No more above 12G turns

[GGTharos]

Do you have parameters at which this breakage is happening?

 

GW/Altitude/Speed/G

 

I'm letting Sukhoi down drastically, defensive breaks' turn into defensive broken.

It is going to take some practice getting these panic moments in order, the lack of physical G makes it really tough to gauge how much you're pulling. The S button and brake button are not even needed for this capitulation.

 

Also i've heard that what is missing in DCS is that in the real flanker there is a system that limits stick movement and warns pilot of approaching limits by vibrating the stick at 8Hz.

[Esac_mirmidon]

The real Su-27 stick not only shakes but also gets stiffer when you pull near the AoA-G limit so the pilot must "fight" physically the stick with an extra effort to move the stick near the limit.

 

If the pilot tries to pass the limit the stick bounds in the opposite direction to the center preventing to pull to much.

[Frostie]

Do you have parameters at which this breakage is happening?

 

GW/Altitude/Speed/G

 

Not off hand but I know I am too heavy and too fast, it is just the effect of being in a hectic war server like the 373, landing at the front, refuelling, taking off and getting engaged from all directions. At the moment of surprise the ingrained instinct is to pull hard to defend, dealing with being heavy and fast in this situation is so hard without any feedback.

Normally i'd refuel to 100% but recently i've limited to 70 I may need to reduce this even more.

[TAW_Blaze]

This is especially true, for me, as i fly the Mirage. OHHHH BOY DO THOSE EAGLES DROP LIKE FLIES, going up against a delta wing fighter, like the Mirage. Before they patched the turning on the Mirage i would out turn so many people, it was hilarious.

 

I remember the first time I merged a Mirage and thought it was gonna be easy. About 10 seconds later I went pure WTF. It flew circles around me :megalol:

[Stuge]

Mirage doesn't fly circles anymore.. just had a testing sessions in Nevada (2.0) and it has definitely lost a significant amount of mojo. At full fuel the thing probably can't keep up at all with flankers or eagles... and once you go below 200 kts... it's a real energy sink now :)

[OldE24]

ok i cant play the game right now but i heard reports that if you reset trim you can pull more G's can someone test this out?

[DarkFire]

ok i cant play the game right now but i heard reports that if you reset trim you can pull more G's can someone test this out?

 

The Su-27 doesn't have a trim reset function. Resetting trim might have had some effect in (very) old versions of the game - by that I'm thinking LOMAC or FC1 - but not any more.

[GGTharos]

Got it.

 

Yep, get similar in the eagle except rather than the wings coming off, you just get the helpless flailing leaf treatment :)

 

Anyway, I asked because complaints aside, there is always the possibility of finding a bug.

 

Not off hand but I know I am too heavy and too fast, it is just the effect of being in a hectic war server like the 373, landing at the front, refuelling, taking off and getting engaged from all directions. At the moment of surprise the ingrained instinct is to pull hard to defend, dealing with being heavy and fast in this situation is so hard without any feedback.

Normally i'd refuel to 100% but recently i've limited to 70 I may need to reduce this even more.

[Frostie]

The Su-27 doesn't have a trim reset function. Resetting trim might have had some effect in (very) old versions of the game - by that I'm thinking LOMAC or FC1 - but not any more.

 

Yes there is trim reset, do this before the merge. :)

[karambiatos]

Got it.

 

Yep, get similar in the eagle except rather than the wings coming off, you just get the helpless flailing leaf treatment :)

 

Anyway, I asked because complaints aside, there is always the possibility of finding a bug.

 

There may be a bug, because it's always the right wing that snaps off, so either one wing is too weak, or the other is too strong or it's a matter of how much pressure is applied to the wings.

[DarkFire]

Yes there is trim reset, do this before the merge. :)

 

Is there??!!!? As in ctrl-T? Damn, I thought that had been removed!! And here I've been raging for hours at various times against asymetric trim issues caused by nudging the stick in ACS mode, when I could have solved the problem!

 

Are you sure there's a trim reset control?

[*Rage*]

^Yep

 

Use it all the time:)

[DarkFire]

^Yep

 

Use it all the time:)

 

Just tested it and... I have a new favourite control! :joystick:

[JunMcKill]

I'm letting Sukhoi down drastically, defensive breaks' turn into defensive broken.

It is going to take some practice getting these panic moments in order, the lack of physical G makes it really tough to gauge how much you're pulling. The S button and brake button are not even needed for this capitulation.

 

Also i've heard that what is missing in DCS is that in the real flanker there is a system that limits stick movement and warns pilot of approaching limits by vibrating the stick at 8Hz.

 

Hope ED simulate the stick shake I have a G940! :pilotfly:

[DarkFire]

^Yep

 

Use it all the time:)

 

The trim reset only appears to operate on the pitch channel, not roll or yaw. Anyone know if this is working as intended or a bug? I can compensate for pitch trim & alter it pretty quickly, but small asymmetric roll trim drives me crazy & I can't seem to zero it out. It'd be really, really nice if the trim reset worked on all 3 channels...

[karambiatos]

It does work on all channels, but there's a bug, that i'm not sure has been reported, but the trim doesn't reset correctly for the roll channel

If you trim your stick so you induce a right roll, and then trim reset, the trim will reset, but it will keep rolling slightly to the right, and vice versa.

[DarkFire]

It does work on all channels, but there's a bug, that i'm not sure has been reported, but the trim doesn't reset correctly for the roll channel

If you trim your stick so you induce a right roll, and then trim reset, the trim will reset, but it will keep rolling slightly to the right, and vice versa.

 

Ah, that'll be it then. Thanks for the clarification :thumbup: hopefully this bug will be squashed at some point...

[Svend_Dellepude]

It could be an aerodynamic issue on the airframe.

Could be the cannon being more draggy and thus inducing a slight right roll. Dunno to what degree the FM has been simulated.

IRL things are not as perfectly alligned as our digital desktop joysticks.

[holimoli]

It does work on all channels, but there's a bug, that i'm not sure has been reported, but the trim doesn't reset correctly for the roll channel

If you trim your stick so you induce a right roll, and then trim reset, the trim will reset, but it will keep rolling slightly to the right, and vice versa.

 

Are u sure ? I don't have this.

 

edit: did u try to hold down the trim reset for 1-2 sec?

Edited May 11, 2016 by holimoli

[Panthir]

Dear friends,

 

I would like to say some words as well. Instead of a sudden destruction of the airframe, if the wished to simulate an instant G limits violation (structural limits), it would be better to do it, initially, via other ways (e.g fuel leaks, HYD problems, changes in aerodynamic behaviour, unintentional assymetrical jetison of external stores etc). Such kind of problems you may have to face in real life as well. Such kind of problems will force you to stop fighting and lead you to land to repair.

 

It seems to be more realistic in such a case, as far as, I have to remind you that we are flying a sim. We don't feel the G's. We just pull back the stick, very easily, while sitting on a chair in front of a PC.

 

On the other hand, sustain Gs IMO are already simulated realistically via a gradual black out and loss of conciousness.

[karambiatos]

Are u sure ? I don't have this.

 

edit: did u try to hold down the trim reset for 1-2 sec?

Yep, it happens every time i trim reset, it doesn't matter if hold the button or not. The ctrl+Enter that pops the little window, shows the joystick circle slightly to the left or to the right, if i unplug the joystick, nothing changes, so it's not the joystick.

The roll however is very slight, so it might not be noticeable, but it's definitely there.

[holimoli]

Yep, it happens every time i trim reset, it doesn't matter if hold the button or not. The ctrl+Enter that pops the little window, shows the joystick circle slightly to the left or to the right, if i unplug the joystick, nothing changes, so it's not the joystick.

The roll however is very slight, so it might not be noticeable, but it's definitely there.

 

oh, yes u a right it's there..just tried it! Sry!...I remember now that I noticed this before. I don't pay so much attention to this because most of the time I fired a missile already and I'm trimming the aircraft all the time anyway :D...

[Frostie]

Looking forward to what ED is going to do about the wing breaking business, I can't accept that there is no safety system in place, word has it there is a pretty smart system that deals with it regarding weight etc.

 

Right now it is all down to the pilot between wings on and wings off, i'm sure if this was the case Flankers would be breaking some wings in the real world.

[Sierra99]

Anyway, I like the realism in DCS, doesn't matter if the plane capabilities are now reduced in game, and should be applied to all aircrafts.

 

See this is confusing to me. Everyone wants "realistic" ... But not when it restricts their aircraft. And if it restricts their aircraft...they want all other aircraft restricted as well so they can maintain their advantage...

 

Have I missed anything?

 

It sound to me like the change prevents unrealistic maneuvering by Su-27 something that's apparently been broken for some time. Why is it suddenly assumed the F-15 flight model is inaccurate?

 

 

Sierra

[probad]

i have had no problems with the new flanker and i have seen many regular flanker pilots excel as well.

 

the people i see breaking their wings are always the same people.

you can force the eagle to break its wings out of spite all you want but it's not going to make you less of a bad flanker pilot who can't moderate his control inputs.

Edited May 11, 2016 by probad