Jump to content

Dynamic Campaign Engine


MBot

Recommended Posts

The program will not be compiled, so everyone can modify the code for private use. I haven't yet thought about how to handle public modifications. Let's get something out in the first place :)

 

For whatever it's worth, I would be very interested in contributing here too. I've been mulling over a similar approach to dynamic campaign stuff in DCSW, but never had the energy to actually start coding (I write software for work, so, finding the energy to code for fun can be a challenge).

 

As far as hosting, what about github/bitbucket?

 

In any case, as both a dev and a DCS user I am looking forward to seeing what evolves here!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sounds fantastic! This is what DCS needs so badly right now.

 

Just one note; you mentioned that the moving ground war is like making a strategy game, but in reality it isn't. At least the all-important first step isn't.

 

Let's take for example the Il-2 DCG. It simply has a list of units it spawns at the ends of a simple node-route track that is usually a simple line with maybe a few intersections. A bit like this: o-o-o-o=8=o-o-o. When a unit is destroyed it's placed back into the pool and beore each mission there's a random chance it will respawn at one end of the node-route network. During each mission the units move towards the opponent's end (unless there's still some abstract infantry strength left in the current node). And that's pretty much it.

 

Sounds deceptively simple, right? Something you'd program in a few moments? Well yes, because it's probably true. Most importantly, though, it works very well, providing thousands of hours of fun for our group since years ago. Of course there's a lot of room for improvement, but the DCG system is a very good starting point. And despite being so damned simple, it really really does work even though you probably wouldn't believe it just reading the description.

 

I'm not saying you need to do the ground war thing right now or even that you need to do it like the Il-2 DCG does. My point is that when you do start thinking about the ground war it's vital to not try to reach too high to begin with, it's the best way to burn yourself out and make sure the project dies. A very very simple system can work and provide lots of room to grow - and that growing is much more fun and painless when you have already kind of reached the goal and the campaign engine does what it's supposed to. After that it should be much easier on your sanity to set yourself ambitious long term goals, because you can just build on the already working system bit by bit.

 

I've seen too many of these projects and especially the wonderful people behind them burn out because of too ambitious initial goals. Ideally you'll one day notice that you've done a couple of games' worth work, but it all just kind of happened and you had fun all along by continuously reaching some rewarding mini-goals.

 

Anyway best of luck with your effort, a good dynamic campaign (engine) is the best thing that could possibly happen to DCS.

  • Like 1

My blog full of incoherent ramblings on random subjects: https://anttiilomaki.wordpress.com/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I guess what is still needed is for the warehouse system to be finished off so that units don't need to dry out. Up to four players is kindda on the low side, using DAWS (Chromium +1'd your reply already) I can get 3x that playing over multiple sorties in a persistent world at the last check was 28 hours long with layered spawning and unshceduled restarts. Only thing I needed to reboot for was the memory leak (and I guess something like runway rubish/AI taxi messups).

 

I guess this is yet another approach to doing it I hadn't considered, it's still great and definitely fills a particular need.

 

The scope of DCE is for singleplayer and up to 4 player coop (one flight) with a single sortie flown per mission instance. So after you return from your sortie and land, you are supposed to end the mission. DCE will then evaluate the reults and prepare the next mission (file) with your next sortie. The ATO will be filled with sorties for the AI to fly that last for the expected duration of your own sortie plus some extra time (so you still see airraft take off when you RTB). If you keep running the mission beyond that, the world will eventually dry out. So this will not be suited for 24/7 servers.

 

 

 

 

I hope that if ED has any concret plans for a dynamic campaign, it would be a more ambitious persistent world approach (Falcon) :)

___________________________________________________________________________

SIMPLE SCENERY SAVING * SIMPLE GROUP SAVING * SIMPLE STATIC SAVING *

Link to comment
Share on other sites

DCE is a dynamic campaign engine, DAWS will only allow you to save the sortie that you have to continously build and check from mission to mission. It's a tool.

 

This is MUCH more interesting and complex then DAWS, but they have different objective with different features: MBot creates campaigns, I try to put together some useful instrument for the mission designers. Consider that some key elements of the DAWS work had been made with the help of many professional, including MBot :)

 

I'm really looking forward to this work :)

ChromiumDis.png

Author of DSMC, mod to enable scenario persistency and save updated miz file

Stable version & site: https://dsmcfordcs.wordpress.com/

Openbeta: https://github.com/Chromium18/DSMC

 

The thing is, helicopters are different from planes. An airplane by it's nature wants to fly, and if not interfered with too strongly by unusual events or by a deliberately incompetent pilot, it will fly. A helicopter does not want to fly. It is maintained in the air by a variety of forces in opposition to each other, and if there is any disturbance in this delicate balance the helicopter stops flying; immediately and disastrously.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm really looking forward to this work :)

 

+1!!! :pilotfly:

Justificus

 

System Specs:

i7 4970K @ 4.8, GTX 1080 SC, 32GB G.Skill DDR 2133,Thermaltake Level 10 Full Tower Case, Noctua NH-D15 6 Cooler, Win 10 Pro, Warthog, CH Pro Pedals, CH Throttle Quadrant, Oculus, 1 32" & 2 19" Monitors

 

 

 

Modules Owned: A-10C I+II, Ka-50, FC3, F-86, Mig-15, Mig21, UH-1H, Mi-8, CA, P-51D, BF-109K-4, FW-190 D-9, Hawk, NTTR, M-2000C, SA342, F-5E, Spit Mk. IX, AJS-37, Normandy, WWII A.P., AV-8B, F/A-18C, L-39, Persian Gulf, Mig-19P, I-16, Super Carrier, F-16, Channel, Syria

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sounds fantastic! This is what DCS needs so badly right now.

 

Just one note; you mentioned that the moving ground war is like making a strategy game, but in reality it isn't. At least the all-important first step isn't.

 

Let's take for example the Il-2 DCG. It simply has a list of units it spawns at the ends of a simple node-route track that is usually a simple line with maybe a few intersections. A bit like this: o-o-o-o=8=o-o-o. When a unit is destroyed it's placed back into the pool and beore each mission there's a random chance it will respawn at one end of the node-route network. During each mission the units move towards the opponent's end (unless there's still some abstract infantry strength left in the current node). And that's pretty much it.

 

Sounds deceptively simple, right? Something you'd program in a few moments? Well yes, because it's probably true. Most importantly, though, it works very well, providing thousands of hours of fun for our group since years ago. Of course there's a lot of room for improvement, but the DCG system is a very good starting point. And despite being so damned simple, it really really does work even though you probably wouldn't believe it just reading the description.

 

I'm not saying you need to do the ground war thing right now or even that you need to do it like the Il-2 DCG does. My point is that when you do start thinking about the ground war it's vital to not try to reach too high to begin with, it's the best way to burn yourself out and make sure the project dies. A very very simple system can work and provide lots of room to grow - and that growing is much more fun and painless when you have already kind of reached the goal and the campaign engine does what it's supposed to. After that it should be much easier on your sanity to set yourself ambitious long term goals, because you can just build on the already working system bit by bit.

 

I've seen too many of these projects and especially the wonderful people behind them burn out because of too ambitious initial goals. Ideally you'll one day notice that you've done a couple of games' worth work, but it all just kind of happened and you had fun all along by continuously reaching some rewarding mini-goals.

 

Anyway best of luck with your effort, a good dynamic campaign (engine) is the best thing that could possibly happen to DCS.

 

+1 what this old men says :thumbup:

Oculus CV1, Odyssey, Pimax 5k+ (i5 8400, 24gb ddr4 3000mhz, 1080Ti OC )

 

 

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just some small bits and pieces I have been working:

 

attachment.php?attachmentid=129198&stc=1&d=1449096635

 

The ATO can meanwhile handle routes for all tasks in DCS. This includes distributing available assets to cover CAP, AWACS and refueling stations for the mission duration.

 

 

attachment.php?attachmentid=129197&stc=1&d=1449096635

 

This is some work on routes for multiple flights within a package main body. For example for a squadron sized strike, but also for bombers (each heavy bomber in DCS has it's own flight). As you can see, flights are making tactical turns to switch sides when the change of heading is large. I am currently working on WP ETAs for flights in order to keep a package formation, which is kind of tricky.

Screen_151202_231555.thumb.jpg.494a340a375333c37752958e0b5839bd.jpg

Screen_151202_231706.thumb.jpg.764328a646e2a8a2ed7792b3b5d8167f.jpg

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree also.

 

Inviato dal mio SM-G850F utilizzando Tapatalk

ChromiumDis.png

Author of DSMC, mod to enable scenario persistency and save updated miz file

Stable version & site: https://dsmcfordcs.wordpress.com/

Openbeta: https://github.com/Chromium18/DSMC

 

The thing is, helicopters are different from planes. An airplane by it's nature wants to fly, and if not interfered with too strongly by unusual events or by a deliberately incompetent pilot, it will fly. A helicopter does not want to fly. It is maintained in the air by a variety of forces in opposition to each other, and if there is any disturbance in this delicate balance the helicopter stops flying; immediately and disastrously.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not for donations... or else?

 

Inviato dal mio SM-G850F utilizzando Tapatalk

ChromiumDis.png

Author of DSMC, mod to enable scenario persistency and save updated miz file

Stable version & site: https://dsmcfordcs.wordpress.com/

Openbeta: https://github.com/Chromium18/DSMC

 

The thing is, helicopters are different from planes. An airplane by it's nature wants to fly, and if not interfered with too strongly by unusual events or by a deliberately incompetent pilot, it will fly. A helicopter does not want to fly. It is maintained in the air by a variety of forces in opposition to each other, and if there is any disturbance in this delicate balance the helicopter stops flying; immediately and disastrously.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nothing stops you from offering him a module ;)

 

There's a huge difference in expectation between a freeware and a payware.

Just have a look at the mod section.

When you provide something for free you enjoy almost endless patience and understanding from the end user.

As soon as you start to put a pricetag on your work, it's an open door for complaints, pressure, being held accountable for this and that, etc

 

Maybe Mbot just don't want to deal with that.

 

That being said, it would be a day 1 buy for me.

:D


Edited by Eight Ball
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I can totally understand if MBot don't like donation/payment. Because this creates pressure.

 

But I since all the 'logic' is implemented in .lua files, we can copy/modify it if MBot has not the time for maintenance. I saw a lot of nice projects failing because the source was not available and the main contributor 'left' to somewhere else...

 

Heads up, this project sounds really interesting!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Mbot, I am a coder by trade,

 

If this was ever to make it into a github project once the foundation is made, I would consider contributing, and helping with pull requests etc when I get time.

 

No pressure in that regard, just a suggestion . What you are doing and already have completed is pretty amazing and everyone is looking forward to it.

V.O.D.K.A. Squadron: Northern Wolves - Red ones go faster!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...