious if anyone is running the VPC Rotor TCS + Base? Is having the twist available for the throttle a nice feature and does it work as intended? Worth the extra (high) cost?

 

5 minutes ago, zcaa0g said:

It's just a standard flightstick grip classification like their F-14 grip, so it won't show up as a collective grip, just a regular flightstick grip as linked below:

https://virpil-controls.eu/shop/flightsticks/grips.html

Ah ok so you can use that also with collective, good to know thanks. I was kinda hoping they might release an Apache Grip soon, another reason I have been holding off... I keep finding reasons to holding off lol. Even though I already have the Monster Tech Chair Mount for it. Oh well if I don't end up doing this I am sure I can sell the mount.

Nice to see Virpil has gone with all metal triggers now.

Edited April 5, 2022 by dburne

[sirrah]

5 hours ago, dburne said:

Also curious if anyone is running the VPC Rotor TCS + Base? Is having the twist available for the throttle a nice feature and does it work as intended? Worth the extra (high) cost?

 

Ah ok so you can use that also with collective, good to know thanks. I was kinda hoping they might release an Apache Grip soon, another reason I have been holding off... I keep finding reasons to holding off lol. Even though I already have the Monster Tech Chair Mount for it. Oh well if I don't end up doing this I am sure I can sell the mount.

Nice to see Virpil has gone with all metal triggers now.

 

People are already modifying the TCS base with counter weights and dampeners to compensate the weight of current grips.

I assume a huge Apache grip will be even heavier than current grips, and if so, that won't help.

[HC_Official]

9 hours ago, sirrah said:

Well, note that I'm sharing my personal experience here.

Perhaps mine is just "bad" (although responses in this thread probably proof that I'm not the only one)

 

Also, apart from the friction issue, I must say that I really love using the collective. The Alpha-L grip I use on it, is perfect for the Apache. So it's not all bad

 

I fly helis a lot and I have to adjust my tension every so often, if I was better at mechanical stuff I might try to mod this with a counter weight

[guimcdo]

On 12/20/2021 at 1:05 PM, k1ebe said:

I mounted a hydraulic damper to it the day I got my collective. It stays where I put it and the damping gives the movement some nice heft to it. 

Hello, do you have other photo with different point of view ?

Thanks, and the idea is excellent

[k1ebe]

7 hours ago, guimcdo said:

Hello, do you have other photo with different point of view ?

Thanks, and the idea is excellent

The collar is a thing I 3D-printed to fit a 8mm machine screw which fits with the dampener.

[Scott-S6]

On 4/6/2022 at 6:03 AM, sirrah said:

People are already modifying the TCS base with counter weights and dampeners to compensate the weight of current grips.

I assume a huge Apache grip will be even heavier than current grips, and if so, that won't help.

I have mine setup with a blackhawk grip and an extension that makes it as long as an Apache grip - can confirm that the problem is exacerbated. I have a damper on mine and it doesn't completely remove the clutch problem (but it falls really slowly now, at least).

[dburne]

1 hour ago, Scott-S6 said:

I have mine setup with a blackhawk grip and an extension that makes it as long as an Apache grip - can confirm that the problem is exacerbated. I have a damper on mine and it doesn't completely remove the clutch problem (but it falls really slowly now, at least).

Augh decisions decisions. I am so ready to pull the trigger but something keeps holding me back, plus also if I do decide on throttle version or not. I keep thinking not on that one and maybe that will help this situation but I must say just the fact it seems to be a situation gives me hesitancy.

Anyone here have the non throttle version and does it also do this creeping down and needing repeating tightening of bolts until run out of threads?

[guimcdo]

17 hours ago, k1ebe said:

The collar is a thing I 3D-printed to fit a 8mm machine screw which fits with the dampener.

 

Thanks a lot, could you please provide the .step for the bracket ? or is it a proprietary design ?