ANNOUNCEMENT - DCS: MiG-21bis

[danilop]

They (Leatherneck Simulation) are fresh business, as stated. Let them fight their business and legal battles. Good luck! :D

 

We as a consumers really don't need to know this inner stuff and all the legal hurdles which face every business out there.

 

Having said that, backer's money and its whereabouts is very important issue of great public importance.

 

Beczl Studio should issue a statement ASAP regarding money. It is nice that guys who continue the MiG21bis project will honor the original backers, but that doesn't answer the main question: 'What happened to the money?"

 

This is moral thing to do. The good will and trust of the community is at stake, if you wish. Beczl studio is still part of our small flight simulator community, right? Whatever happened between you and the new MiG21 team doesn't have anything to do with ordinary guys who enthusiastically supported the project.

 

So, if someone from Beczl Studio reads this, please respond (here or wherever else you want) and give a statement what happened to indiegogo $15,000. People who backed the project up, have right to know.

[NineLine]

382 backers have 15144 USD to loose.

 

We'll see what time will bring after due diligence inquiries.

 

You are getting what you paid for. Read the announcement.

 

It would be Leatherneck that would be taking a lose if that were the case, and would be their fight, which isnt up for discussion here anyways.

[159th_Viper]

382 backers have 15144 USD to loose...

 

Have you read the announcement?

 

I'm not the only one who gets it:

 

You are getting what you paid for.

 

It's not that difficult. If you are having difficulty with the concept of you having suffered no loss then admittedly I'm at a loss for words.

[BRooDJeRo]

So when the money is Paypal-frozen with interest for the wrong reasons, isn't there a way to convince this is the real thing? I'm sure i saw cases where a deal in interest can be made.

One partner is also part of this new team. The new team says it will be a part or already is part of a company. Doesn't that mean hope to get $15000 back where it needs to be?

[ObvilionLost]

Which isnt a question for here.

 

I should probably just shut up and wait for Mig-21 :D It was hard enough to avoid speculation about Mig-21 before when videos went private and forum was gone. Don't get me wrong I am glad that issues were resolved and we will get Mig-21.

[mig29movt]

There's no need to reclaim anything. First, LS stated that they will give access to the plane for the original backers, and also from what I've read here is that the money from the campaign was used in the development of the module, nobody took money and ran away. And you will still get the plane :)

 

No, I mean't that I would waive all this (T-Shirt, DVD...), if that would bring the Devs any benefit and buy the MiG "again"

[LosT_SouL_VL]

You are getting what you paid for. Read the announcement.

 

 

Have you read the announcement?

 

I'm not the only one who gets it:

 

It's not that difficult. If you are having difficulty with the concept of you having suffered no loss then admittedly I'm at a loss for words.

 

 

 

 

There"s nothing for sure: words can be broken, announcements and faqs can be changed or partially/fully deleted.

 

Isn't here the ED style/bottom line that everything is subject to change?

 

 

But I thinks it's a honest question to ask for a post-mortem concerning expenses and use of these funds is in it's place knowing we talking about 15144 USD and 382 funders...

 

In other words what happened with the backers money?

Edited February 27, 2014 by LosT_SouL_VL

[NineLine]

There"s nothing for sure: words can be broken, announcements and faqs can be changed or partially/fully deleted.

 

Isn't here the ED style that everything is subject to change?

 

 

But I thinks it's a honest question to ask for a post-mortem concerning expenses and use of these funds is in it's place to ask and to get knowing we talking about 15144 USD and 382 funders...

 

in other words what happened with the backers money?

 

The question was answered in the Announcement. Once more, it doesnt need to be discussed here.

[Paradox]

All that money was probably already spent before Beczl decided to leave.

 

It's ok that he did and the project is still on track

 

What's the problem here? You're still getting what you paid for and everyone else has the opportunity to buy it on release.

[159th_Viper]

There"s nothing for sure:

 

Yes, exactly. If the Mig-21 does not come to be, THEN AND ONLY THEN will the matter potentially be actionable. Most certainly NOT now lol.

 

 

in other words what happened with the backers money?

 

You paid your money for Product X.

 

Guess what?

 

You are getting Product X.

 

Deal with it and quit the Witchhunt ;)

[mig29movt]

:music_whistling:

Lots of mods online now :)

And most of the team: THANKS a lot for your effort so far!

Been waiting since the A-10C for something fast. Having a russian fast-mover is awesome!

Big thanks to the whole team! :thumbup:

[Raven68]

All that money was probably already spent before Beczl decided to leave.

 

It's ok that he did and the project is still on track

 

What's the problem here? You're still getting what you paid for and everyone else has the opportunity to buy it on release.

 

I Agree!! I backed and still might buy another copy to support this team. If you backed and the internal matters were resolved to where all parties are satisfied and you are still getting what you expected (Mig-21Bis) then its a none issue.

[outlawal2]

What part of the fact that it is nobody's business but there's do folks not get? The ONLY legitimate concern we have as buyers is whether they live up to their part of the deal and they said they are going to do so. As far as whether the money was used for MIG-21 development or not is not relevant. As a COMPANY you obtain funds and spend them where necessary... (ANY use of the funds to keep the company going is related to the development of the module becasue if you don't pay your friggin bills you can't write code.) What probably happened here is that the two entities decided to part ways and how do you do that amicably? One has to buyout the other. So if Beczl setup the crowd-sourcing setup and has the funds in hand anyway, it is very conceivable that Leatherneck decided to let him keep those funds in exchange for the continuing rights to the MIG-21 module and that Beczl would be removed from the project. Also, as part of that it is very possible that they added a rider that ensures that he not speak of this situation at all so he would be bound by that gag order if he wants to keep the money and walk away. (Which would explain why he has not said anything.)

 

ABSOUTELY NONE of this is our business and as long as Leathernecks make good on the funds they collected there is no basis for "legal" action or any other ridiculous crap that has been posted on this board. Leathernecks are not taking legal action so that alone should prove to everyone that there is no case or REASON to...

 

Everyone SHUT UP and let this go for God's sake..

[SwiftRaid]

what is the expected price of the module going to be? (in USD)

[Mike Busutil]

Thanks Cobra! Now let's see some new screenshots!!!! :D

[GGTharos]

I'll put it this way: Ask elsewhere. We won't be entertaining any more of that question here. We won't be entertaining criticism/debate/questions as to not entertaining this question here, either.

 

Edit: What danvac said, and with that, any further posts on the issue with be deleted.

[outlawal2]

Or we can put it like this:

 

Person Y went public and asked support for Product X.

 

300 or so (Spartans!? :D) backed up the project because of previous free work of Person Y.

 

The campaign went well. Now, Person Y is on 50:50 deal with Person From Shadow, Mister Z who does the hard work. They hire more important Persons to finish the Demanding Project.

 

Persons started to argue, and the Person Y go public and announce the death of project (mind you, Person Y promised in this statement that every cent will be returned to backers ;))

 

The other Persons are stunned by the statement and they don't want to waste several years of their life in such a way. They form Business Entity L which continues Project X. They say that money from Spartans never reached them.

 

So, don't you think that Person Y has at least moral responsibility to answer the simple question:

 

"Where's the money?" :)

 

NOPE.. Because NONE of this should have been released to us in the first place... We should not know any of this information.. Not the original scrwed up email and not the fact that the crowd sourcing funds were or weren't used. None of this should have been communicated. And regardless, how the company decides to use it's own funds is their business.. If you or anyone else has issue with that then they should not support via crowdsourcing. Throwing your money at a project does not give you any oversite rights whatsoever.. (If you want that, then save your pennies and fund the entire project the old fashined way) If you choose crowd sourcing then you take on a certain amount of risk and you have no oversite of any kind..

[outlawal2]

I'll put it this way: Ask elsewhere. We won't be entertaining any more of that question here. We won't be entertaining criticism/debate/questions as to not entertaining this question here, either.

 

Edit: What danvac said, and with that, any further posts on the issue with be deleted.

 

 

Good..

[Home Fries]

I'm a retired U.S. Marine vet. 'nough said. :pilotfly:

Semper Fi, Rudel. Though with that name, I would figure a Ju-87 in the future. :D

[danilop]

NOPE.. Because NONE of this should have been released to us in the first place... We should not know any of this information.. Not the original scrwed up email and not the fact that the crowd sourcing funds were or weren't used. None of this should have been communicated. And regardless, how the company decides to use it's own funds is their business.. If you or anyone else has issue with that then they should not support via crowdsourcing. Throwing your money at a project does not give you any oversite rights whatsoever.. (If you want that, then save your pennies and fund the entire project the old fashined way) If you choose crowd sourcing then you take on a certain amount of risk and you have no oversite of any kind..

 

Wrong.

 

You forget one thing - it's not about the project and legal stuff only, it's about the mutual trust and relation small developer - community as well.

 

Trust is not something which you build upon with legal mumbo-jumbo. ;)

Edited February 27, 2014 by danilop

[4c Hajduk Veljko]

And regardless, how the company decides to use it's own funds is their business..

No company can use my, yours or its own money in unlawful way. That's the point with Beczl situation.

[outlawal2]

No company can use my, yours or its own money in unlawful way. That's the point with Beczl situation.

 

And your proof of unlawful use? You guys really need to give it a rest as you have ZERO facts on what happened..

 

WALK AWAY

[159th_Viper]

No company can use my, yours or its own money in unlawful way. That's the point with Beczl situation.

 

:megalol:

 

Beczl Studios = Dolphin = Leatherneck Simulations

 

Can you now begin to grasp why your, and others' senseless, litigious drivel has to stop? If not out of respect for Beczl, Dolphin AND Leatherneck, for ours, please.

 

Can you see?

Edited February 27, 2014 by 159th_Viper
Typo

[wasyl00]

All this Stuff is not our problem. It's commercial project and these things happen. Sadly all went public.

But I'm sure the sour taste disappear once we start Migs engine!

[NoJoe]

I'm just glad that we'll get the MiG, whenever that happens. Definitely looking forward to getting shot down repeatedly in it as I try to learn to fly and fight in the thing! :D