Will the Hook ever be functionally implemented ?

[Shrike88]

Curious as we already have a base code layer that could probably be used from the aircraft carrier / F-18,and since we are always hearing that the F-16 team is also concurrently working on the 18 etc sharing the same devs.  It would add another layer of those with systems functions and bringing an aircraft back to the field.

https://theaviationgeekclub.com/impressive-footage-shows-a-u-s-air-force-f-16-fighting-falcon-conducting-an-aircraft-arresting-system-test/

Obviously the cable systems with a slower and lengthier arrest would have to be coded into the fields or either add a object that can be placed in the M.E. to simulate this cable system.  I know that the Sinai terrain has several cable systems indicated on the runways. 

Would be a great added feature.  

[SkateZilla]

The hook system is already there, you just have no land based arresting systems in DCS,.
Unless it was disabled to solve landing Vipers on carriers issue.,

Edited November 30, 2023 by SkateZilla

[AJaromir]

+1. I was just thinking about that. It would be nice to have implemented this emergency system.

 

[Duck21]

Has there been any news from either ED or HB regarding this topic? I mean simulating a sophisticated failure system of a Phantom without the ability to land and capture the longfield cable is a bit... useless? And obviously it would also be fun to use the emergency cable on all other hook-equipped aircraft.

ED already developed the required animation techniques for the Supercarrier, what's stopping them to use the same code and models for airfields? I know it's not a 1:1 replica on land, but still, the tech is there.

[SkateZilla]

Carrier Arresting Cables are different than Land based.

[rob10]

IIRC ED has indicated they currently have no plans to add land arresting gear (or it's very low priority).  That may change down the road, but don't expect it currently.

[Tank50us]

On 3/23/2024 at 9:33 AM, rob10 said:

IIRC ED has indicated they currently have no plans to add land arresting gear (or it's very low priority).  That may change down the road, but don't expect it currently.

Yeah, they have more important things on their plate at the moment. But it's possible for a 3rd party to develop it, and would probably be a good way for a 3rd party group to get their foot in the door with ED.

[draconus]

On 11/30/2023 at 2:15 PM, SkateZilla said:

The hook system is already there, you just have no land based arresting systems in DCS

At least we got the model in Sinai map:

[Silver_Dragon]

1 minute ago, draconus said:

At least we got the model in Sinai map:

But we have on the same situation. A "Placebo" without funtionality.

[draconus]

Just now, Silver_Dragon said:

But we have on the same situation. A "Placebo" without funtionality.

Same as what? I just said "the model" is there.

[SkateZilla]

9 hours ago, draconus said:

Same as what? I just said "the model" is there.

Model is there, the system (land based system) isnt.

There's other cable systems modelled on other maps, thats not new.

[SharpeXB]

I can’t quite see how you’d ever get the chance to use this in DCS. Unless you had random system failures enabled and just happened to have one that required this. The nature of combat damage in the sim is that you’re just completely destroyed nearly all the time. You wouldn’t get the chance to bring in a damaged jet. Unless it’s an A-10 which doesn’t have a hook. That’s the only DCS jet which I think combines survivability with a really accurate damage model. I really dig crash landings though so I’m all for it the Hog is the only modern plane I’ve done that in here and it was awesome!

Edited March 26 by SharpeXB

[upyr1]

On 3/23/2024 at 9:33 AM, rob10 said:

IIRC ED has indicated they currently have no plans to add land arresting gear (or it's very low priority).  That may change down the road, but don't expect it currently.

I'm not supprised it is low on their list, as it would require revamping the damage model to have the tail ripped out or landing gear collapse if you try to land a viper or mud hen on a carrier. The only USAF plane that might realistically land on a carrier would be the Phantom II then again that was originally a navy plane. 

[Tank50us]

1 hour ago, SharpeXB said:

I can’t quite see how you’d ever get the chance to use this in DCS. Unless you had random system failures enabled and just happened to have one that required this. The nature of combat damage in the sim is that you’re just completely destroyed nearly all the time. You wouldn’t get the chance to bring in a damaged jet. Unless it’s an A-10 which doesn’t have a hook. That’s the only DCS jet which I think combines survivability with a really accurate damage model. I really dig crash landings though so I’m all for it the Hog is the only modern plane I’ve done that in here and it was awesome!

 

Actually, you have several Viper and Hornet users that could make use of such a system as per their defense strategy. Sweden, Finland, Norway all share the same basic plan for a Soviet/Russian invasion in that the fighter squadrons scatter. In those scenarios you'd need either an aircraft with a hook in order to land on those short A runways, or an aircraft that can throw the thrust into reverse (like the Viggin). So part of the turn-around for the aircraft in those scenarios is to have the ground crew reset the hook while the pilot goes and takes five minutes to get a snack.

[SharpeXB]

10 minutes ago, Tank50us said:

Actually, you have several Viper and Hornet users that could make use of such a system as per their defense strategy. Sweden, Finland, Norway all share the same basic plan for a Soviet/Russian invasion in that the fighter squadrons scatter. In those scenarios you'd need either an aircraft with a hook in order to land on those short A runways, or an aircraft that can throw the thrust into reverse (like the Viggin). So part of the turn-around for the aircraft in those scenarios is to have the ground crew reset the hook while the pilot goes and takes five minutes to get a snack.

Cool. The video said “emergency” landing. I figured that was the use case for these. I guess the “emergency” is a short runway

[draconus]

14 hours ago, SkateZilla said:

Model is there, the system (land based system) isnt.
There's other cable systems modelled on other maps, thats not new.

For the 3rd time - I know it's just a 3D model. Where can we find it elsewhere?

11 hours ago, SharpeXB said:

The nature of combat damage in the sim is that you’re just completely destroyed nearly all the time. You wouldn’t get the chance to bring in a damaged jet.

Not true. Play more, less forum.

Edited March 26 by draconus

[SharpeXB]

5 hours ago, draconus said:

Not true. Play more, less forum.

Sorta off topic but… I’m not necessarily saying this is incorrect, a modern jet fighter is by design not too survivable. It’s a fuel tank wrapped around a jet engine. Plus you’re usually getting hit in the game by a missile warhead. The state of the systems modeling certainly varies by module and their state of completion. But the bottom line is landing a damaged jet is something that will very rarely happen in DCS. I understand though that’s not the only use case for this system.

Edited March 26 by SharpeXB

[Shrike88]

Honestly to the root cause this still would be an awesome feature, however we still need to get to the point of simulating realistic and complex failures on most of these modules.  Something to where we actually need to run procedures and nurse the aircraft back to an airfield.  Now this is all excluding the A-10 as I am sure most are aware it has some of more in-depth level of systems failures programmed that can lead to more complex situations and configurations.  I have not experimented with the F-14.  However the F-16 and other modules in DCS do not still possess this level of Hyd failure / brake failure etc.  So far until we achieve this the Hook for that reason is probably low priority.  Still seems the Viper is relegated to the same small handful of failures or situations.  None are really out of the ordinary. 

I can hopefully send a community appeal to some of the more skilled and sharp outside the box thinking community members well versed in DCS LUA that might be able to create a more canned modular mod that can be placed in the mods/tech and run using the viper and other aircraft with a hook.  Can be activated using something similar to identifying the positions on the ground where the arrestor cables are on the map x/y/z and to check to see if the hook is down or not and just simulate it by a deceleration.  All still probably of which is not possible as ED locks most of their code.  

Perhaps UBOATS or someone might have a better idea as a work around.

Alas.  One can hope

 

[buceador]

On 3/25/2024 at 10:41 PM, SkateZilla said:

There's other cable systems modelled on other maps, thats not new.

Which runways /airports have arresting cables modeled please?

[2alpha-down0]

On 3/26/2024 at 8:15 AM, SharpeXB said:

Sorta off topic but… I’m not necessarily saying this is incorrect, a modern jet fighter is by design not too survivable. It’s a fuel tank wrapped around a jet engine. Plus you’re usually getting hit in the game by a missile warhead. The state of the systems modeling certainly varies by module and their state of completion. But the bottom line is landing a damaged jet is something that will very rarely happen in DCS. I understand though that’s not the only use case for this system.

 

Almost every one of our missions, someone RTBs with combat damage.  I don't know how many times I've brought in a damaged Sabre with no brakes or hydraulics.

I understand why it's a low priority, but it would definitely see use in DCS.

Edited March 27 by 2alpha-down0

[Roosterfeet]

Also, some of the third party campaign designers like to include scripted failures and emergency procedures in their campaigns.

[SharpeXB]

18 minutes ago, 2alpha-down0 said:

Almost every one of our missions, someone RTBs with combat damage.  I don't know how many times I've brought in a damaged Sabre with no brakes or hydraulics.

I understand why it's a low priority, but it would definitely see use in DCS.

 

A Saber. Sure. Again you probably aren’t getting hit by missiles. WWII aircraft you get to land damaged all the time. Really that’s the best fun you can have in a flight sim. But getting to do that in 4th gen jets is exceedingly rare. Plus you have an ejection seat so odds are you’d just eject vs trying to land with damage. I would guess the hook is for system failures like hydraulics when you have no flaps or brakes. It’s also used for rejected takeoffs. I’m not really against the feature since again I’m all up for emergency landings. But I can see why this would be a low priority. 

2 minutes ago, Roosterfeet said:

Also, some of the third party campaign designers like to include scripted failures and emergency procedures in their campaigns.

Oh yeah. I did the Maple Flag A-10 course which takes you through all that. It’s great. The Hog is definitely a plane you can get the chance to bring home all full of holes. 

[upyr1]

1 hour ago, Roosterfeet said:

Also, some of the third party campaign designers like to include scripted failures and emergency procedures in their campaigns.

In the real world things fail. When we get a dynamic campaign I would hope to have failures as an option. I am not sure the if we could realistically model meantime between failures but we can currently script them.

Edited March 27 by upyr1

[bies]

Yes. This would be usefull and realistic. In fact breaks malfunction was always a real risk, an often failure.

That's the reason USAF have sarcificed some mass and drag only to have this hook on their high performance fighters.

[upyr1]

1 hour ago, SharpeXB said:

A Saber. Sure. Again you probably aren’t getting hit by missiles. WWII aircraft you get to land damaged all the time. Really that’s the best fun you can have in a flight sim. But getting to do that in 4th gen jets is exceedingly rare. Plus you have an ejection seat so odds are you’d just eject vs trying to land with damage. I would guess the hook is for system failures like hydraulics when you have no flaps or brakes. It’s also used for rejected takeoffs. I’m not really against the feature since again I’m all up for emergency landings. But I can see why this would be a low priority. 

Oh yeah. I did the Maple Flag A-10 course which takes you through all that. It’s great. The Hog is definitely a plane you can get the chance to bring home all full of holes. 

Battle damage is not the only reason a system will fail. I have seen photos of sadly shot up Phantoms.